Anyone used a DJI Naza H in a heli?

[gunny_jeeves]

Just curious if it operates similar to the normal Naza with gps rth, and auto land functions.

I know the way it works in attitude and gps hold is the same.

It's a big deal if it can fly a heli back, then land and stop the throttle. That's pretty cool.

I heard it was being discontinued, but saw it plus a Wookong H as well.

[MotorG525]

skookum 720 units can do that as well, they fly much better too. Naza was never know for being the best "feeling" unit

[gunny_jeeves]

I'd agree about that (Not wanting that DJI Feeling for me...). So out of curiosity, price wise how would Skookum compare?

DJI - $380 ish
Skookum - 720? Then GPS? The setting that up? Easy / Hard?

Its a freaking cool idea to me to conceptually have a rescue that goes back to spot and lands itself. I'm the type that I can fandangle something on another radio to do that OH Crap switch too. So it's interesting.

[crashmaster swash]

The naza H can not take off in gps mode, nor land in it!

Wookong can do that. My dad has 2 wookong and 1 naza h helis. apart from the land and take off feature in gps mode there is not much difference between these, except for price.

For a total noob you would probably want the wookong. Its scary to see it in the air, almost totally still.

[gunny_jeeves]

Wait.. so just then it doesn't do the thing I'd expect...

Naza M even lite plus GPS --> Fly off to the edge of the trees and turn off radio... It pops up into the air couple hundred feet, flies straight to where it took off from... Waits, and if no signal, descends and lands then powers off rotors...

Does the Naza H with GPS do the same or similar? Its weird, but if I am flying it I will land it, but if Son's flying and he flips out, I would like to have that type of panic mode.

Edit: If I am reading right, the 720 plus gps will cost around $800 basically on sale, compared to 1/2 that for the Naza H, and I can't find a place to actually buy the wookong H.

I would think the logic would be the same for either a multirotor or heli once you got to where you can fly it. (Fly up. Go over here... Come down at x descent rate... Blip on land, turn off motors.) it's not that much of a stretch.

[gunny_jeeves]

Just was getting some Christmas ordering in, and for daughters quad, going with a Naza lite plus gps. In researching, the heli part came up.

If you have seen that system return to home and land stuff, it's awesome! There is no reason why this wouldn't work on a heli, but in the heli world that's one hell of a leap to go from "pop back level" or "stay still" mode to autonomous flight and landing of a heli, even if it really is not anything new or beyond the expected behavior of about any quad with gps.

[eenoph]

It doesn't have rth, ioc, and autoland features. Only wookong h and aceone have it. I think on helis no need for rth and autoland. If in panic, just flick to gps mode and realese all sticks. You can easily fly it back home cause it easier to regain orientation on helis than multis.

And note, naza's atti gps mode is not for rescue/bailout, but just for flying aid. It help when learning orientation or on smooth scale flying.

[gunny_jeeves]

Cool. I get that the heli is easier to regain orientation, and agree that IOC is useless on a heli...

Idk... The Ikon can go into, and stay in self level for flying around. Same thing minus gps hold.

Just saying the naza has right gear to control:
Altitude
Attitude
Position
And speed...

Would it be so different to land itself?

[earhythmic]

I flew the Naza H for a little bit when starting. Still have it. Want it for $100?!

[crashmaster swash]

I don't think the wookong will automatically return home and land either (it will land in gps mode though). Probably only the a2 and skookum will do that.

[eenoph]

Originally Posted by gunny_jeeves

Cool. I get that the heli is easier to regain orientation, and agree that IOC is useless on a heli...

Idk... The Ikon can go into, and stay in self level for flying around. Same thing minus gps hold.

Just saying the naza has right gear to control:
Altitude
Attitude
Position
And speed...

Would it be so different to land itself?

I use to have naza h and now i use ikon and spirit, IMO naza's self level is far better than the other two. It can handle vibration too, unlike ikon you dont need a super smooth heli to use autolevel. Dji's multirotor experience realy shows, it fly exactly like it's MR brother. Ikon's and spirit's autolevel feels weird compared to naza-h.

But the lack of tunning ability making it less ideal for 3d flyer. No flight style, no paddle sim, no pitch boost to tweak.

[crashmaster swash]

Originally Posted by gunny_jeeves

Wait.. so just then it doesn't do the thing I'd expect...

Naza M even lite plus GPS --> Fly off to the edge of the trees and turn off radio... It pops up into the air couple hundred feet, flies straight to where it took off from... Waits, and if no signal, descends and lands then powers off rotors...

Does the Naza H with GPS do the same or similar?.

it DEFINITELY will not! Neither will the wookong as far as I know.

[crashmaster swash]

Also one thing to consider is this: naza h is discontinued for any odd reason. You buy what you buy here really.

There are limitations regarding the max allowable tilt (15 deg or so) of the heli for this to work, and also max airspeed (70km/h if I'm not mistaking). Download the manuals.

DJI is selling the wookong systems now instead because these are better.

The alternative is skookum with the new gps, that is not affected by rfi/magnetic fields. even with the wookongs you have to mount the gps antenna on the boom for that crap to even work at all.

Also there are reported crashes with the naza h when changing modes in flight. Its on youtube..

if you want gps and many extras just get the full skookum pack (with the new gps module) and eliminate all vibrations.

I'm a total noob regarding cp helis, but I do actually know how to find relevant info on the internet. and if you ask me the Bavarian demon system is probably better for noobs than any of these gps systems.

And I have actually bought a bd system for my first cp heli. (i also have realflight though).

1500€ or so for a gps wookong system, you gotta be fuking kidding me...

just saying.

[Xrayted]

Originally Posted by gunny_jeeves

Wait.. so just then it doesn't do the thing I'd expect...

Naza M even lite plus GPS --> Fly off to the edge of the trees and turn off radio... It pops up into the air couple hundred feet, flies straight to where it took off from... Waits, and if no signal, descends and lands then powers off rotors...

Does the Naza H with GPS do the same or similar? Its weird, but if I am flying it I will land it, but if Son's flying and he flips out, I would like to have that type of panic mode.

Edit: If I am reading right, the 720 plus gps will cost around $800 basically on sale, compared to 1/2 that for the Naza H, and I can't find a place to actually buy the wookong H.

I would think the logic would be the same for either a multirotor or heli once you got to where you can fly it. (Fly up. Go over here... Come down at x descent rate... Blip on land, turn off motors.) it's not that much of a stretch.

SK720 does not auto land, although is has RTH. Auto landing on a heli is a very risky task vs a quad, so most simply wont do it for safety reasons even if the technology is there to do so.

Ive owned two SK GPS setups since inception, so at the moment it has a few different choices of position hold, a hard deck feature where you can set a lower threshold that the heli cannot cross or else it will rescue itself automatically and go into position hold until the pilot takes back over. Minimum deck is 5M/15F

Think Captain Rescue like the BD has here, but in this case the pilot doesn't have to hit the rescue button, but it happens automatically at a set altitude. The heli shoots up to pre determined altitude and then stops in GPS position upright hold and tail in no matter what position it was in during rescue and waits on the pilot to take back over.

There is also the exact same feature that can be activated by a switch instead of a automatic set deck level for guys who fly low and below the deck. Once again, think captain Rescue but with GPS hold and a fixed altitude at the end.

You can have both set at once if you like, so plan B rescues automatically just in case you fight it too long and don't make it to the switch in time. The system allows for up to 4 different GPS modes other than manual mode/off to be set simultaneously at once if you have enough channels to support it.

The final is a RTH where when activated, the heli turns and flies back nose in to its power up location unless otherwise set by the pilot before takeoff, goes into a hover then turns the tail into whatever position it was in when it took off and then descends down to a set level about 10M or so. It will hover there until you take back over and land.

My personal setup on my 700 is multi layered. I have a momentary button that SL only like many units can do these days as first defense. I also have a GPS rescue set to a switch, and hard deck just in case it gets away from me and I stand there dazed not doing anything but watching it come down.

Finally I have RTH set just in case it gets so far out that I lose orientation, so I can bring it back to me at the flip of a switch and take back over once I can see it again.

Had all this for a couple years now, and only used it for real once so far. It was on my Goblin which crashes can be expensive, so I think the $450 GPS add on cost could potentially be a wash at this point since I already owned the FBL unit anyway, but definitely if a second save ever occurs.

The tech is super cool to play with one way or the other though

[crashmaster swash]

One cool thing to add to all these fancy systems would be laser rangefinders/distance meters. You would need like 6-8 or so on a heli for this to work. If you drop below 1.00m the heli would autoengage rescue and fly to the moon...

I mean these laser measuring modules can't be that expensive. I'm alsmost certain its all software and enterpteting of numbers anyway.

[crashmaster swash]

Also from what I have read these rescue functions only works when the heli is fairly vibration free. since usually this is handled by an accelerometer and these things actually max out somewhere. Usually in the normal vibration range of the copter. Supposedly the bavarian demon systems don't utilize accelerometers for this and hence they dont give a f about vibrations but still work.

corfrect me if i'm wrong here, but this seems to be the consensus.

[gunny_jeeves]

Originally Posted by Xrayted

The final is a RTH where when activated, the heli turns and flies back nose in to its takeoff location unless otherwise set by the pilot, goes into a hover then turns the tail into whatever position it was in when it took off and then descends down to a set level about 10M or so in the air. It will hover there until you take back over and land.

That's a good option. Pretty tight actually. RTH comes up safe altitude, back over take off spot, and hangs. That's not bad.

I want to grab up something that will make a large and dangerous heli fly very similar to a quad. The end result of that is a confidence inspiring heli for my son to whip around.

Ikon can be flown about in self level, though that is not recommended, and son would have to set this, as I bet it will freak out if taking off.

Bottom line:
Skookum 720+GPS is probably best option, bar none, but priced out of my budget.
Naza H is probably the TRUE best option for me... though priced higher than I want to pay by a big margin.
Ikon is possibly my best bet short term, but I realize I need to have some time to do a little tuning on it.

Just need to figure - $140 Ikon with Self Level, vs $380 Naza H. (I really don't give a rats you-know-what if its discontinued, as long as it works NOW.) But I'm sure not beneath using that to garner a deal on it to maybe get it into the $200-$300 range.

I gotta give this a whirl. Have some DT parts coming, and will build out a DT600 for this test. Have Ikon on hand too, so will give it a whirl with that first.

We'll see. Thanks for all the info! (I may have many differences with folks on HF, but this forum means the world to me!) It definitely has cured a lot of "Stupid" but may not cure all of my "Stubborn".

[Xrayted]

Originally Posted by crashmaster swash

One cool thing to add to all these fancy systems would be laser rangefinders/distance meters. You would need like 6-8 or so on a heli for this to work. If you drop below 1.00m the heli would autoengage rescue and fly to the moon...

I mean these laser measuring modules can't be that expensive. I'm alsmost certain its all software and enterpteting of numbers anyway.

Skookum just released a laser altimeter available now. The GPS still has dual barometers in it like the original GPS, but now the unit can switch between those and the laser depending on which is more accurate for the current circumstance.

http://www.skookumrobotics.com/shop/...products_id/55

[Xrayted]

Originally Posted by gunny_jeeves

That's a good option. Pretty tight actually. RTH comes up safe altitude, back over take off spot, and hangs. That's not bad.

I want to grab up something that will make a large and dangerous heli fly very similar to a quad. The end result of that is a confidence inspiring heli for my son to whip around.

Ikon can be flown about in self level, though that is not recommended, and son would have to set this, as I bet it will freak out if taking off.

Bottom line:
Skookum 720+GPS is probably best option, bar none, but priced out of my budget.
Naza H is probably the TRUE best option for me... though priced higher than I want to pay by a big margin.
Ikon is possibly my best bet short term, but I realize I need to have some time to do a little tuning on it.

Just need to figure - $140 Ikon with Self Level, vs $380 Naza H. (I really don't give a rats you-know-what if its discontinued, as long as it works NOW.) But I'm sure not beneath using that to garner a deal on it to maybe get it into the $200-$300 range.

I gotta give this a whirl. Have some DT parts coming, and will build out a DT600 for this test. Have Ikon on hand too, so will give it a whirl with that first.

We'll see. Thanks for all the info! (I may have many differences with folks on HF, but this forum means the world to me!) It definitely has cured a lot of "Stupid" but may not cure all of my "Stubborn".

Why not the Spirit which is about $210 and uses the same rescue and SL technology as the Bavarian Demon. Seems to fit in between price wise and uses a well known rescue and Horizon mode if you want fly in SL mode continuously.

I have no personal experience with it, but the BD is tried and true by many, and the Spirit is the lower cost version of its exact same rescue features and technology features. I don't think you will find anyone that says the rescue on the Ikon is better than the BD, so if GPS is out, and cost is a factror I would consider Spirit over Ikon.

BTW, just so you understand, the GPS on the Naza was NEVER intended as a rescue tool! It will not rescue anything and does not work inverted. You get completely out of sorts or flip it over and you are still going to crash GPS or not.

You must be at a complete upright stop before even engaging the GPS on the NAZA, so hardly any rescue situation. Its just a basic GPS tool for position hold or limiting the angle or speed the heli can pushed around with cyclic when engaged, hence the much lower cost. Only the Skookum at this point is a purpose built 3D heli rescue device using GPS designed to work in any situation or orientation.

[gunny_jeeves]

I get how the Ikon and other 6 axis systems use accelerometers. I also get how vibration affects this. What I don't get is how BD can pull this off without those sensors. (Well I mean I kinda do get it... They use DIFFERENT sensors that are less prone to vibration.)

I'd use the Naza H if I can get my hands on one for cheaper. And I'd expect it to have no issues taking off in ATTITUDE mode... with GPS hold later by a switch.

I'd also expect to be OK with an Ikon as I am planning a fairly low head speed on an already buttery smooth heli. My crux there is take off and landing while self level is on. Don't want it to freak out, because my son will too, then his heli flying days will be over.

Blade actually did the self level extremely well here, and they should as this is their market segment who really wants / needs it. I don't see my son becoming a 3D pilot, or busting his rear to keep up with the other folks, but I see him really enjoying a big heli he can fly and control rather easily, and that's what I want to deliver for him.

I have Ikon here, so I can try that out. If I don't, I may have other options that are more "Creative" in which I use a wireless buddy box with him. (Only use a real switch for the buddy box part, and the momentary switch for bail out.) If the Naza H makes the heli fly basically like a Naza in a quad, that's exactly what I want here. The RTH was just icing anyway.

Thanks guys!