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Bergen R/C Helicopters Bergen Intrepid 90 Intrepid Turbine Observer Industrial Twin Observer Turbine Support Forum |
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12-11-2015, 11:26 PM | #1 (permalink) |
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Tail servo
My tail servo started glitching today. Its an old futaba 9205 with a gy501 gyro. What would be a good replacement servo for this old gyro. I think the futaba 9254 digital was the recommendation years ago
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12-20-2015, 07:51 PM | #2 (permalink) |
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I looked up the 501's operating manual. It was originally recommended for use with the 9203 which is an analog servo. Other servos were not recommended. Your 9205 is also an analog servo if I'm not mistaken, with similar specs. Both, unfortunately, as I'm sure you know, are discontinued. The 9254 is a digital servo and was originally paired with Futaba's 401 gyro. I'm not sure it would be a reliable match for the 501 since it looks like the 501 was designed prior to the advent of, or at least the regular use of, digital servos. I looked at Futaba's web site and, looking at the speed and torque specs, it looks like the S9405 might be a close match to what you need.
Good luck and Fly Safe! Steve R. Last edited by Intrepid175; 12-20-2015 at 09:36 PM.. |
12-22-2015, 01:35 PM | #3 (permalink) |
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Ok thankyou for your time.
I already put a digital 9254 on and switched the frame rate to high from normal on the gyro menu. I think that is where it should be for digital servos. although the torque is lower 47oz compared to 76oz for the 9205 ,I hovered it once since then and seems to be fine. I dont realy know how much torque is needed??I will give it a real test this week !! Thanks again! Tony |
12-22-2015, 02:02 PM | #4 (permalink) | |
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Best of luck and Fly Safe, Steve R. |
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12-23-2015, 08:12 PM | #5 (permalink) |
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I will keep an eye on it for the next few flights to see how it preforms .
I know this equipment is old but its still fun for me to sort it out. What do you fly and how is it set up? By the way thanks for taking the time to respond !!! |
12-23-2015, 09:20 PM | #6 (permalink) | |
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And you're most welcome. I've enjoyed the conversation! Fly Safe, Steve R. |
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12-25-2015, 08:02 PM | #7 (permalink) |
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That sounds awsome!! I agree my intrepid is also very stable and fast at nothing!! probably would make a great scale bird.I havent flown my 30 size nitro heli in years just dont have the time but i do occasionally fly a trex 450 and my god that thing does everything in a hurry!!that is my first electric heli just a few months old and it still scares me! I have to soften it up a bit. Flybarless is all new to me. I also have a little 150 size CP heli i fly in my yard almost every day and that has realy built up my confidence . What exactly is F3C ? i have read many times references to that term . Nice to talk to you also!
Tony |
12-25-2015, 09:55 PM | #8 (permalink) | |
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I'm new to the flybarless stuff too. With conventional flybared models, I can set them up and adjust them without thinking too much about it. If I don't like the way something feels, I know exactly what to adjust and usually, how much to adjust it to get it where I'm happy with it. With the new flybarless systems, it's a lot more problematic. I'm still learning how to adjust the parameters in the gyro system to do what I'd do in the radio in a couple of minutes with the transmitter, but I'm getting there. As for F3C, there's an international organization called the FAI (Federation Aeronautique International) headquartered in France. They set standards and maneuvers for a number of modeling and full size competitions. F3C is the designation for model helicopter competitions. F3A is pattern planes. F3B is gliders and so forth. They hold a world competition in various places around the world every odd numbered year for helicopters. In this country, the AMA Nationals competitions take place in Muncie, IN. at the AMA headquarters every summer. They have four levels of competition, Class 1-3 and F3C, with F3C being the most advanced. They setup a hovering area and the maneuvers consist of three hovering which have to be done precisely in relation to a center landing pad and a couple of cones or flags that mark the perimeter. That's followed by a series of aerobatic maneuvers that have to be done in precise order and in proper relation to the hovering area. For example, they used to do something called a roll reversal. The model enters the area in fast forward flight downwind and executes an axial roll, direction, pilots discretion. After the first roll, there's a brief section of straight and level followed by a second axial roll in the opposite direction from the first. The entire maneuver is supposed to be centered relative to the hover area with that brief straight and level section being stage center. The judges mark that, as well as how axial the rolls are, whether they hold heading and altitude and so forth. They can be very picky about it. It can be a lot of fun but also very frustrating depending on how the day's going. Here's a link that might help: http://www.fai.org/ciam-our-sport/f3...ol-helicopters If you think you might be interested in trying competition, the AMA web site has the information and it's a cool experience. Not just the competition itself but hanging out with a very great group of fellow heli pilots, including some of the best in the country. I wholeheartedly recommend it. Fly Safe, Steve R. Last edited by Intrepid175; 12-26-2015 at 12:20 AM.. |
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12-27-2015, 08:53 PM | #9 (permalink) |
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interesting , I watched some videos on you tube ,looks like lots of practice time is needed to be competitive. well beyond my capacity now but i wish you good luck in your quest for perfection!
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12-27-2015, 11:05 PM | #10 (permalink) |
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Oh, I don't know, F3C is pretty complicated but you don't start at that level. My best flying buddy is the one who got me into it back in 1989. We started in what was the equivalent of Class 2 back then. As soon as we thought we could "maybe" handle F3C, we made the jump up. Neither of us were really ready and at the time, there wasn't a Class 3 so the jump in skill level was really big. We could get through the schedules but it wasn't pretty. There was definitely a pride thing going on and we wanted to fly with the "big guys!" We competed together pretty much every year after that up until around 2006. Afterwards, I backed out and haven't gone to the contest to compete since, but he still goes when he doesn't have family/work conflicts. He didn't compete last summer but unless something comes up between now and then, I'm pretty sure he'll be there this year.
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12-28-2015, 08:46 AM | #11 (permalink) |
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work and family for me also , i'll be retired in 5 or so years maybe ill make the trip to watch!
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12-28-2015, 11:01 AM | #12 (permalink) |
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If you decide to go, the IRCHA fun-fly starts right after the competition is over. At least that's how they've been scheduling things the last few years. Have you ever attended a Heli fun-fly? Well IRCHA is one of the biggest, if not the biggest in the world. If you can schedule the time, it's worth checking out, especially if you've never been before. Only thing is, these events are very popular and motel space fills up very quickly so make reservations "early!" Last time I went, I procrastinated and the closest room I could find was 45 miles away. I didn't mind though, I love driving through the farm country up there.
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12-28-2015, 04:43 PM | #13 (permalink) |
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Ok thanks i'll keep that in mind. I have never been o a funfly of any significance just a few local.
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09-26-2016, 08:19 PM | #14 (permalink) |
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I switched the gyro to a gy401 so i can use a digital tail servo. The futaba 9254 will not move the tail when its up to full rpm but will move the tail fine when the tail is not spinning.
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09-26-2016, 08:52 PM | #15 (permalink) |
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That sounds odd. We've used the 9254 for many years, including on EB's with 104mm tail blades. Moves 'em just fine....
Check your thrust bearings in the tail blade grips for dents in the races, and be sure everything moves very freely.
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Chris D. Bergen Bergen R/C Helicopters |
09-26-2016, 09:14 PM | #16 (permalink) | |
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Make sure the GY401 is set for a digital servo, it's one of the switches on top of the gyro. If all those things are Ok, then I'd wonder about the servo itself. The 9254 is the servo Futaba used to sell with the 401. I used that combo for years and it always worked just fine on my Bergen's and X-Cell's. Good luck! Steve R. |
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09-28-2016, 04:14 AM | #17 (permalink) |
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steve thanks so much for the tips , i think you are right , the link on the blade grip is very tight but only when you put a little pressure on it as if it were being driven by the blades. Oddly enough its very smooth when static. I think that is what is causing the binding.It was lubed very well but that didnt help so i filed out the sharp edge on the inside to loosen it up a bit. I also have an spectra g with the same servo on the tail and it workes fine , that has 105mm tail blades thats why i was confused. The xcell uses ball bearing links i think thats the difference.I will test it in a few days and report back!!
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09-30-2016, 10:15 PM | #18 (permalink) |
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I removed the main blades and spun up the tail and was amazed at how much force was required to move the tail push rod !! Seems like the centrifugal force from the link area on the blade grip is the source. Its not binding at all and very smooth when static. I moved the servo push rod in with a smaller wheel . I will sacrifice a little nose left travel to get more torque. I only hovered in my back yard so far didnt have time to go to the field and test fly. I might also try an align 550 tail slider links hub and grips , looks to be a better design
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10-07-2016, 12:43 PM | #19 (permalink) |
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The same parts are used on our Industrial Twins swinging up to 150mm Tail blades. Be sure there is no loctite in between the eyelet and the Shouldered bolt, be sure it's lubricated with light oil, and it should work just fine.
Can you post a picture of your tail assembly by any chance?
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Chris D. Bergen Bergen R/C Helicopters |
10-07-2016, 02:27 PM | #20 (permalink) | |
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