Looking for a new 450 size

[Raddish]

I have been looking at getting a 450 size bird, I was looking at getting a Goblin 380 but far to expensive as I still sometimes crash and I think it would be waisted on me at the moment, maybe next year...

So for about the money I want to spend I could get a Blade 360 cfx or Trex 450l dominator 6s with beastx...

What would you do?

[Dylan Hudock]

I am just tossing my opinion out here, but you should take a look at the Gaui X3. I flew a 450 dfc, gutted it and put everything into the X3, and could not be happier. It is a very nice kit, especially for $200. From my experience, and others, it crashes like a tank. Flies very smooth, almost like a bigger heli.

[gimbleguy]

Originally Posted by Raddish

I have been looking at getting a 450 size bird, I was looking at getting a Goblin 380 but far to expensive as I still sometimes crash and I think it would be waisted on me at the moment, maybe next year...

So for about the money I want to spend I could get a Blade 360 cfx or Trex 450l dominator 6s with beastx...

What would you do?

if you're still kinda crashing, and cost is an issue, which is understandable(UK prices). Find the heli that you can get parts easily from your local area, also see which one is cheaper on parts and delivery.

[Raddish]

Originally Posted by Dylan Hudock

I am just tossing my opinion out here, but you should take a look at the Gaui X3. I flew a 450 dfc, gutted it and put everything into the X3, and could not be happier. It is a very nice kit, especially for $200. From my experience, and others, it crashes like a tank. Flies very smooth, almost like a bigger heli.

I have looked at the X3, but it seems to be another league price wise compared to the 450l or 360cfx...

[CrashNburn420]

You can build an X3 for about the same price as a 450L. Maybe even a little less depending on what you put in it.

I have a bunch of flights on a 450 Pro V2 and now have a 450L. I wouldn't get the 450L unless you're not crashing a lot and proficient at landing. It's a bitch to change out the TT gears compared to the old design. You pretty much have to remove one side of the frame to get the boom block out. I really like how it flies though, just not a fan of the maintenance side of it.


You can get a Pro (325 size) dirt cheap. Around $150-200 plus a fbl unit.

[Raddish]

Originally Posted by CrashNburn420

You can build an X3 for about the same price as a 450L. Maybe even a little less depending on what you put in it.

I have a bunch of flights on a 450 Pro V2 and now have a 450L. I wouldn't get the 450L unless you're not crashing a lot and proficient at landing. It's a bitch to change out the TT gears compared to the old design. You pretty much have to remove one side of the frame to get the boom block out. I really like how it flies though, just not a fan of the maintenance side of it.


You can get a Pro (325 size) dirt cheap. Around $150-200 plus a fbl unit.

I'm not so sure I can build a x3 for the same as a 360 or 450l, I can get either of those for £300... I suppose it may be possible it I could pick up a second had 450 for electronics or something. Prices seem to be much more in the uk

[wbrichards28]

I vote G380. I just maidened mine about 20 minutes ago. Other than some tail wag that I need to tune out it's amaizing. It will even auto a little from about 4'. No need to put expensive electronics in it either. I figure you could have it in the air for way under $1k. There is a really good deal on one in the classifieds that comes with bk servos. work a deal with him. I'm also using the Neuron fbl, that has bailout($150). You can get the motor for under $100, and the ESC for about $55 with afw. Using the coupon of course through hobbywingdirect. It's very stable if you tune it that way. Or, it will fly CRAZY! I flipped it over to mode 3 I put in full 3D mode and holy crap.........I think I spent more money on micros and other smaller cheaper birds trying to get them to fly right than I have on this build with all the upgrades.

I'll make you a killer deal on a kontronik koby90lv too.

[Blade Scraper]

Originally Posted by Raddish

I have been looking at getting a 450 size bird, I was looking at getting a Goblin 380 but far to expensive as I still sometimes crash and I think it would be waisted on me at the moment, maybe next year...

So for about the money I want to spend I could get a Blade 360 cfx or Trex 450l dominator 6s with beastx...

What would you do?

Between those two? I would go with Trex now that it has BeastX available with it. Whatever the price difference up front, its become so familiar a theme that its become almost cliché: whatever you might save on the Blade heli up front, you will pay more dearly for later in more expensive crash parts and possible upgrades.

There's just so much competition in the 450 class that its truly a buyers market here now. And I'm inferring from your candidate list that you are looking for a BNF 450 and not a kit 450 (which expands the field of options considerably).

In the 150-250 size range its a whole other story: very little in that size range to pick from, and its a gap I wish would begin filling up with a few more options then what's out there now to pick from.

But in the 450 class... its almost like the sky is the limit in terms of options.

[Blade Scraper]

Originally Posted by CrashNburn420

You can build an X3 for about the same price as a 450L.

I wish I had access to your LHS then. Here the difference in price is not quite trivial, and very much in Align's favour. If I had been able to fly it when I bought my Chase 360, and had I not therefore been looking for a kit winter project to build, then I might have gone Align: it may not be the revolutionary heli the X3 comes off sounding like whenever its mentioned, but the Align is still a proven, dependable design that, with BeastX, offers a lot of bang for the buck these days. The X3 was just not within my budget for a 450.

And a lot of why I didn't pick the Trex then was Gpro. I think that weighed into the equation pretty heavily too. If it were summer when I bought, and the Trex came with BeastX then, I would have bought the Trex. Even with Gpro, had it been summer, I might have still gone with the Trex.

Ironically, while waiting on parts for my Chase 360, its the unofficial Align 450 forum and Finless Bob's Trex 450 build videos, that I've started looking to for more general build info even though its for a different heli. I say ironic, because here I am now reading Trex threads after not buying the Trex.

But this is not a knock in any way on the Chase 360 either: smaller community there and I've already devoured all of its reading material as I continue moving at a snail's pace forward while waiting on snail mail servos from Banggood.

[CrashNburn420]

What do you pay for an align kit in Canada?

Does nobody sell x3 kits in Canada or are they just marked up? When I built one it was within $100 of a 450 combo.

[Blade Scraper]

Originally Posted by CrashNburn420

What do you pay for an align kit in Canada?

Does nobody sell x3 kits in Canada or are they just marked up? When I built one it was within $100 of a 450 combo.

It was less when I bought my my Chase 360 in November (both were on sale for 30%), and that one was with Gpro. Now the Trex 450L Dominator Super Combo with BeastX is on sale (15% off): $493 US (regular price $580 US). The 450 Plus DFC BNF with Gpro is also on sale again, 20% off: $368 US (regular price $460 US). The latter was the one I passed on for the Chase 360 combo kit.

They only have the X3 bare bones kit listed: $209 US. An apples to apples comparison (regular prices) that's an extra $159 US for the Trex DFC Plus BNF versus a bare bones X3. The Dominator is $334 more with BeastX over the barebones X3. Again, that's strictly comparing them on price and price alone.

Doesn't sound like a big price difference, but after you factor in all of the electronics you need to make the X3 as flyable as the Align kits, its not a trivial amount: motor, FBL, ESC, servos, Rx... here the MicroBeast Plus alone is $180 US. So an X3 bare kit plus BeastX comes in at just under a $100 less than the complete Dominator kit - but you still need to add the rest of the electronics to complete it.

Unless you are going with cheap cloned electronics on the X3 (which kind of kills the point of it IMHO), the total package price for the Trex (either version) is tough to beat.

Since I got my Chase 360 at 30% off on BF sale, its total build price is close to (but still a little higher) than the Align. The only compromise I've made on the electronics is on the swash servos: KST 215MGs, which are very inexpensive and will get the job done. But had I paid regular price, I would have been in X3 territory. Although on the X3 I would have went KST servos all around and with an Align 450mx motor to keep the price down but without any significant concessions.

The X3 was my original plan. The BF sale I was hoping to just get some electronics toward it, but because of the low price (30% off plus bonus 6S lipo) on the Chase combo kit I couldn't resist.

But in the US maybe its not so big a difference in price. That's why I suggested the OP cost it out to see what the difference is. If its within what he can afford, then the X3 is a good choice. If the budget is tight or he doesn't want a kit heli, then I'd take a Trex BNF over a 360 CFX. Personal choice there: I'm okay going as high as the 180 CFX within the Blade lineup, because I think Blade delivers enough of the goods to make it worth buying within a niche where there is very little to choose from.

But no way would I pay 450 size bucks on a Blade heli. Again, just personal choice there based on alternatives in the 450 range and Blade's parts pricing.

[CrashNburn420]

I figure most people won't buy a brand new fbl unit. You can get them used on here for under a $100, even the AR7200bx have been selling for $80 lately. A set of KST cyclics is $75, $45 for the kst515 tail servo. $60 for an align 460mx and a hobbywing 50a for $50. Blades will be another $30-40.

You're under $600 compared to $500 for an align kit. $100 really isn't that much of a difference. Being in Canada you might not be able to get the used prices though, since a lot of people won't ship to you.

[Blade Scraper]

Originally Posted by CrashNburn420

Being in Canada you might not be able to get the used prices though, since a lot of people won't ship to you.

That's a moot point in my case: I don't order from the US (new or used) because of the fleecing we take on international shipping, plus the unknown variables on customs and duties fees. Its just not worth it. Once you factor those costs in I'm probably pretty close to the cost of new domestically, but on a domestic order the shipping is free. Plus I know exactly what I'm getting buying new, have the warranty and a no-hassle return policy as well.

So its irrelevant to me whether or not they will when I'm not interested in looking.

My Banggood servos were an easy decision because their international air shipping is free. Which kind of blows my mind: I can have anything flown in from the other side of the world at no cost. But to have it shipped cross-border the shipping cost involved has torpedoed it on every single heli item I've looked at buying new from the US.

Plus there is the exchange rate to factor in now as well: at 70 cents US, our dollar doesn't go far right now on the item or toward the high cost of shipping that is also in US dollars.

[Blade Scraper]

Originally Posted by CrashNburn420

I figure most people won't buy a brand new fbl unit. You can get them used on here for under a $100, even the AR7200bx have been selling for $80 lately.

AR7200bx is a step up from Gpro, but its using the old version of BeastX rather than the new version. The Align ships with the new version: MicroBeast Plus, which is also what I bought for my FBL:

The Specs to compare the one versus the other:

AR7200bx:

Integrated BeastX® 3-axis MEMS gyro
250- to 800-size helicopters
Easy-access design for field adjustments
DSMX® safety and control
Flight log telemetry-compatible
11ms frame rate
2048 resolution

MicroBeast Plus:

Input voltage: 3,5 V - 8,5 V DC (Operation with 2 cell LiPo possible)

Processor: 32 Bit ARM

Sensor: 6-Axis MEMS (Gyro + Accelerometer)

The MicroBeast Plus includes a Governor and an option to upgrade to Rescue via Pro (which can be downloaded, at a fee, and setup with StudioX).

Also the AR7200bx assumes everyone is using Spektrum's DSM2/DSMX protocol, which is a false assumption. I don't want my FBL to be locked into Spektrum technology because I'm not planning to stick with Spektrum for much longer: I'm intending to have a Taranis X9D+ radio and X8R Rx to plug into the FBL's s-bus by the time I'm ready to maiden the Chase.

The new AR7210bx is Spektrum's updated model that incorporates the new MicroBeast Plus (same as on the Trex and same as I have). Its $220 from Horizon Hobbies: $40 more than standalone MicroBeast Plus. The X8R Rx is bundled with the X9D+ Transmitter, so since I'm upgrading my radio, I save $40 on an apples-to-apples comparison rather than your discontinued older model versus the new one Align includes and which HH integrates into what replaced the AR7200bx.

Of course, if you're buying something obsolete (discontinued) and buying it used, it should be cheap. $80 US sounds about right. But that's not what Align is shipping with their BeastX equipped Trex. So on your example, you're under $100 difference - but with a mix of new and obsolete electronics versus an all new Trex with the new BeastX FBL.

I'm not convinced of the 'savings' or value in your example. If the X3 is a Ferrari, then you're essentially talking about buying the Ferrari chassis and popping in a mix of Ferrari level stuff combined with some used Kia parts to keep the cost down.

[Larryu]

Any helicopter you buy is going to be a sum of its parts. If you buy a helicopter based solely on price you are going to get what you pay for. The Align is a good flying helicopter and parts are plentiful and cheep and you can use some of the tarot parts that are just as good the down side is it’s a pain to work on and you will be replacing curtain part in every crash like the main shaft. If you pay a little more now on an X3 you still get what you pay for, you also get to pick the parts that goes into it. It is much much easier to work on parts are fairly plentiful and also cheep the key to the X3 is you will be replacing fewer parts in a crash I’ve had mine for over a year now with many crashes and it still has the same main shaft that I bought it with. I did upgrade to a belt tail and am still using the original belt. I have the 450 plus not the 450L but it’s just a few minor differences and the X3 and I’m telling you to save up the extra money and get the X3 you won’t regret it but you may say at some point wow I wish I would have waited and gotten the X3. Just my 2 cents.

[Blade Scraper]

Originally Posted by Larryu

Any helicopter you buy is going to be a sum of its parts. If you buy a helicopter based solely on price you are going to get what you pay for.

Kind of reminds me of the old cliché too, about something being only as dependable as its weakest link.

That said, price is not always the best indicator of what you're getting because price and quality are not the same thing (this is a fallacy that our brain is wired to fall into, and which good marketers and slick salesmen have taken advantage of for decades).

Grocery stores sell no-name in-house brands that are made by the very same company, and in the same place, as the name brand product it sits next to. But people pay double the price millions of times every day for the exact same thing in another package. But its not the package you eat.

Bottom line IMHO is to figure out your budget, take into account everything you need to complete it, and only then look at your options. And when you do, look to objective sources for reviews to get a better idea of what your dollar is really buying.

If an X3 costs more, then there should be reasons its higher price is justified, and they should be clear enough for an X3 owner to state the specifics and not resort to weak generalizations (to be clear, I'm not saying you are guilty of this nor limiting the statement to the X3 or even the chosen airframe itself). Which isn't to say an X3 isn't worth more - I'm not in the market for another 450 so I have no idea.

But I am a first time kit builder so while waiting on parts, I look beyond my own 360's small community for any useful build tidbits I might stumble on (and in doing so, came across some unrelated threads like this one that I read too).

Best of luck to the OP no matter the route he takes.