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renefigueroa · 07-01-2012, 06:06 PM

I had a hard landing from only a foot or so, but I broke the center piece of the training gear where the four "legs" go through. I removed it and felt brave to fly as I had been doing pretty good. However the heli thought otherwise. It would not fly straight or crooked for that matter. I am a newbie so bear with me. I checked everything for half a morning, nothing broken I could tell. I tore it down and rebuilt from the main shaft up. Again being new at this I wasn't sure what I was supposed to see, but I ran the heli in my hand while running the cyclic up and down, left and right and I noticed that under full or nearly full power the swashplate would run up when up elevator,(cyclic), was applied and then would stay there. I also have a mCPx2 so I did the same to it. The cyclic did as it was supposed to but returned to level once I released inputs to the cyclic. I tore it down again and replaced the swashplate, and it flies ok now. I also adjusted the Servo pushrod links after reading John Salt's book on the MSRx and the 120 from 37mm to 35 mm. It flies fine after not being able to get off the groung yesterday, but it wants to drift right from the get go and I am having to apply 5-6 left aileron clicks to my JR 9503 to keep it straight. Any suggestions as to what or where to go and adjust would be most appreciated. At the very least I have learned to tear most of it apart and put it back together. I also checked to make sure the links faced properly before attaching them to the balls, again per Salt's book. I managed to loose a couple of screws, (tinny little buggers), but having lots of spares on hand the day was saved. I have more spares on order. Again thanks for any and all suggestions
Rene

dsuida · 07-01-2012, 06:15 PM

Did you check your center of gravity? If it is constantly drifting in one direction that could be it, especially if you are using a training gear. Other thing I can think of is to check your fly-bar. I don't know the reason for it, but I've noticed that my in bent it can cause my helif to drift in one direction.

renefigueroa · 07-01-2012, 06:27 PM

Thank you, yes I have and it depends on the battery. I can actually tell when a Blade batt is in versus a turnigy batt. The training gear is off,(broken), and I am tickled I was able to figure out the problem. I just got through looking at the underside of the old swashplate and saw two spots where the bearings were "not" smooth, so I was correct in my assesment of the problem. I can fly it fine, and happy to do so, however it seems like a lot of trim to keep it straight

Chris.S. · 07-02-2012, 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by renefigueroa

I had a hard landing from only a foot or so, but I broke the center piece of the training gear where the four "legs" go through. I removed it and felt brave to fly as I had been doing pretty good. However the heli thought otherwise. It would not fly straight or crooked for that matter. I am a newbie so bear with me. I checked everything for half a morning, nothing broken I could tell. I tore it down and rebuilt from the main shaft up. Again being new at this I wasn't sure what I was supposed to see, but I ran the heli in my hand while running the cyclic up and down, left and right and I noticed that under full or nearly full power the swashplate would run up when up elevator,(cyclic), was applied and then would stay there. I also have a mCPx2 so I did the same to it. The cyclic did as it was supposed to but returned to level once I released inputs to the cyclic. I tore it down again and replaced the swashplate, and it flies ok now. I also adjusted the Servo pushrod links after reading John Salt's book on the MSRx and the 120 from 37mm to 35 mm. It flies fine after not being able to get off the groung yesterday, but it wants to drift right from the get go and I am having to apply 5-6 left aileron clicks to my JR 9503 to keep it straight. Any suggestions as to what or where to go and adjust would be most appreciated. At the very least I have learned to tear most of it apart and put it back together. I also checked to make sure the links faced properly before attaching them to the balls, again per Salt's book. I managed to loose a couple of screws, (tinny little buggers), but having lots of spares on hand the day was saved. I have more spares on order. Again thanks for any and all suggestions
Rene

By adjusting the pushrod links you've mechanically altered the heli's trim so, you need to readjust those links. Using general numbers, like the ones out of a book, can only give you a guideline for where to start. Just play with it until you get it trimmed out just right.

renefigueroa · 07-06-2012, 06:55 PM

Thank you, and you are correct. I did as you said and it is pretty much ok. Now I noticed the blades are not tracking straight and the heli vibrates some in flight. It has probably done so all along, but being new at this I had not noticed. I have tried the solution in the E-book by John Salt, msr-x-120sr ebook. I need to do his procedure agin, but as a newbie I am encouraged it is beginning to make sense. I can also tell whenever I use the stock battery or the longer Turnigy's. If I push it too far in or for that matter not far enough, I end up playing with the trims on my JR 9503. I have an mCPx v2 standing by for when I feel bold enough to jump to the real thing. John was kind enough to send me some very mild settings for the JR 9503 to get me started. I better get the hang of this as I have my sights on the Blade 450 3D. The 450X I like but it seems way out of my abilities at this time

Chris.S. · 07-07-2012, 11:35 AM

If your blades are tracking badly and the hel shakes, I'd bet you have a crack in your main shaft.

It's pretty-well impossible to diagnose without disassembling the head though.

Take all the components above the swash plate off and then insert a small screwdriver in the top of the shaft to flex it check for cracks....

renefigueroa · 07-08-2012, 09:13 AM

Thanks, do you mind expanding a bit on the screwdriver and flexing? Can you actually get noticeable flexing with a tinny screwdriver and shaft?

Chris.S. · 07-08-2012, 12:43 PM

We'll, when you get the shaft exposed you'll see that it's hollow. A small precision screwdriver has a small enough tip to insert into that hole to apply pressure back and forth. That will open the crack (assuming there is one) and make it visible.

Some people have had good luck repairing the crack using ca glue, but I just prefer to replace it.

The shaking is annoying but not "flight critical", I've been flying with a cracked shaft for about a month now; my lhs was all out when I went to get a new one and I haven't been able to make it back again since.

I've broken the main shaft more then any other piece, except landing gear......

renefigueroa · 07-08-2012, 05:06 PM

Awesome, I will try that. If not that, I do know the blades are not tracking straight. I put some red elec. tape on one tip, and they are fairly good ways apart. It flies fine, I am just beginning to notice the subtle vibrations and such, which I had not before. I guess I am learning, just way to much to fast. That is the way I do things so it's ok. I will stay overwhelmed for a while. I do have enough parts to put two 120's together EXCEPT a main shaft!!! That will be fixed tonight. Thanks for the great info

Heli-cat · 07-09-2012, 01:02 AM

I still like the aluminum shafts better.. I shouldn't say this because I'm sure to hex myself, but what the hey, I bought a 2-pack of Xtreme shafts last summer and I still haven't managed to bend the first one yet. It's still straight and true and my heli hovers quite solid unless my blades are out of whack.

renefigueroa · 07-09-2012, 11:26 AM

I checked the shaft and couldn't see any cracks, messed with the blades some more. It still has a wobble at times and it will now not get off the ground with the training gear on. I had shortened the links between the servoes and the swashplate to 35mm or so per Salt's ebook. I have gone back to the 37mm stock configuration, but it will not get off the ground for any lenght of time. Without it flies ok.

renefigueroa · 07-09-2012, 02:17 PM

I did have after all a new main shaft. The heli is almost new with not too many flights on it, so the motor should be fine. I am now wondering if the shaft might be the problem?? It will fly fine and then start wobbling a bit. Sometimes the blades appear to track ok, and sometimes not.

Chris.S. · 07-10-2012, 08:32 AM

Trouble getting off the ground is most likely to be caused by your main motor or the batteries, I'd look to those first...

renefigueroa · 07-10-2012, 09:11 AM

I tore it down early this morning, rebuilt it. The servo links are at 37mm per the manual. It flies but I am having all kinds of issues with control. Cyclic response is not what it shoud be. I had one short flight where it acted ok, but that was it. The main shaft looked fine. Being new at this I am not sure where to look at this point. I have enough parts on hand to literally replace the whole machine, except for main frame. Obviously I prefer to figure out what is wrong with this puppy.The servos appear to work correctly with full throw or in Dual rate. I am leaving today, (work), for four days. It will bug me the rest of the week. Heck I even thought of getting a second one to compare. Of course no guarantees that It would help me unless I knew what to look for. It appears to be very unstable, and I haven't bothered with the training gear again. I keep thinking of the swash plate and those links I have adjusted so many times. I wonder if the root cause is there somehow. I even checked the poor blades for balance. After all the abuse, they were perfect, however the tracking is another story, but that , if I have learned correctly , causes vibrations, and not make the heli unflyable.

crashjack · 07-13-2012, 11:54 PM

If you are experiencing tbe (toilet bowl effect), it is likely due to binding somewhere around your main shaft (swash, flybar, antirotation collar, etc.), or your main shaft might be cracked. If you've adjusted your servo links, you've probably bent your swash arms and might have bent the swash pin or even forced it out of the guides on the frame. I ended up getting a rkh swash because I kept tearing up stock swashes, just trying to adjust my servo rods/links. After getting the rkh swash, I was able to level my swash without worrying about tearing-up any more stock swashes.

renefigueroa · 07-14-2012, 08:31 AM

LOL, just can't account for ignorance!!! On my part anyway. I ordered a second 120 SR. I am determined to learn this hobby and learn the repairs as needed, and keep flying while at it.. Within 30 seconds of opening the box I found my problem, please don't laugh, I have already done so. I was missing one link from the flybar to the main rotor blade holders!!! For some reason I was thinking of a HH video where they said you only needed one and if you broke the ball you could switch the link to the other side. That was for the mCX2!!! I tore this thing down twice, making sure it was all put back together correctly. It now flies like a baby, very stable and very little trim needed. No wonder it flew totally uncontrolled and would not lift off with the training gear on!!! I will check the servo link lengths against the new one. Most embarrassing to say the least, however thank you so much for all the suggestions. I am printing these to keep for future reference when I tear something again. I am also going to put my Nikon 105MM macro lens to use and take loads of pics to keep in the computer for reference. Thanks to all again

crashjack · 07-15-2012, 12:01 PM

A missing link will definitely cause catastrophic problems, but luckily, is the easiest/cheapest thing to fix. Good to know I'm not the only one who is prone to do stupid things every once in a while (unfortunately my stupid things occur more frequently than every once in a while).

renefigueroa · 07-15-2012, 05:40 PM

I think it is called learning. I was just afraid I was already over my head with a minor mishap, not even a crash, and it wouldn't fly. How would I progress???? And with a simple Heli!!! I now have two 120's along with my original mCX2 and a mCPx V2 waiting in the box once I feel brave to jump to full collective. J. Salt from helicopterfun was kind enough to send me some very "tame" settings for it. Heck I am looking ahead to the next larger one. The 450 was the obvious choice, now Blade puts out the 300X!!

07-01-2012, 06:06 PM	#1 (permalink)
renefigueroa Registered Users Join Date: May 2012	Heli wants to go left after repairs I had a hard landing from only a foot or so, but I broke the center piece of the training gear where the four "legs" go through. I removed it and felt brave to fly as I had been doing pretty good. However the heli thought otherwise. It would not fly straight or crooked for that matter. I am a newbie so bear with me. I checked everything for half a morning, nothing broken I could tell. I tore it down and rebuilt from the main shaft up. Again being new at this I wasn't sure what I was supposed to see, but I ran the heli in my hand while running the cyclic up and down, left and right and I noticed that under full or nearly full power the swashplate would run up when up elevator,(cyclic), was applied and then would stay there. I also have a mCPx2 so I did the same to it. The cyclic did as it was supposed to but returned to level once I released inputs to the cyclic. I tore it down again and replaced the swashplate, and it flies ok now. I also adjusted the Servo pushrod links after reading John Salt's book on the MSRx and the 120 from 37mm to 35 mm. It flies fine after not being able to get off the groung yesterday, but it wants to drift right from the get go and I am having to apply 5-6 left aileron clicks to my JR 9503 to keep it straight. Any suggestions as to what or where to go and adjust would be most appreciated. At the very least I have learned to tear most of it apart and put it back together. I also checked to make sure the links faced properly before attaching them to the balls, again per Salt's book. I managed to loose a couple of screws, (tinny little buggers), but having lots of spares on hand the day was saved. I have more spares on order. Again thanks for any and all suggestions Rene

07-01-2012, 06:15 PM	#2 (permalink)
dsuida Registered Users My HF Map location Join Date: Apr 2012	Did you check your center of gravity? If it is constantly drifting in one direction that could be it, especially if you are using a training gear. Other thing I can think of is to check your fly-bar. I don't know the reason for it, but I've noticed that my in bent it can cause my helif to drift in one direction. __________________ ~ A landing is just a controlled fall ~ Blade 300 X, Blade Nano CP X, Blade 350 QX

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07-01-2012, 06:27 PM	#3 (permalink)
renefigueroa Registered Users Thread Starter Join Date: May 2012	Thank you, yes I have and it depends on the battery. I can actually tell when a Blade batt is in versus a turnigy batt. The training gear is off,(broken), and I am tickled I was able to figure out the problem. I just got through looking at the underside of the old swashplate and saw two spots where the bearings were "not" smooth, so I was correct in my assesment of the problem. I can fly it fine, and happy to do so, however it seems like a lot of trim to keep it straight

07-06-2012, 06:55 PM	#5 (permalink)
renefigueroa Registered Users Thread Starter Join Date: May 2012	Thank you, and you are correct. I did as you said and it is pretty much ok. Now I noticed the blades are not tracking straight and the heli vibrates some in flight. It has probably done so all along, but being new at this I had not noticed. I have tried the solution in the E-book by John Salt, msr-x-120sr ebook. I need to do his procedure agin, but as a newbie I am encouraged it is beginning to make sense. I can also tell whenever I use the stock battery or the longer Turnigy's. If I push it too far in or for that matter not far enough, I end up playing with the trims on my JR 9503. I have an mCPx v2 standing by for when I feel bold enough to jump to the real thing. John was kind enough to send me some very mild settings for the JR 9503 to get me started. I better get the hang of this as I have my sights on the Blade 450 3D. The 450X I like but it seems way out of my abilities at this time

07-07-2012, 11:35 AM	#6 (permalink)
Chris.S. Registered Users Join Date: Nov 2010	If your blades are tracking badly and the hel shakes, I'd bet you have a crack in your main shaft. It's pretty-well impossible to diagnose without disassembling the head though. Take all the components above the swash plate off and then insert a small screwdriver in the top of the shaft to flex it check for cracks....

07-08-2012, 09:13 AM	#7 (permalink)
renefigueroa Registered Users Thread Starter Join Date: May 2012	Thanks, do you mind expanding a bit on the screwdriver and flexing? Can you actually get noticeable flexing with a tinny screwdriver and shaft?

07-08-2012, 12:43 PM	#8 (permalink)
Chris.S. Registered Users Join Date: Nov 2010	We'll, when you get the shaft exposed you'll see that it's hollow. A small precision screwdriver has a small enough tip to insert into that hole to apply pressure back and forth. That will open the crack (assuming there is one) and make it visible. Some people have had good luck repairing the crack using ca glue, but I just prefer to replace it. The shaking is annoying but not "flight critical", I've been flying with a cracked shaft for about a month now; my lhs was all out when I went to get a new one and I haven't been able to make it back again since. I've broken the main shaft more then any other piece, except landing gear......

07-08-2012, 05:06 PM	#9 (permalink)
renefigueroa Registered Users Thread Starter Join Date: May 2012	Awesome, I will try that. If not that, I do know the blades are not tracking straight. I put some red elec. tape on one tip, and they are fairly good ways apart. It flies fine, I am just beginning to notice the subtle vibrations and such, which I had not before. I guess I am learning, just way to much to fast. That is the way I do things so it's ok. I will stay overwhelmed for a while. I do have enough parts to put two 120's together EXCEPT a main shaft!!! That will be fixed tonight. Thanks for the great info

07-09-2012, 01:02 AM	#10 (permalink)
Heli-cat Registered Users Join Date: Jun 2011	I still like the aluminum shafts better.. I shouldn't say this because I'm sure to hex myself, but what the hey, I bought a 2-pack of Xtreme shafts last summer and I still haven't managed to bend the first one yet. It's still straight and true and my heli hovers quite solid unless my blades are out of whack.

07-09-2012, 11:26 AM	#11 (permalink)
renefigueroa Registered Users Thread Starter Join Date: May 2012	I checked the shaft and couldn't see any cracks, messed with the blades some more. It still has a wobble at times and it will now not get off the ground with the training gear on. I had shortened the links between the servoes and the swashplate to 35mm or so per Salt's ebook. I have gone back to the 37mm stock configuration, but it will not get off the ground for any lenght of time. Without it flies ok.

07-09-2012, 02:17 PM	#12 (permalink)
renefigueroa Registered Users Thread Starter Join Date: May 2012	I did have after all a new main shaft. The heli is almost new with not too many flights on it, so the motor should be fine. I am now wondering if the shaft might be the problem?? It will fly fine and then start wobbling a bit. Sometimes the blades appear to track ok, and sometimes not.

07-10-2012, 08:32 AM	#13 (permalink)
Chris.S. Registered Users Join Date: Nov 2010	Trouble getting off the ground is most likely to be caused by your main motor or the batteries, I'd look to those first...

07-10-2012, 09:11 AM	#14 (permalink)
renefigueroa Registered Users Thread Starter Join Date: May 2012	I tore it down early this morning, rebuilt it. The servo links are at 37mm per the manual. It flies but I am having all kinds of issues with control. Cyclic response is not what it shoud be. I had one short flight where it acted ok, but that was it. The main shaft looked fine. Being new at this I am not sure where to look at this point. I have enough parts on hand to literally replace the whole machine, except for main frame. Obviously I prefer to figure out what is wrong with this puppy.The servos appear to work correctly with full throw or in Dual rate. I am leaving today, (work), for four days. It will bug me the rest of the week. Heck I even thought of getting a second one to compare. Of course no guarantees that It would help me unless I knew what to look for. It appears to be very unstable, and I haven't bothered with the training gear again. I keep thinking of the swash plate and those links I have adjusted so many times. I wonder if the root cause is there somehow. I even checked the poor blades for balance. After all the abuse, they were perfect, however the tracking is another story, but that , if I have learned correctly , causes vibrations, and not make the heli unflyable.

07-13-2012, 11:54 PM	#15 (permalink)
crashjack Registered Users Join Date: Jan 2012	If you are experiencing tbe (toilet bowl effect), it is likely due to binding somewhere around your main shaft (swash, flybar, antirotation collar, etc.), or your main shaft might be cracked. If you've adjusted your servo links, you've probably bent your swash arms and might have bent the swash pin or even forced it out of the guides on the frame. I ended up getting a rkh swash because I kept tearing up stock swashes, just trying to adjust my servo rods/links. After getting the rkh swash, I was able to level my swash without worrying about tearing-up any more stock swashes.

07-14-2012, 08:31 AM	#16 (permalink)
renefigueroa Registered Users Thread Starter Join Date: May 2012	LOL, just can't account for ignorance!!! On my part anyway. I ordered a second 120 SR. I am determined to learn this hobby and learn the repairs as needed, and keep flying while at it.. Within 30 seconds of opening the box I found my problem, please don't laugh, I have already done so. I was missing one link from the flybar to the main rotor blade holders!!! For some reason I was thinking of a HH video where they said you only needed one and if you broke the ball you could switch the link to the other side. That was for the mCX2!!! I tore this thing down twice, making sure it was all put back together correctly. It now flies like a baby, very stable and very little trim needed. No wonder it flew totally uncontrolled and would not lift off with the training gear on!!! I will check the servo link lengths against the new one. Most embarrassing to say the least, however thank you so much for all the suggestions. I am printing these to keep for future reference when I tear something again. I am also going to put my Nikon 105MM macro lens to use and take loads of pics to keep in the computer for reference. Thanks to all again

07-15-2012, 12:01 PM	#17 (permalink)
crashjack Registered Users Join Date: Jan 2012	A missing link will definitely cause catastrophic problems, but luckily, is the easiest/cheapest thing to fix. Good to know I'm not the only one who is prone to do stupid things every once in a while (unfortunately my stupid things occur more frequently than every once in a while).

07-15-2012, 05:40 PM	#18 (permalink)
renefigueroa Registered Users Thread Starter Join Date: May 2012	I think it is called learning. I was just afraid I was already over my head with a minor mishap, not even a crash, and it wouldn't fly. How would I progress???? And with a simple Heli!!! I now have two 120's along with my original mCX2 and a mCPx V2 waiting in the box once I feel brave to jump to full collective. J. Salt from helicopterfun was kind enough to send me some very "tame" settings for it. Heck I am looking ahead to the next larger one. The 450 was the obvious choice, now Blade puts out the 300X!!

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