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Old 07-04-2012, 07:27 AM   #1
dogtoy
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Default Mcpx beginner ,...Turns

I have a little experience with 4 chan fixed pitch & could do turns & circles ok
not super pretty but ok ,......I now have the mcpx & I can hover it great but
as soon as a try forward flight & begin to turn I lose it ,...it just accelerates to quickly
it either drifts out of the turn or slides sideways to the ground ,..I can do it a little better sometimes in phoenix than real life ,..Its got me wondering if this mcpx is too much for for a beginner like me ,I am using the "tame: settings as well ,..should I pick up a 120sr
& stick with that for a while instead?
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Old 07-04-2012, 10:06 AM   #2
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Hi, I'm new to mcpx also, been hovering for 2-3 months in the garage. I got pretty good at 120sr so i moved up to mcpx. i can not get turns either, even out side with no wind. i think we need help. the pros make it look easy!!!!!
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Old 07-05-2012, 09:50 AM   #3
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I started last summer on the mcpx. I found it as a perfect training tool. Before I started with the mcpx, I spent a bunch of time on the simulator (basically learning hovering). The mcpx taught me forward flight, backward, inverted, etc. It takes practice along with a lot of walking over and picking it up. When I was sick of picking up the mcpx, I went to the sim.

This is how I started forward flight:
Just nudge it a bit to get forward flight started. Just get it creeping forward. I'd then try to stop it, then make it creep backwards to me. It would be slow, really slow. It would be sloppy and not in much of a straight line, but I started to get it. Once you can do that, start the turns under the slow speed. You can start by not doing a full circle. Fly away, stop the heli, turn 90 degrees, fly, turn 90 and fly back. After getting that down, you can start to smooth it out. Stay slow and work up the speed.

Doing it that way, you only need to be able to fly forward, stop into a hover, turn and repeat the process. But you need to have hovering in all orientations down. A really good way to learn that is to nail down slow piro hovers.
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Old 07-05-2012, 11:56 AM   #4
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I sound just like you guys. Started flying almost a year ago. Have a 120sr and MSR that I got pretty good at flying. Got the mcpx for Christmas and been doing lots of hovering...but always tend to loose it once I attempt to fly it around. Thumbs just don't react very quickly. Then you watch what the pro's can do.........I'll never get there.....
I'm a little frustrated, but still working at it. I have seen some folks consider the mcpx junk..but it will take a beating.....thats important for me.
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Old 07-05-2012, 03:09 PM   #5
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Then can go right ahead and call it junk all they want. I'll call it an amazing sim for learning CP helis.

Don't get me wrong, the mcpx has it's limitations. But for entry into CP, it's incredible. I would be nowhere near as far along in my flying if I didn't have an mcpx to learn on. Sure, you can learn on a sim. But a sim just could not hold my attention span. The sim gets boring, the mcpx does not. Everyone is different, but the truth be told, you can learn very well with the mcpx.
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Old 07-05-2012, 03:26 PM   #6
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I just watched a video of Bert Kammerer flying an mCPX. WOW !!! He didn't think it was junk. Probably nuff said.
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Old 07-06-2012, 09:00 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by GravityJunkie View Post
Then can go right ahead and call it junk all they want. I'll call it an amazing sim for learning CP helis.

Don't get me wrong, the mcpx has it's limitations. But for entry into CP, it's incredible. I would be nowhere near as far along in my flying if I didn't have an mcpx to learn on. Sure, you can learn on a sim. But a sim just could not hold my attention span. The sim gets boring, the mcpx does not. Everyone is different, but the truth be told, you can learn very well with the mcpx.
I agree with you. Just got a mcpx, and after a little time learning to take off, I realize that the mcpx model in Phoenix is not realistic at all. The 450 model I tried, has reactions closer to what the mcpx does. ie. takes off on you if you use too much stick. Glad I got the DX6i for use with Phoenix and for flying the mcx2 I started with. Switched to using TH instead of pulling the throttle down, that the mcx2 TX makes you do when you are crashing into something. Can't imagine what flying the mcpx would be like with the TX that comes in the RTF version.

Found better TX settings for just starting to fly the mcpx yesterday, and that has made a big difference. Just doing the takeoff and lift to 6 inches, then set back down, exercises. TH when it all goes wrong.
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Old 07-06-2012, 09:43 AM   #8
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I agree. I don't bother with the mcpx model in Phoenix. I'll fly something bigger. There are some bigger birds with fast reaction time in Phoenix. Or you can go in and tweak the heli settings. I usually bump down the hover stability and turn up the flybarless setting. But that's something you should do after you've got hovering/orientations down.
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Old 07-13-2012, 10:26 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dogtoy View Post
I now have the mcpx & I can hover it great but
as soon as a try forward flight & begin to turn I lose it ,...it just accelerates to quickly
it either drifts out of the turn or slides sideways to the ground
A few things you should note about doing banked turns. The one thing I had to learn early on just like hovering, turning and other maneuvers requires correction, maybe not as much as hovering, but you will not always bank into a turn the same way, sometimes it will be a slight bank and a wide turn, sometimes the heli may be virtually sideways. It depends on the speed of the heli.

For me I like to go into a turn with a lot of speed, this gives me more options, and I don't have to worry about the heli "falling", but in either case, you have to learn to correct for it. On the sim, sometimes it seems a bit too easy, just give left cyclic and left rudder and watch the heli turn around. If you see the heli falling, then well, you have to move your cyclic to the other side to get it level. If you are going too fast and don't give enough cyclic and turn the rudder too fast, you will end up of flying backwards.

Sometimes you will get a perfect turn without much need for correction during the turn, but once you learn how to correct for little variances, you will be totally confident going into the turn regardless of forward speed or trying to get the cyclic and rudder "just right". And that pretty much goes for other maneuvers as well. There will always be variables, like wind, distance, the amount of expo, etc. and you have to learn to adjust to those.

I would stay stick with the mcpx, the 120sr is a fun heli but the 45 degree flybar makes it fly too unrealistic for good preparation for a cp heli, also you learn bad habits, there is no idle up, so you will will learn to bring your throttle down in a crash instead of hitting throttle hold. The 120sr will also hovers at around mid-stick as opposed to 3/4 stick, and you will have to relearn how to turn at at higher throttle position. The mcpx is a good analog to fly larger birds. Stick with it and a sim.
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Old 07-15-2012, 04:40 PM   #10
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I agree with most things said so far. I started out with a coaxial CX3 then moved to an mSR, then a Blade 400, now a Century Nitro and latest buy was the mCPx.

I found that the mSR (which flies much like the SR120 just smaller and less stable) was great for learning to hover and once I started very fast forward flight it was quite similar to my Blade 400 as far as initiating turns, making the turn and returning to forward flight. That's about the only similarity.

The mCPx is a lot more like my Blade 400 and Century than the fixed pitch, and that's the biggest difference you're going to find with the sr120 or mSR's is the fixed pitch self stabilizing tendencies.

When learning the mCPx you really need to treat it like a bigger heli. It's a great flying heli and I keep it around to stay fresh during the winter or fly in the yard with the kids. I really prefer flying my larger helis but it's so close to flying the larger ones that it's a great way to stay in practice. Orientation is so much harder due to it's small size that if you can fly it 60 feet away it's like flying a bigger heli a couple hundred feet away.

Initiate forward movement slowly and smoothly because it takes off remarkably quick. Start slowly. Once you put some forward into it, recenter the stick and use the speed you have put in. Because it's a cp and not a fixed pitch you don't have to hold it in forward. You want to only put some in and then hold the speed which requires pulling some back out. Work on moving forward smoothly without rocketing forward, then come back to you. Once you feel good doing that start turns.

When turning a cp it happens a lot faster. You just tip it to the side a bit, then pull back slightly like an airplane while simultaneously using the rudder input to keep it turning and not flying sideways. You must do coordinated turns all the time. The gyro setup on the mCPX is pretty good so it will make you fly sideways while staying pointed ahead unless you coordinate the tail.

Once you have completed your turn you must level the heli with aileron input. You will notice that the heli now wants to climb because the nose is high. That's because at the start of the turn you pulled back to make the turn. You now have to nose down again to maintain your level flight and keep your speed where you started. The hardest thing for me to get down was nosing over to keep from climbing while exiting the turn. The mCPx is great for learning all of this.

I hope the way I said this makes some sense lol, it did in my head.
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Old 07-15-2012, 04:48 PM   #11
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Oh, and I hate flying the mCPx on the simulator. I have Pheonix and I love it for helis, I bought it to help me learn CP helis before I started crashing my 400. I fly the Avant Aurora 90, the T-rex 700, I like the big ones. Tell you what though, if you want a great GREAT heli to learn on try the sea squirrel. It's in the amphibious list. It's very tame, tends to weather vane so coordinated turns are much easier to handle. Even in a simulator, crashing over and over and trying to tame a 3D model can be so frustrating that it takes the fun out of it. Try some of the scale heli's and work your way up to hard 3D models because ones like the sea squirrel and ....oh the BO105 are pretty tame by comparison.

Another thing to think about that most people miss I think are landing approaches. Not just hovering, but actually making a descent and transitioning into hover. Start up high and drop collective to start the descent and then work on your flare and transition. This helps a lot when you are flying for real as well.

I mostly use the simulator to practice autorotations. I finally tried a couple autos with my 400 for the first time. I'm really glad I had the sim first.
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Old 07-15-2012, 04:55 PM   #12
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If you want the weathervaning behavior on Phoenix, just edit a model and set the gyro to rate mode instead of heading hold. Makes flying nice looking circuits, loops, etc. really easy.

How well it relates to real (3D) model helis which are almost always running in heading hold, that is a different matter :-p
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Old 07-15-2012, 05:01 PM   #13
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True. That's a good point to bring up but if you know all that then you are probably already flying pretty well. I'm just pointing out some other heli's that are already pretty tame for beginners to build some confidence with. Not just with the tail but in their power delivery, they are just softer acting and in my opinion much easier to learn to fly. I had my 12 year old trying helis on the simulator and he also had a much easier time flying the Sea Squirrel than he did any of the 3D models.

I don't really care to fly anything that weathervanes that much because I try to stay in practice for flying my 3D models so working on coordinated turns really helps when I go to the field.
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Old 07-16-2012, 03:33 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by daveotlinux View Post
I agree with you. Just got a mcpx, and after a little time learning to take off, I realize that the mcpx model in Phoenix is not realistic at all. The 450 model I tried, has reactions closer to what the mcpx does. ie. takes off on you if you use too much stick. Glad I got the DX6i for use with Phoenix and for flying the mcx2 I started with. Switched to using TH instead of pulling the throttle down, that the mcx2 TX makes you do when you are crashing into something. Can't imagine what flying the mcpx would be like with the TX that comes in the RTF version.

Found better TX settings for just starting to fly the mcpx yesterday, and that has made a big difference. Just doing the takeoff and lift to 6 inches, then set back down, exercises. TH when it all goes wrong.
This is exactly my experience. Did the 6 inch take off and landings. Now to start slow piro hovering.

Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk 2
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Old 07-17-2012, 10:19 AM   #15
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When turning a cp it happens a lot faster. You just tip it to the side a bit, then pull back slightly like an airplane while simultaneously using the rudder input to keep it turning and not flying sideways. You must do coordinated turns all the time.

Once you have completed your turn you must level the heli with aileron input. You will notice that the heli now wants to climb because the nose is high. That's because at the start of the turn you pulled back to make the turn. You now have to nose down again to maintain your level flight and keep your speed where you started. The hardest thing for me to get down was nosing over to keep from climbing while exiting the turn. The mCPx is great for learning all of this.

I hope the way I said this makes some sense lol, it did in my head.
Yes it makes sense. I am just now starting to get the hang of it on the sim. Trying to get just right amount of bank, speed, collective, elevator, rudder and then roll out to forward flight seemed to take forever. And I thought rubbing my head and patting my tummy was hard.
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Old 07-17-2012, 06:33 PM   #16
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You can rub your tummy and pat your head? impressive sir.
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Old 08-03-2012, 08:12 AM   #17
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This is how I started with the mcpx v2.
Works really great...try it.

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Old 08-06-2012, 10:49 AM   #18
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Excellent instructional video. Helped me a lot to tame it down. Now can enjoy it more.
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Old 08-07-2012, 12:35 PM   #19
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You can rub your tummy and pat your head? impressive sir.
NO ONE SAID THAT THIS WAS A PRE-REQUISITE TO FLYING HELIS.
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Old 01-21-2013, 09:06 PM   #20
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This is how I started with the mcpx v2.
Works really great...try it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g2bLL...eature=related
Great video - thanks.
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