Revisiting the Sim discussion

[oliver1071]

So how much better is RF7 then G4? I haven't tried it since way back then.

[fastblade]

Just to let everyone know... there is a Phoenix 5.5 beta available with much improved physics (so they say).... still playing around with it...and now there is an official X7 available...

But RealFlight is the only one that will blow-out the tail/ bog the motor like real life.... what does that tell you...

[Raptorapture]

Originally Posted by mkovalcson

... I know that all the simulators can be tweaked. The Thunder Tiger E700 on Realflight seemed the closest to me out of the box and then I tweaked it from there and put a TDR skin on it.

I almost bought the E700 after discovering it in RF but went with the TDR instead based on it being similarly light weight. I resisted using that model (E700) for sim training as it just seemed too capable.

[mqowen]

Originally Posted by jmtyndall

don't bother flying micros in the sim. Fly a 700

Agree.

[jcmors]

I have realflight 7.5 and phoenix. I really liked Phoenix until version 5 came out. The first update was a disaster! Yes, updates are free but, as with most things, I guess you get what you pay for They have improved version 5 as they have made releases but when I first upgraded to 5 I went out and bought RealFlight out of pure frustration. I still try Phoenix from time to time when they have a new release but IMHO RealFlight is way ahead now in having a closer to real life feel.

Just my 2 cents.

Jim

[myxiplx]

Originally Posted by fastblade

Just to let everyone know... there is a Phoenix 5.5 beta available with much improved physics (so they say).... still playing around with it...and now there is an official X7 available...

But RealFlight is the only one that will blow-out the tail/ bog the motor like real life.... what does that tell you...

AccuRC does that too. Put bigger main blades on it and you feel the engine bog, too low a RPM and you can blow out the tail and you'll need to fix it just like you would in a real model, with bigger tail blades, more headspeed, or less pitch on the main blades.

RealFlight is up there in terms of accuracy, but AccuRC is very good at these subtle details.

[Russell Harding]

Originally Posted by fastblade

Just to let everyone know... there is a Phoenix 5.5 beta available with much improved physics (so they say).... still playing around with it...and now there is an official X7 available...

But RealFlight is the only one that will blow-out the tail/ bog the motor like real life.... what does that tell you...

You obviously haven't used Heli-X... I agree RF is some of the better physics out there, but Heli-X also does a great job of modeling bad behavior if you setup your helicopter a little bit.

[wab223]

Originally Posted by fastblade

But RealFlight is the only one that will blow-out the tail/ bog the motor like real life.... what does that tell you...

I was going to say it tells me you have not tried all the sims.

Then I watched you flying that X7, I read that you are old like me and only started 3 years ago. So I decided " I am not worthy".

Great Flying!

[mkovalcson]

Originally Posted by Raptorapture

I almost bought the E700 after discovering it in RF but went with the TDR instead based on it being similarly light weight. I resisted using that model (E700) for sim training as it just seemed too capable.

To me they seemed to have "similar" flight characteristics, once you increased the tail ratio on the E700 model. The stock E700 model blew the tail out too easily which does match real life. In real life the E700 is also touchier just off center and the TDR picks up speed faster and flies on knife edge better, but they are similar weights.

I've never had a lust to buy a heli just because the model in the simulator worked well. I also get one model setup to work close enough to my helis and stick with it.

I just finished Simming for 35 minutes using a model in AccuRC that I don't own in real life. The Logo 600 model works well for me for what I'm working on right now. I'm running it at about 1800 rpm and flying very low to the ground so I have to react instantly if anything goes wrong. It's a lot easier to find any muscle memory issues when you have no time to react.

I've found there is a noticeable difference simming while sitting down and standing up. Standing up makes it a lot more real for me. I turn off the overhead light and turn on the side spot lights in my room which even helps match the sun in the sky to the side and the shadows in the Sim if I keep the heli on the correct side of the airfield I'm using.

Taken together the following help improve the realism on my Sim.

• Off center light
• Large TV
• Standing
• Using my normal harness and TX
• Setting up a model that flies like mine

It is a lot easier to stay focused if you have specific goals and a plan for what you want to work on and follow it. I have a few very specific goals that I'm working on and switch between goals each time I crash.

Some people say flying a sim takes all the worry about of it. I tend to feel that if I can't keep the heli out of the dirt in the sim that will be my heli in real life so I sometimes still wince when it goes down.

[MariaFan]

Originally Posted by jmtyndall

don't bother flying micros in the sim. Fly a 700

That's what I figured the answer would be.

[fastblade]

Originally Posted by wab223

I was going to say it tells me you have not tried all the sims.

Then I watched you flying that X7, I read that you are old like me and only started 3 years ago. So I decided " I am not worthy".

Great Flying!

Thank you!... Thank you!... too kind .... You made a old man grin ear to ear (but I don't really consider myself old) (40+ year olds are still in the olympics and winning)(I'm 49 next month).... All my heli buddies are 15-20 years younger than me... they are all some kind of team pilot... they all say I'm living proof that simming works... I flew a total of 27 actual flights last year.... and only 12 actual flights this year the 12th being this video... I'm always stuck behind this computer working... So yes I sim alot... (but not lately)... I just down-loaded the demo again for heli-X (been awhile since I touched it) ... It does feel nice.... Hurricanes actually feel more real on it than RF... but not sure about rainbows... walking tick-tocs (my move...see video) feel real also...Seems to have to much power but will see if I can adjust it... It's all what feels good to you in the end... But here is my video that I'm pretty proud of for those who haven't seen it... not all my moves...I was testing my new set-up... so yes I really was taking it easy...gotta adjust the cyclic gain still.... hope next year to have a killer video (my season is basically over...too cold...lol)... I'm in no hurry so I try to just add one or two moves a year... So yes I'll be simming a lot more this winter (you motivated me again) and try to get out more to the field next season...... Enjoy all and thanks again!

Gaui x7 14s yge320 072515 (2 min 5 sec)

P.s. The YGE320 is the only ESC I haven't blown-up.... lol....
P.s.s. The YGE320 is really small.... fits in the canopy no problem...

[jbrandt]

I use Phoenix. I wouldn't really call myself a fanboi, but it does the job well enough for me to want to recommend it to others. It's entertaining because I can fly MANY different aircraft, both rotary and fixed wing.

I haven't tried others, though, even the free ones. I don't see the point in spending another $50-$150 on another pay simulator. The one I use works just fine. I don't see the point in trying one of the "free" ones, either, not because I'd be afraid of finding out that I "wasted" my money on Phoenix, but because they aren't actually free (you always seem to need some sort of adapter etc...) and again, Phoenix works, and I'm lazy and don't see a need to endlessly experiment to find the "best and most realistic" simulator.

Finding the "most realistic" simulator, IMO, is pointless. We're talking about simulators, not replicators. The most realistic flight training is flying in REAL life, there is no substitute. Even the people on Star Trek knew the holodeck was fake...

I can certainly see the allure in experimenting with sims for the folks out there who like to tinker and play around with software etc... but like I said, I'm lazy so that's not for me.

For all you who fly sims in the winter because of the weather, I'd make some crack about putting your man pants on and fly in the snow, but I live in CA, so what do I know about "weather"...

[Nelsonisms]

I own both Phoenix and RealFlight and have them both installed on my computer. But the main reason I use RealFlight the most is because I can just use the USB transmitter (Interlink Elite). I find that alone makes me want to sim more since it's more like a peripheral that is always plugged into my PC. There's no worrying about whether the transmitter is charged, the right model is selected, the programming is correct, etc. Plus you get the extra features of being able to reset the model and navigate some of the menus right from the controller. I know people will say they like using their real transmitter, but it's close enough for me that it doesn't throw me off. If it wasn't for that convenience factor I wouldn't use it nearly as much.

One thing I like about Phoenix is that their multiplayer stuff is better. So that's pretty much why I keep Phoenix which is for some online sessions we do from time to time with members of our club.

[jmtyndall]

Originally Posted by jbrandt

I use Phoenix. I wouldn't really call myself a fanboi, but it does the job well enough for me to want to recommend it to others. It's entertaining because I can fly MANY different aircraft, both rotary and fixed wing.

I haven't tried others, though, even the free ones. I don't see the point in spending another $50-$150 on another pay simulator. The one I use works just fine. I don't see the point in trying one of the "free" ones, either, not because I'd be afraid of finding out that I "wasted" my money on Phoenix, but because they aren't actually free (you always seem to need some sort of adapter etc...) and again, Phoenix works, and I'm lazy and don't see a need to endlessly experiment to find the "best and most realistic" simulator.

Finding the "most realistic" simulator, IMO, is pointless. We're talking about simulators, not replicators. The most realistic flight training is flying in REAL life, there is no substitute. Even the people on Star Trek knew the holodeck was fake...

I can certainly see the allure in experimenting with sims for the folks out there who like to tinker and play around with software etc... but like I said, I'm lazy so that's not for me.

For all you who fly sims in the winter because of the weather, I'd make some crack about putting your man pants on and fly in the snow, but I live in CA, so what do I know about "weather"...

If I could "sim" on a holodeck, that would be great. I would spend all day there.

[dominoedge]

I wish I could take the physics from AccuRC and combine it with all the models from RF and then combine that with the quick menu from neXt with the training from Heli-X -- then I would have the ultimate sim.

[Canadian_Jesus]

Ok guys, I'm a little baffled here. I've been officially flying helis (Coax to fixed pitch to CP) for 3 years now. Before I bought Phoenix last Thursday, I was able to fly FFF on my mCPX BL and 180CFX.

Local weather hasn't permitted me to fly my actual helis in a few days now so I've been simming like a madman. In Phoenix, with zero EXPO and the 'difficulty' setting set to maximum, I'm doing loops, flips, aileron rolls in FFF and tic tocs. All of this without crashing unless I go nuts with it. Is this normal for someone who's been flying without a sim for so long?

I haven't been able (weather permitting) to try out any of these moves on a real heli since I bought the sim on Thursday. I don't know if I can do this in real life or not but to me the sim seems fairly real (I have Strabismus in both eyes and therefore can only focus one of them at a time so I effectively only see in 2D anyways).

Is it conceivable that I had the skills to do hard sport flying all along and it was just fear of crashing that prevented me from performing to my fullest ability? I'll try and report back if it's not windy here tomorrow and I can get my mCPX up and flying IRL.

[Canadian_Jesus]

Originally Posted by MariaFan

What seems to be the best sim for a mCPX heli?

You can actually fly an mCPX V2 in Phoenix. It's pretty close, it even simulates motor bogging. The plus side is that the tail will not blow out. I find it pretty close to the Nano. The 130X in Phoenix I find closely matches the performance of my mCPX BL.

[atomic]

neXt Heli best so far imho.

[fastblade]

"K" just tried Accu again with a goblin 700... waaaay to powerful and light... I put the 4035 motor in it... should be bogging like crazy... how do you adjust this...feels like it's on 24s or something...

[Raz0rSh4rp]

Switch off the Collective Manager (set to 0%) in the FBL settings. This will allow the motor to bog. Also try the ACCURC Medium blades if this still doesn't help. Lastly turn down your HS a little bit until it feels right.