FlyMentor vs something like Bavarian Deamon 3x

[actionscript]

What is the difference between these two systems? Will the Bavarian also auto stabilize if you take you fingers off the cyclic?

I am looking for something that will put the helicopter into a hover if I lose my sense of orientation and panic.

[Inverse]

The flymentor is pretty old, clunky tech now.

[nightflyr]

You are attempting to compare 2 platforms that are worlds apart ...

KDS Flymentor 3D Auto Stabilizer

KDS-Acc-KDSFlymentor3D





Automatically Hovering in a Fixed Position - KDS Flymentor 3D Stabilizing System
The KDS Flymentor 3D contain 3 components, the Flymentor Mixer, a CCD Camera and a 3-Axis Gyro. The system act as a Auto Pilot, it will only steps in when you don't give any input, but once you move your hands on the control sticks again, the system will de-activate and let you take charge again, pretty amazing, isn't it? Just like a real Auto Pilot when you need a break. The system provides 2 main features, Stabilizing Mode and Positioning Mode.

What is Stabilizing Mode?
Under this mode, there will be solid red and green light on the Flymentor Mixer, the CCD will not be working, only the 3-Axis Gyro is working. When you play the helicopter outdoor, there is wind, right? When wind pass thru the helicopter, it will push the helicopter and making it up side down, you will need to adjust the control sticks constantly to prevent this from happening. By using the Flymentor, it will automatically correct the cyclic servos and keeps the helicopter always in horizontal mode. Thanks to the 3-Axis gyro, it can work all around 360 degree correction.




What is Positioning Mode?
In this mode, there will be solid green light on the Flymentor Mixer, the CCD Camera and the 3-Axis Gyro are both working. The CCD Camera will constantly taking pictures of the ground, and compare each frame, to see if the helicopter is drifting, then it tells the Flymentor Mixer to give correction to all cyclic servos. Resulting the helicopter will stay in a Fixed position. The concept is basically an Eye watching the ground and make adjustment, kinda like a real human. But note that the system is not hooked up with the throttle, the attitude of the helicopter is still in your control.


Installation Example - KDS Flymentor 3D on a Storm 450 Glass Fiber Version






Video Demonstration on Storm 450
Just move the Throttle to hovering point, and the helicopter will stay in a fixed position



About the Flymentor Mixer
This mixer is the brain of the whole system, it receives signal from the CCD Camera and the 3-Axis Gyro, then it commands all servos(Cyclic and Rudder Servos) to do the job. It can be placed anywhere, just far from vibration and heat.

About the CCD Camera
Used for "Positioning Mode". The CCD Camera should be mounted underneath the main shaft or on the side frame of the helicopter, with the lens pointing at the ground and free from vibration, it works best in the attitude of 1m to 3m. The CCD Camera's job is to take image of the ground, then to provide a signal to the Flymentor Mixer, and gives the correction to the cyclic servos. To have best result, make sure that there are enough "Light" and "Something" on the ground surface, like grass and gravels, because the Camera can't see very well in dim condition and it can't recognize flat snow or flat sand, it requires "Something" to see, it will not work in dim condition or low contrast color surface.

About the 3-Axis Gyro
Basically, they combine three gyros and place them on X, Y and Z axis, so it sense 3D movements now instead of rudder movement only. This gyro also contain some Temperature sensor and some other sensors too. Also, needs to isolate it from vibrate and heat.


How to install the KDS Flymentor 3D Stabilizing System?
Connect the Flymentor Mixer to the Receiver as first picture, then turn on the transmitter and choose "Swashplate Type" to 1-Servo, meaning you don't use the CCPM from your transmitter no more, you will be using the Flymentor Mixer to do the CCPM mixing, then switch off transmitter. Then connect Servos to Flymentor Mixer as second picture, and mount the CCD Camera as third picture and mount the Gyro as usual on to the helicopter, just make sure it is placed horizontally. After installing the hardware, then you install the software into the computer and use the USB cable to connect Flymentor Mixer to the computer to do the setup. From now on, all the Sub-Trims, Channel Reverse, Servo Travels.... almost everything needs be set up using the software, don't adjust the value on the transmitter anymore, except Gyro Sensitivity, it can still be adjusted thru the transmitter.


How to connect KDS Flymentor Mixer to the Receiver?





How to connect servos to the KDS Flymentor Mixer?





How to install the KDS Flymentor 3D CCD Camera on the helicopter?
To have best result, make sure that there are enough "Light" and "Something" on the ground surface, like grass and gravels, because the Camera can't see very well in dim condition and it can't recognize flat snow or flat sand, it requires "Something" to see, it will not work in dim condition or low contrast color surface.








Content of the KDS Flymentor 3D Stabilizing System






Specifications :
- Voltage: 4.8V - 6.0V
- Current: 55mA (under 5V)
- Temperature Range: 0℃ - 40℃
- Weight: 37g
- Support helicopters with 3S-120o swashplate, or 3S-140o swashplate, or 4S-90o swashplate, or 4S-90o + 45o swash plate


HeliPal.com Sends You Everything!
Do you know? Some online sellers on the market keep some items to make more profit
such as remote controller, Li-Po battery, battery charger or something’s you can't imagine.....
WE PROMISE THAT WE WILL SEND YOU EVERYTHING!

This package includes :
1. KDS Flymentor Mixer
2. KDS Flymentor CCD Camera
3. KDS Flymentor 3-Axis Gyro
4. CD with Installation Guide and Software

Suitable for :


Important Declaration - Read Before Purchase
Please note that, this system is NOT Suitable for totally fresh beginners or first time flyer, it is NOT a Flying Teacher and save your helicopter when you are about to crash, this system is not fast enough to rescue. It is strongly suggest that you have an experienced RC Helicopter player to guide you on the installation. The KDS Flymentor 3D is a piece of equipment that helps beginners to hover. The installation of the hardware is easy, but the setup will need some special knowledge in RC Helicopter, like "Reverse Channels", "Swashplate Mix".... so if you have Zero experience on working with the 6-Channel or CP helicopters, this system is NOT for you. On the other hand, if you have experience on setting up CCPM values and understood the RC Heli jargons, you can give it a try, this system is really a joy to play with.


Recommended Products (Optional)

Handheld Controller?




Product Status : In-Stock

3-axis flybarless system 3SX

• Exactly like 3X, plus: Unique Rescue and Horizon modes

FACTS & FEATURES:

• World’s only true Rescue modes

• Symmetric torque control

• Usable in all types of RC helicopters (including flybar machines)

• Supports all current servo and swashplate types as well as virtual swashplate rotation

• CNC-milled aluminum housing

• Various installation options, horizontal or vertical

• Intelligent setup wizard

• RealTime-Tuning for optimization of parameters in flight

• Online updatable

• Internal swashplate mixer

• Ultra-fast tail rotor gyro

MAP:

402,52 € excl. VAT

Scope of supply:

• Main sensor unit including mounting pads

• Cable loom for receiver connection (90mm)

• USB lead for direct connection to PC / Notebook

• Firmware update via web

PRODUCT DESCRIPTION:

The bavarianDEMON 3SX is a high-quality, exceptionally compact flybarless system for model helicopters.
 As a particular highlight for those who place particular value on the utmost security of their valuable RC helicopters the 3SX offers a rescue or horizon mode steered via an auxiliary channel. The rescue mode is - surprise, surprise - unique worldwide and enables the helicopter to shoot upwards via an automatic pitch action in addition to horizontal alignment.


The 3SX contains a high-quality silicon MEMS gyroscope from the newest generation on a gold-plated printed circuit board, a demoniacally fast integrated tail gyroscope and a symmetric torque control.
The bavarianDEMON 3SX is universally usable for demoniacally rough 3D flights as well as for large scale helicopters (two and multiple blade).
It is even suitable for beginners due to the optional connectible horizon mode.
 The 3SX patented horizontal stabilization system contains various modes which specifically and completely automatically quickly steer the helicopter back into a horizontal flight attitude from flight manoeuvres such as tic toc or piro flip - if the pilot would like this. The stabilization strength and the turning off and on of the horizontal mode can take place - via an auxiliary channel - directly from the transmitter.

The 3SX is usable in electric, nitro, combustion-powered and turbine-powered helicopters.
 It supports all current analogue, digital and brushless servos, including narrow pulse servos on the tailpiece as well as all current swashplate variants and virtual swashplate torsion.
 The bavarianDEMON 3SX comes to its new owner in this elegant, demonically coloured CNC-milled aluminium housing. Here it offers flexible installation options no matter whether horizontal or vertical.
Programming is conceivably simple thanks to a demoniacally brilliant set-up assistant.
In addition, the bavarianDEMON 3SX offers real-time-tuning for optimization of all important parameters in the flight.


The connection cable from the receiver to the BavarianDEMON 3SX is inserted on both sides.
Of course, a BavarianDEMON 3SX is capable of on-line update via an integrated flash memory. In addition to its excellent flybarless features, the BavarianDEMON 3SX is hence a quasi "real-flying flight simulator" - however at the highest fun level.

Any questions, wishes or suggestions?

Then get in contact with us.

[pril250]

I think nightflyer nailed it as far as the descriptions and operation of the two systems. I am not familiar with the bavarianDEMON 3SX closely but it seems to cover all the corners for a price. In contrast I am very familiar with FM and used it extensively.

It really depends how you want to use stabilisation. If it is just for learning how to hover and orientation practice up to scale flying then FM will do a job of work for very little money. Keep in mind that installation and setting up is not for the faint hearted but once you master it you will know all there is to know about setting up model helicopters. The tail gyro is not the best and I prefer to fly with an external tail gyro which may require a minimum of 7 channels for full control of both tail gyro and FM modes. I have it on both the birds I fly and can switch it in or out as required. The low altitude position mode is a nice gimmik and works well subject to a suitable surface (good contrast e.g. grass). Really can't fault it otherwise and forget flying 3D with it.

If you are considering a bail out system especially for 3D, I guess the bavarianDEMON 3SX will be more suitable with its more up to date technology and functionality. As I am less familiar with this one I am not certain how good the 'bail out' is, I hope someone with personal experience can contribute here.

[boowho]

Originally Posted by actionscript

What is the difference between these two systems? Will the Bavarian also auto stabilize if you take you fingers off the cyclic?

I am looking for something that will put the helicopter into a hover if I lose my sense of orientation and panic.

Hey, first off you must be a Flash developer??

I had a Flymentor and was never happy with it. I never could get the position mode (camera) to work and the computer interface was very flakey. I had to buy the extra field programmer to set it up correctly.

Even though the thing is becoming obsolete, I just bought a NAZA H with the GPS module. Another advantage of this over the FM is that the H doubles as a flybarless control if you get that far.

If you have an unlimited budget a BD 3SX or as Skookum 720 would be the way to go.

Just my $.02 worth; I'm FAR from an expert on this stuff.

Boowho??

[Zermelo]

Not sure why I decided to read some post on this forum as I do not own any of the stabilization units that are part of it. But I do own a Bavarian Demon 3SX.

So in that regard, I'll chime in on my thoughts and experience with it. I bought the 3SX about 6 months ago because it was a goal of mine this year to learn inverted flight. Prior to this I could do forward flight fine, circuits, figure 8s, loops rolls, even tail down funnels and inverted hovering. During the winter I was practicing inverted backwards flight, and was determined to get it down this season.

I was looking for something with a rescue to help cut down on eventual costs since my previous attempts at inverted flight all rather quickly ended in crashes on my 450. I figure the upfront investment would pay off in the long run. So I bought the unit and put it on my 450 CopterX clone to practice with.

The BD forum is chocked full of info, so I got it set up rather easy, but I will say the manual that comes with it has a lot to be desired. But the info and vids on the forum are great.

I went with the BD over the Sookum because all the reports spoke about it's rock solid performance with the bailout and stabilization modes.

FIRST POINT: The bailout is very, very, very reliable. I don't know how to put it other than, well, it just works. The same thing for it's stabilization mode. The great thing about both these modes, they are very easy to program as they simply require different gain rangers to activate and assign to a switch. You can choose the degree of stabilization or put it on extreme ends for bailout. You can choose between bailout out upright or the quickest point to level flight (either inverted or upright). It's pretty versatile, you can also choose how much pitch it gives during rescue.

Once I tested it, my first real use of it was actually buddy boxing with a friend. I used the wireless buddy boxing feature on the DX9 and gave him my controller and told him to hit the switch when it looked like I was in trouble or if I told him. The reason I did this is because I was still not use to hitting a switch to "rescue" the heli, and was nervous. My friend is a really good 3d pilot and that gave me a little more confidence.

I have to say it worked perfectly on my first real sustained inverted flights. He bailed me out 3 times on the first flight, 2 times on the second, and 1 time on the 5th. I did 6 flights in all. I did eventually crash on the 7th because I was probably too low and didn't let go of the sticks which is necessary for bailout to work unless you set the mixes to disable the sticks during bailout.

But it is definitely a RELIABLE bailout feature. During the next few weeks it saved me I would say about 5 more times when I got the nerve to fly alone.

Here is the kicker though, on 4 different occasions I crashed, not because I didn't remember to use the rescue feature, but because I was still use to hitting Throttle Hold. The one thing you have to do is set it up on a switch you're comfortable with and PRACTICE hitting that switch in an emergency. This is not an issue with the unit, but unlearning a habit.

So to sum up, the unit is a reliable and can help learning. I still have to practice using it, but when used correctly it saves the heli.