Help on rainbow

[dcaccount]

Hello,

I have started working on rainbow that I like very much.

Can anyone please advise some tips especially as to the backward arch (the one inverted) that seems to be the most difficult one to shape?

Thanks a lot. Daniele

[RogerRabit]

??

FB or FBL?

n a precise adjusted FBL Bird it is a no brainer figure.

Just use the sticks gentle.

Do not apply sharp ail but soft and controlled with pitch.
Leave the pitch in LONG and catch the heli in the last part.

Where is your problem?

is it going sideways away? Then you probably have steered in some roll or the rudder in the movement.

At the end you have to learn anyway to correct through the whole path, it is a matter of training.

[dcaccount]

Originally Posted by RogerRabit

??

FB or FBL?

n a precise adjusted FBL Bird it is a no brainer figure.

Just use the sticks gentle.

Do not apply sharp ail but soft and controlled with pitch.
Leave the pitch in LONG and catch the heli in the last part.

Where is your problem?

is it going sideways away? Then you probably have steered in some roll or the rudder in the movement.

At the end you have to learn anyway to correct through the whole path, it is a matter of training.

Thanks for replying.

In the real world I fly FBL in the simulator FB, Trex 500.

The problem is the return arch, I can not shape it correctly. It climbs and then it drops suddenly with no regular arch.

Daniele

[ArchmageAU]

Originally Posted by dcaccount

Thanks for replying.

In the real world I fly FBL in the simulator FB, Trex 500.

The problem is the return arch, I can not shape it correctly. It climbs and then it drops suddenly with no regular arch.

Daniele

Like RogerRabit said, the control for a rainbow is primarily hard on the collective, but soft on the cyclics and rudder. You need to fly the entire move with the cyclics. As you pass through vertical, you are relying on momentum and thrust to stop you slipping down into the arc.

A rainbow is a power move and easier done with a higher head speed. If you are bogging at the ends, you need to adjust the collective reversal to make it less brutal (ie. slow to catch the heli instead of wall stopping the ends).

For me, nice looking rainbows have gentle reversals, stops like hitting walls.

Is this a shallow angle rainbow or a big wide arc? Big wide arc's almost stop flat and have a lazy feel to them, shallow angle are like a slow tic-toc.

[dcaccount]

Originally Posted by ArchmageAU

Like RogerRabit said, the control for a rainbow is primarily hard on the collective, but soft on the cyclics and rudder. You need to fly the entire move with the cyclics. As you pass through vertical, you are relying on momentum and thrust to stop you slipping down into the arc.

A rainbow is a power move and easier done with a higher head speed. If you are bogging at the ends, you need to adjust the collective reversal to make it less brutal (ie. slow to catch the heli instead of wall stopping the ends).

For me, nice looking rainbows have gentle reversals, stops like hitting walls.

Is this a shallow angle rainbow or a big wide arc? Big wide arc's almost stop flat and have a lazy feel to them, shallow angle are like a slow tic-toc.

Thanks for replying.

Would be possible for you to record a brief Phoenix session lowering the simulator speed and showing the controls in mode 1? You can then mail the file to me.

It would be very helpful, many thanks, daniele

[ArchmageAU]

Originally Posted by dcaccount

Thanks for replying.

Would be possible for you to record a brief Phoenix session lowering the simulator speed and showing the controls in mode 1? You can then mail the file to me.

It would be very helpful, many thanks, daniele

The following message has the Heli-X recordings from "From tail-in to all 8s and funnels in 6 months" https://www.helifreak.com/showthread...69#post5276169

Lesson 3: https://www.helifreak.com/attachment...8&d=1378454469, I do some very average rainbows while demonstrating differt flip and roll exercises.

This recording will run in the demo version of heli-x without any controller. You can turn on stick view and tell the stick view that it is mode 1.

Originally Posted by ArchmageAU

...
Each of the attachments is a zip file renamed for a mov so I can attach them to HeliFreak. Download the .mov file. Extract into the resources\flights directory (should create the ArchmageAU/Lesson<x> flight directory and file. When you start Heli-X, the lesson(s) unpacked will be available (Lesson 1-12, my HF icon as preview).

Tell me if you need me to re-record some specific rainbows for you and attach. (Also have facility to YouTube the sessions now ).

I am assuming your are doing tail down large-arc rainbows.

[dcaccount]

Originally Posted by ArchmageAU

The following message has the Heli-X recordings from "From tail-in to all 8s and funnels in 6 months" https://www.helifreak.com/showthread...69#post5276169

Lesson 3: https://www.helifreak.com/attachment...8&d=1378454469, I do some very average rainbows while demonstrating differt flip and roll exercises.

This recording will run in the demo version of heli-x without any controller. You can turn on stick view and tell the stick view that it is mode 1.



Tell me if you need me to re-record some specific rainbows for you and attach. (Also have facility to YouTube the sessions now ).

I am assuming your are doing tail down large-arc rainbows.

First of all many thanks.
Yes, you are correct, I am learning tail down large-arc rainbows.

Actually when I click on Lesson 3, there is a Lesson3.mov file. Is that the file that I need to load into Heli-X?

Then, I dare ask, would you mind sending me or advising where I can find a lesson with nose and tail down funnels always at lower speed and mode 1?

Thank you so much.

By the way, I am practising a lot the slow piros you advised me to work on a while ago.

Since then, I have started dialing in the backward flight, I could not even think of earlier!
THANKS!
Daniele

[ArchmageAU]

Originally Posted by dcaccount

First of all many thanks.
Yes, you are correct, I am learning tail down large-arc rainbows.

Actually when I click on Lesson 3, there is a Lesson3.mov file. Is that the file that I need to load into Heli-X?

Then, I dare ask, would you mind sending me or advising where I can find a lesson with nose and tail down funnels always at lower speed and mode 1?

Thank you so much.

By the way, I am practising a lot the slow piros you advised me to work on a while ago.

Since then, I have started dialing in the backward flight, I could not even think of earlier!
THANKS!
Daniele

The .mov file is actually a .zip (cannot post .zip as an attachment on HeliFreak, so I rename it to .mov for the downloader to rename).

This is the Heil-X recording file from:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zB0nT...tailpage#t=116

The rainbows are not that great, but the idea was to show what can be done. In each one, I stop at the ends as I am doing them side-on (which is my weakest orientation).

For mode 1, just swap the vertical on the left and right sticks (ie. for mode 1, right stick does full throw and left down half or less, any left-right adjustment is done on the right (throttle stick) and any rudder adjustment (should be none) is done on the left (elevator) stick).

[blade450]

Just a quick tip, I've just tried it on the sim, and the flatter you level the disc out, the easier it gets to just give collective and create a good arch. Of course there's elevator involved but if you don't flatten it out, the helicopter will keep going down very fast.

If you set the helicopter up correctly before adding collective you only need to find the perfect amount of collective in combination with elevator. The amount of elevator needed depends on the amount of pitch given of course, but if you keep the pitch consistent the amount of elevator will be the same too.

Basically, it's all about how you level the disc before starting the arch.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

[Stubbz]

Sounds like your using to much elevator to tip it forward and backwards, it gets very high up when you go to far, not far enough and it'll fall into the ground tail first.

[dcaccount]

Hello,

I have attached a brief Phoenix session where I try rainbows.

Could you please check it (especially 2nd attempt) and advise what I am doing wrong?

As said, I can not shape the backward inverted arch. It comes out ugly and half of the size of the first one. Not only, in its end it looks like the hely is returning to the original point.

I can not figure out what is wrong.

Thanks for helping, Daniele

[ArchmageAU]

Originally Posted by dcaccount

Hello,

I have attached a brief Phoenix session where I try rainbows.

Could you please check it (especially 2nd attempt) and advise what I am doing wrong?

As said, I can not shape the backward inverted arch. It comes out ugly and half of the size of the first one. Not only, in its end it looks like the hely is returning to the original point.

I can not figure out what is wrong.

Thanks for helping, Daniele

1) Look likes your Phonenix is not calibrated properly for inverted power flight (inverted does not climb as fast as upright).
2) You need to arrest ALL lateral (forward) motion when inverted before the return path. Leave it more at an angle at the end of the catch to stop it quicker.
3) Spend a little more time on the inverted climb to ensure momentum (you got to a 45 degree angle too early (not enough momentum) and started to slip off the return curve).

But re-calibrate your controller to Phoenix first so inverted climb is as aggressive at full collective as upright.

[dcaccount]

Originally Posted by ArchmageAU

1) Look likes your Phonenix is not calibrated properly for inverted power flight (inverted does not climb as fast as upright).
2) You need to arrest ALL lateral (forward) motion when inverted before the return path. Leave it more at an angle at the end of the catch to stop it quicker.
3) Spend a little more time on the inverted climb to ensure momentum (you got to a 45 degree angle too early (not enough momentum) and started to slip off the return curve).

But re-calibrate your controller to Phoenix first so inverted climb is as aggressive at full collective as upright.

Thanks for the attention.

I have recalibrated the controller. But why the return arch comes always shorter than the forward one?

Daniele

[ArchmageAU]

Originally Posted by dcaccount

Thanks for the attention.

I have recalibrated the controller. But why the return arch comes always shorter than the forward one?

Daniele

You transition through the 45 degree angle quicker (and with less vertical speed) on the return arc than the forward arc.

Try doing a rainbow starting from inverted (so inverted -> upright -> inverted).

Try this:
- From stable hover upright, tilt rotor 45 degrees and punch full positive collective. Note acceleration, both climb and lateral.
- From stable hover inverted, tilt rotor 45 degrees and punch full negative collective. Note speed, both climb and lateral.
(They should be the same).

Just thought, do you have wind enabled in the sim? Each Rainbow in the vid was a single direction. What happens if you do them in reverse (right to left upright, left to right inverted).

[dcaccount]

Originally Posted by ArchmageAU

You transition through the 45 degree angle quicker (and with less vertical speed) on the return arc than the forward arc.

Try doing a rainbow starting from inverted (so inverted -> upright -> inverted).

Try this:
- From stable hover upright, tilt rotor 45 degrees and punch full positive collective. Note acceleration, both climb and lateral.
- From stable hover inverted, tilt rotor 45 degrees and punch full negative collective. Note speed, both climb and lateral.
(They should be the same).

Just thought, do you have wind enabled in the sim? Each Rainbow in the vid was a single direction. What happens if you do them in reverse (right to left upright, left to right inverted).

You are correct, it depended on the wind!

Thank you so much, daniele