#1 - Problems, Questions, Ideas

[B.Ewing]

Parts! my 6hvu has been down weeks because of a lack of parts

[quinn]

Let's try not to overload sebastion too much on this thread. I'm sure it takes a little time to get through all the posts with English as a second language. We made the parts issue known and he has answered to it.

[GimpyGolden]

Agreed, let's not insult the guy either with requests to redesign the whole lineup.
I am happy happy happy with my 6/7U as is, if I weren't I'd looks elsewhere and fly something different.

[Scott1115]

#1. +++++ for Parts availability. VERY big issue.


#2. There is an issue with the ball links for the head. The threaded rods pull out very easily; with simple finger pressure. I have re-ordered two packages and the same thing. There is an error with the castings. I started a thread here on HF and found that I am not the only one with this issue. I know a new link is on the way, but you/Compass should know that there is an issue with the current product.

THANK YOU Sebastian for responding and stepping up to answer the public and customers. Your effort means a lot to me, and I am sure other too.


~Scott

[Sebastian Zajonz]

Hello Guys,

thank you all for cooperation. I read it carefully and here is my reply now:

6HV Ultimate Servoarm interference issue with pulley – We will apply the spacers known from the old 6HV to the Ultimate kits aswell. New and longer bolts will be applied too.

6HV Ultimate belt rubbing on the maingear – Here we need to check the spacers between idler on the belt tensioner and the aluminium mount. Maybe customers with rubbing belt have to long spacers.

6HV Ultimate belt twist direction – New manual will be uploaded within the next 24 hours. Fixing many other errors.

Chronos Stretchkit – It will be worked out, but for the spring of 2015. Most likely a 760 stretch.

Ultimate Tail Blades Grips from metal – We will stay with the plastic, not because it is cheap but because it is better. The plastic takes a lot of high frequence vibration especially in combination with stiff CF-Blades or very heavy plastic tail blades. On many helicopters with total stiff tail rotors and aluminium tail blade grips you have fails like snapping bolts on the hub or even tail booms crack because of vibration. Another solution is a dampened tail rotor hub, but that cause other issues like small shake during stops and beside that it is more difficult in production.

Axial play on the tail rotor blade grips – On some its about zero, on others it is like 1,5mm. In average the play is about 1mm. This is normal, because we use a very big radius here and production can't never be that exact here. A very small tolerance of 0.03mm on the radius is causing the difference in play. We could remove the axial play totally by using a step on the hub, but this would cause fatique issues and the big radius is the best solution here.

One-Point-Tailpitch-Slider – We will stay with the one-point-slider because it's simple and don't cause any real issues. If the tail runs smooth - then it works perfect.

Y-Link from Pitchslider to tail-blade-grips – I try to work out another solution using no ball here any more and no pin. Need some time and we have other priorities first.

Roll-Pin at the Pulley – We will stay with the roll-pin here. The Ultimate-Tail is using a 2.5mm roll pin now.

Turnbuckle rods – I will check that out. I liked that idea already before. They are way more expansive, that we know for sure.

Serviceable Swashplate – denied. We use a very good bearing. We use the best quality you can get and the bearing itself cost is like 3 times of those bearings most other brand use. We will keep the design simple. I still have swashplates from the first 7HV and still zero slop there. The helicopter was flown by myself for like 600 flights and Daniel Jetschin at least 300 flights.

Weak Swash-Guide-Pin – Already changed to M2.5 one pcs. Design. 6HV Ultimate and 7HV Ultimate use the same swashplate now.

Fastening the tail boom center part to the boom – The M2.5 bolts going into the tailboom are just a savety point. The clamp on the case is the major fastening point. I can't see any reason to change that. The M2.5 bolts increase savety by far.

Dampeners worn out – It was not always like that. We are using KBDD dampeners and the problem is they don't have a constant quality. Some dampener last over 300 flights, some only 50. But a dampener is not worn when it becomes a little softer.

Mainspindle bolts – I need further information. We never had a single issue here – as far I know.

7HV is built weak – I wouldn't agree with that. Most people say the 7HV crash like a tank. The part count is very low from my experience and becomes even smaller with the Chronos.

Atom 500 Swashplate-Pin – This pin will not be changed. The bolt can only snap if the bolt becomes a little lose.

Atom 500 Tail-Case – I know its a pain to work on that but we will not change it for that model.

Delay the Chronos – We will not delay the Chronos because of the Parts-Issue. There is just no link between the very small number of parts we have in the USA and the capacity of Compass Model.

Failing Ball-Links – Its already adressed and solved. New ball-links 02-0709ST are way tighter on the rods but 02-0709S is changed now too. On some links (1 of 500 we know so far) the hole for the rod was a little too big.

Parts-Issue - Luke talked with Mike and Mike promised to increase the volume. A new order is on the way to Mike already. Beside that we are working on the situation further and we know we need to increase the volume in the USA. We just need some time here but we are sure, that we can work something out.

Thank you all for your feedback!

Sebastian Zajonz

[TheBum]

How about fixing the servo geometry in the Atom 500 to address the sharp linkage angles? The frames were designed for a flybarred head and haven't been updated.

[Mon_t]

Originally Posted by Sebastian Zajonz

Parts-Issue - Luke talked with Mike and Mike promised to increase the volume. A new order is on the way to Mike already. Beside that we are working on the situation further and we know we need to increase the volume in the USA. We just need some time here but we are sure, that we can work something out.

Sebastian Zajonz

If the ordering of parts seems an issue due to low volumes, how about the possibility of sending parts on consignment and then taking payment or a cut of the profits later.
So as this would be a big issue with most retailers, they don't want to get stung with a bunch of stock that doesn't sell and no way to reclaim those losses.

Mike has tried hard to make Compass viable in the US, and with the downturn in the popularity of helicopters the last couple of years due to the quad invasion.
Maybe there needs to be a reassessment of the way Compass does business with the wholesalers/distributors in order to make it a more profitable/viable product for them.

[Mon_t]

Originally Posted by TheBum

How about fixing the servo geometry in the Atom 500 to address the sharp linkage angles? The frames were designed for a flybarred head and haven't been updated.

This probably should have been done when the Atom had it's refresh not long ago.
The Atom has been around a very long time, I think would be pretty close to end of life, it might not be profitable to update the frames, as the case would be for the tail case.

[TheBum]

Originally Posted by Mon_t

This probably should have been done when the Atom had it's refresh not long ago.
The Atom has been around a very long time, I think would be pretty close to end of life, it might not be profitable to update the frames, as the case would be for the tail case.

Refresh? When? As far as I know, with the possible exception of the canopy color scheme and slightly different Kv stock motor, the Atom 500 is the same today as it was when I bought mine over 5 years ago.

[Mon_t]

Originally Posted by TheBum

Refresh? When? As far as I know, with the possible exception of the canopy color scheme and slightly different Kv stock motor, the Atom 500 is the same today as it was when I bought mine over 5 years ago.

Yeah that's the one (and I know it really wasn't one at all, I picked one up recently, got given a stack of parts for it from an original flybar kit and they're all still the same)
They really should have done it with the release of the fbl kits, like they did for the 6hv.
Either way, it does highlight my point that it is quite old and would be getting close to EOL.
If this was Align and I'm thankful it's not, it would have had 500 different variations for the same part by now and none of them compatible with the previous part.

[quinn]

Thank you for the updates! I agree on many of the requests that were denied. Every thing about the tail in my opinion is perfect. More parts and bearings gives more failure points and opportunities for screws coming loose. I have lost my tail once from the roll pin coming loose but I will admit that it was because of reusing the roll pin which we are told not to do. I also agree that the swashplate has excellent quality. All three of mine are still going strong after nearly a thousand flights. Zero slop unlike other brands I've flown. Also the only one I've flown that doesn't get stiff when flying in below 0 degrees F.

Great to hear confirmation of the chronos stretch! I don't really understand why it hasn't been announced when the chronos was at ircha. For me, the stretch would be the only reason for buying the chronos. I think it would gain more interest as a 760 rather than just a remade 7hv. It gives a much better explanation for all the beefy upgrades.

[JadAl_87]

What about a CF battery plate with some kind of SS or coated lock pin? In our weather, the pin is quickly collecting rust making it hard to insert/remove.

When the new ball links will be released?

[RedJoE]

I can say I really appreciate Sebastian Zajonz commenting on a lot of things I brought up. It's really nice to see a company actually post reply's to it's customer base. This is great.

I was only posting my personal thoughts to their design after owning several different manufactures of helis and getting my 7HV. After owning the different helis I have seen firsthand the issues from all of them and what I like in a heli more than others.

I totally respect Sebastians rejections (like serviceable swash and tail pins) and thoughts to why he does things the way he does. But the fact of the matter is, I want a serviceable swash on all my helis, I want a different type retaining pin on the tail, etc.

It's good to know where Compass stands on all this. I'll probably keep flying my 7HV (when I can order more parts for it) and then sell it off or dump it if it crashes again.

I now defiantly know Compass is not for me.

Thank you Sebastian for clearing things up and I wish you the best of luck with your company.

[Raz0rSh4rp]

I too agree with almost everything on the Sebastian's list, but I have had a problem with the bearings in the Warp 360 swash plates. I have purchased 3, + 1 that came with the kit. Out of these 4 I have had to ask Mike for a replacement for 2 of them and 1 was a replacement I personally bought myself. All of these swashes had either a gritty or a notchy main bearing in them.

I really appreciate Mike sending me the two replacement units, but for both my sake and Prostar's sake it would have been better had I not needed replacements.

I still have not gotten a single Warp 360 swash that actually spins freely with no notchy or gritty feeling (out of 6 total swashes!).

[Sebastian Zajonz]

6 Warp Swashplates? I've never had even one. I would love to see that by myself.
They are running a bit hard sometimes but this is on purpose. They are in a pressure fit in the aluminium to reduce the play. With that they are not running totally free.

By the way all warranty parts Mike or MTTEC or who ever is replacing to the customers will be replaced to them by Compass-Model. The politic is very easy here.

[Mercuriell]

Great thread ! Very clear explanation on many design and tolerance issues -

[WillJames]

Originally Posted by Mercuriell

Great thread ! Very clear explanation on many design and tolerance issues -

+1 Thank you Compass!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[cmturn0]

Parts availability...

My 6hvu is grounded because of parts that are out of stock in the USA. I was finally able to locate the parts from an Australian Dealer who then cancelled my order and refunded my money because Compass will not allow him to ship parts to the USA.

If you can't keep up with the demand for replacement parts, and I'm willing to pay shipping from Australia, and he has the parts what is the problem?? You need to lift this ridiculous no international sales ban until you get your supply chain issues fixed. I can see the parts I need but can't order them because of politics, seriously??

[ARM_Coder]

Q: RC711 still doesn't offer the 550U kit, nor any spare parts for the 550U/6HVU. All other models are reasonably well supported. Is this issue in CompassModel's radar?

For those who don't know, I explain:

RC711 is a Chinese retail that sells Compass kits and parts - although they won't ship kits to US, Germany and Canada - just parts. They claim to be the exclusive Compass distributor for Asia Pacific, but they ship to countries outside that region too.

RC711 is very popular in Brazil mostly because of Align, but also among Compass users from here. It's my primary source of Compass kits and parts, and it seems to suffer shortage of parts in a lesser degree than the US retailers. And is a bit cheaper too.

Thanks!

[Raz0rSh4rp]

It may be that part of the issue I had was just the manufacturing tolerances. Thank you for your input Sebastian, if I ever make it to IRCHA I'd like to shake your hand. I do find Compass models to be the best engineered machines, for me personally.