Review my Setup: Logo 600SX

[CatchmyCorsair]

Once the 600SX is not backordered, I plan to order my first Logo & FBL system.

Here's what I have available:

DX7 radio (anyone know of a non-lipo replacement battery that's not $50-60?)
Spektrum Rx which supports HV servos
JR 8717 cyclic
JR 8900 tail
Kontronik Jive 85A HV
Hyperion 4035-500kv motor (mainly unsure of this)

Planning to add:
Vbar NEO 6.1 Express
12s 3300-3700 of some sort (feedback on capacity is welcome)

Planning to use Jive BEC. Good or bad idea?
Anything else required for Vbar setup?

[3D Dave]

Looks good.

I originally ran my Logo 500 on the same DX7 but it with the older blue line V-Bar 5.7

I'm assuming the Jive is the 80HV and it will be fine on 12s. I've never seen an 85HV Jive.

The Jive's BEC is extremely robust and should power your 600 just fine but I've always run Futaba BLS and they have lower current draw. Just make sure you have a second power jumper from the Jive to the NEO.

I have no experience setting up a NEO with the V-Bar software as I went straight to the V-Bar control when I switched to NEO's.

I'm sure someone will chime in that has though.

You'll have to run the numbers for gearing and pinion but I will say the best range for HS is about 2100-2200 if swinging 623's and probably a little higher if using 600-603 blades.

For tails, 95's are good.

For batteries, 3300's will balance better than 3700's if running 12s.

Have fun!

[CatchmyCorsair]

Originally Posted by 3D Dave

Looks good.

I originally ran my Logo 500 on the same DX7 but it with the older blue line V-Bar 5.7

I'm assuming the Jive is the 80HV and it will be fine on 12s. I've never seen an 85HV Jive.

The Jive's BEC is extremely robust and should power your 600 just fine but I've always run Futaba BLS and they have lower current draw. Just make sure you have a second power jumper from the Jive to the NEO.

I have no experience setting up a NEO with the V-Bar software as I went straight to the V-Bar control when I switched to NEO's.

I'm sure someone will chime in that has though.

You'll have to run the numbers for gearing and pinion but I will say the best range for HS is about 2100-2200 if swinging 623's and probably a little higher if using 600-603 blades.

For tails, 95's are good.

For batteries, 3300's will balance better than 3700's if running 12s.

Have fun!

You're right, it's the Jive 80HV. I've been away for 5 years, so my memory is slowly coming back. I originally ran a 2s lipo Rx pack so maybe I'll play it safe again - but that's such a pain to charge 3 packs.

The current Vbar line-up is quite confusing. Is the basic NEO Express a standalone FBL unit or can it act as a receiver for 3rd party Tx? Or is there another version of NEO that acts as a receiver/FBL combo for the Mikado Tx only?

[3D Dave]

Welcome back then.

I believe the 04945 VBAR NEO 6.1 EXPRESS is all you need.

They also sell it with an external sensor but that is NOT needed unless you're running a heli with extreme vibrations i.e. some/most Nitros.

The V-Link NEO is designed to interface directly with the V-Contro only.

I'm not 100% but I believe you can make the non-Vlink NEO into a V-Link version but you'd have to verify that.

I'd recommend reading about the NEO in the V-Stabi forums as well to help you get back up to speed.

[Dennis P]

I have ran the Jive BEC on several helis with several different servo combos with zero issues (with the additional slave lead). I like my headspeed lower than lots of guys so 3300s work well for me in 600-640 size birds. If I was running as high as 3D Dave lists I would want the 3700s so I had some flight time.

[Mr.Andersen]

Be aware the Hyperion HS 4035-500 motor.
Its a good motor and match for the Jive HV80 but it allso have 25mm bolt spacing and 3mm motor bolts where the 600SX with its motor mounting hardware require a motor with 30mm bolt spacing and 4mm bolts.
I have flown mine with the same motor and ESC combo and old style motormount and it works just fine.

[cudaboy_71]

Re: the flavors of NEO

The V-link NEO has a built in antenna which ONLY connects/works with the Vcontrol radio. I don't believe there's any reason you can't plug spektrum sats in to the telemetry ports. The only advantage for you choosing this path would be your upgrade options to vcontrol: you wouldn't have to buy an additional vcontrol sat or perform the surgery/firmware upgrade to convert. It wouldn't save you any $$$, you'd just be paying up front for less weight/single piece solution.

The Non-V-link NEO can be used with EITHER a Vcontrol sat (I do this to route my antenna further away from the NEO unit) OR with another brand of radio just like previous versions of vbar. In the case of spektrum you'd plug your spektrum sats in to the telemetry ports on the side of the NEO unit. The v2/newer Non-vlink NEOs may be upgraded to V-link for a cost (There's a $20 case upgrade, plus the cross-grade firmware upgrade which I don't know the price) You'll need to check your hardware to confirm it has the antenna plugs on the PCB.

Then there are the software names:

VBasic: vbasic NEO has no vbar software. Only available in v-link casing. It is just a pass through device for use as a standalone RX or to allow use other brands of RX with the vcontrol. You can upgrade to Pro and Rescue (There is no Express upgrade).

Express: has a stripped down version to get vbar airborne. But lacks some features like pitch pump, adjustable precomps, optimizers, logging, many of the expert panels, swash endpoint adjustments, etc

Pro: has all features except Rescue

Rescue: includes all Pro features and Rescue.

[CatchmyCorsair]

Originally Posted by Mr.Andersen

Be aware the Hyperion HS 4035-500 motor.
Its a good motor and match for the Jive HV80 but it allso have 25mm bolt spacing and 3mm motor bolts where the 600SX with its motor mounting hardware require a motor with 30mm bolt spacing and 4mm bolts.
I have flown mine with the same motor and ESC combo and old style motormount and it works just fine.

Good info! Does the counter bearing still work with the old motor mount?

Originally Posted by cudaboy_71

Re: the flavors of NEO

The Non-V-link NEO can be used with EITHER a Vcontrol sat (I do this to route my antenna further away from the NEO unit) OR with another brand of radio just like previous versions of vbar. In the case of spektrum you'd plug your spektrum sats in to the telemetry ports on the side of the NEO unit. The v2/newer Non-vlink NEOs may be upgraded to V-link for a cost (There's a $20 case upgrade, plus the cross-grade firmware upgrade which I don't know the price) You'll need to check your hardware to confirm it has the antenna plugs on the PCB.

Then there are the software names:

VBasic: vbasic NEO has no vbar software. Only available in non v-link casing. It is just a pass through device for use as a standalone RX or to allow use other brands of RX with the vcontrol. You can upgrade to Pro and Rescue (There is no Express upgrade).

Express: has a stripped down version to get vbar airborne. But lacks some features like pitch pump, adjustable precomps, optimizers, logging, many of the expert panels, swash endpoint adjustments, etc

Pro: has all features except Rescue

Rescue: includes all Pro features and Rescue.

I'm gonna put on my noob hat now: So are you saying I can plug Spektrum satellites into the Non-Vlink Vbar unit and that now functions as my Spektrum Rx?

Software upgrades (Basic/Pro/Rescue) are done by connecting to a computer? For a first-time FBL user, which version would you recommend? I favor the "buy once" mentality.

[cudaboy_71]

Yep. Your sats are the RX. It needs to be configured in the software for the type of sat.

I, too thought the buy once option was most economical. It's a one time $100 fee for pro/rescue. But if you only upgrade to pro and then opt for rescue later it ends up being closer to $130 once you add it all up. Of course express is included at the low end.

Personally I put rescue on all of mine. No regrets.

I can say that it does NOT help your mental state to have rescue on only some of your models. For sanity it should be an all or none consideration and not something you ease in to.

[Mr.Andersen]

Originally Posted by CatchmyCorsair

Good info! Does the counter bearing still work with the old motor mount?

Nope, neither of the thitd motor ore mast supports can be used with the old style motor mount.
The only thing you have to do to use the old motor mount is to put a main mast bearing where the thirdt bearing support is suppose to be to fill out the main mast as its longer beneeth the main gear.

[CatchmyCorsair]

Originally Posted by Mr.Andersen

Nope, neither of the thitd motor ore mast supports can be used with the old style motor mount.
The only thing you have to do to use the old motor mount is to put a main mast bearing where the thirdt bearing support is suppose to be to fill out the main mast as its longer beneeth the main gear.

Bummer. I saw the counter bearing as a very useful upgrade on the SX.

I'm now thinking it may be worth buying a new motor so I can use the counter bearing.

[Mr.Andersen]

But you can buy the Scorpion HKIII 4035-500 that have the same specks as the hyperion motor but allso have the right holepattern.
http://www.scorpionsystem.com/catalo...KIII_4035_500/

[cudaboy_71]

oh..nvmind. I guess you'd need the new counter bearing in 25mm, too.

[Mr.Andersen]

The old style 25mm counter bearing wont fit the third main mast bearing bracket.
I tryed that as i was planning to use my old Hyperion HS 4035-500 motor.

[cudaboy_71]

heh...I realized that right after I posted

[CatchmyCorsair]

Originally Posted by Mr.Andersen

But you can buy the Scorpion HKIII 4035-500 that have the same specks as the hyperion motor but allso have the right holepattern.
http://www.scorpionsystem.com/catalo...KIII_4035_500/

Cool! Thank for the link. I searched through this forum last night looking at the motor discussions. Do you see any advantage of the Xnova motors over Scorpion?

This one looks comparable:
https://www.helidirect.com/helicopte...ormal-6mm.html

[tonys-heli]

kde has a good 12s motor too. 600xf-530

[3D Dave]

In my experience, Scorpions generally have a slight edge in power. Also, they apparently still recommend oiling the bearings every 5-10 flights. I personally only oiled my 4025-1100 about 2-3 times a season (every 60-80 flights) and it seemed fine YMMV.

The Xnovas are just a hair less powerful but much better at running cooler.

Where I fly, temps are often in the 90-95+ degrees range so I prefer a cooler running motor.

Originally Posted by CatchmyCorsair

Cool! Thank for the link. I searched through this forum last night looking at the motor discussions. Do you see any advantage of the Xnova motors over Scorpion?

This one looks comparable:
https://www.helidirect.com/helicopte...ormal-6mm.html

[Johnny31297]

Originally Posted by CatchmyCorsair

DX7 radio (anyone know of a non-lipo replacement battery that's not $50-60?)
Spektrum Rx which supports HV servos
JR 8717 cyclic
JR 8900 tail
Kontronik Jive 85A HV
Hyperion 4035-500kv motor (mainly unsure of this)

Planning to add:
Vbar NEO 6.1 Express
12s 3300-3700 of some sort (feedback on capacity is welcome)

I rate this setup 6/10.

Jive 80 HV is a pita on the 600 to keep from overheating, I'd at least go 120A if you're planning to do more than sports flying. Additionally, the Jive 80 HV does not have a HV BEC but as long as you stick with your LV servos, you'll be fine. Motor is a clone of an old Scorpion, so it should probably work.

I use 12S 3300, keeping it as light as possible.

[CatchmyCorsair]

Originally Posted by Johnny31297

I rate this setup 6/10.

Jive 80 HV is a pita on the 600 to keep from overheating, I'd at least go 120A if you're planning to do more than sports flying. Additionally, the Jive 80 HV does not have a HV BEC but as long as you stick with your LV servos, you'll be fine. Motor is a clone of an old Scorpion, so it should probably work.

I use 12S 3300, keeping it as light as possible.

I'm certainly not a stick-banger (yet) - more sport 3D. The goal of this build was to use what I already have, so I'll try the 80HV and monitor the temps. There seem to be differing opinions on running this ESC with 12s (probably due to differing flying styles). I do have a heatsink I will apply.

Motor-wise I'll probably go with the Xnova. I'd like to use the counter bearing.