Fun, Learning, Friendship and Mutual Respect
START  HERE


Unregistered
Go Back   HeliFreak > R/C Helicopter Support > KDE Direct Upgrades and Accessories


KDE Direct Upgrades and Accessories KDE Direct Upgrades and Accessories Factory Support Forum


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 04-21-2009, 11:44 AM   #1
KDE Direct
Registered Users
 
Posts: 1,286
 

Join Date: May 2006
Location: Washington, U.S.A.
Default New KDE Direct Main Gear Case for 600! Allows Use of the 700N Main Gear!

Hey Everyone,

One of my favorite upgrades for the TREX 600 electric series is the ability to use the new TREX 700 Nitro main gear for strength and to prevent stripping on high-voltage, high-power setups. Stripping of the stock 600 main gear is a common problem for 10S/12S setups and can be solved with the newly released KDE Direct Main Gear Case Upgrade; thereby allowing hard-3D manuevers with no fear of gear strippage or mid-air failures. Check it out at

http://www.kdedirect.com/600ElectricSeriesProducts.html
http://www.kdedirect.com/TREX600MGC.html

Thanks for everyone's continued support!
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	AT600-MGC1.jpg
Views:	967
Size:	63.8 KB
ID:	92989   Click image for larger version

Name:	AT600-MGC2.jpg
Views:	588
Size:	26.6 KB
ID:	92990   Click image for larger version

Name:	AT600-MGC3.jpg
Views:	938
Size:	26.5 KB
ID:	92991   Click image for larger version

Name:	AT600-MGC5.jpg
Views:	1715
Size:	62.4 KB
ID:	92992  
__________________
-- KDE Direct, Inc. --
KDE Direct is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2009, 12:44 PM   #2
Duke600
Registered Users
 
Posts: 1,542
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Cypress, CA
Default

Very nice Idea. Are you using a stock 600 one way bearing?
Duke600 is online now        Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2009, 03:18 PM   #3
KDE Direct
Registered Users
 
Posts: 1,286
Thread Starter Thread Starter
 

Join Date: May 2006
Location: Washington, U.S.A.
Default

Yes, the hub is designed for the stock 600 one-way clutch bearing. The design is similar to the improved Align versions, in which the entire one-way is supported inside the hub with thick aluminum side-walls, thereby preventing the one-way lock-ups that first plagued the 600. I've had over 200+ flights with this setup and haven't seen a lock-up since.
__________________
-- KDE Direct, Inc. --
KDE Direct is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2009, 03:33 PM   #4
Duke600
Registered Users
 
Posts: 1,542
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Cypress, CA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kegerator View Post
Yes, the hub is designed for the stock 600 one-way clutch bearing. The design is similar to the improved Align versions, in which the entire one-way is supported inside the hub with thick aluminum side-walls, thereby preventing the one-way lock-ups that first plagued the 600. I've had over 200+ flights with this setup and haven't seen a lock-up since.
I have been locking up my oneway for a while now, even the Kasama hub and oneway. I converted my t600 into a 550 using a Scorpion motor on 6s, I still have a lot of torque, I think that is causing the lockup.
I ordered one of yours, I will see if it helps
Duke600 is online now        Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2009, 03:56 PM   #5
KDE Direct
Registered Users
 
Posts: 1,286
Thread Starter Thread Starter
 

Join Date: May 2006
Location: Washington, U.S.A.
Default

Another thing you may want to try is changing the bearing grease used in the one-way. I work with cylindrical clutch bearings at my other job and the proper grease makes a big difference in the performance of a clutch bearing, so it's worth giving it a shot. I've been using the Mobilith SHC 100 synthetic lithium grease (red in color) and haven't had any issues with the one-way. Most automotive stores carry this grease or something similar (I got mine from Pepboys). The one-way bearing grease included in the Align kits is not adequate over the long run for good performance. I've been running my 10S Scorpion motor setup for months now with zero problems.
__________________
-- KDE Direct, Inc. --
KDE Direct is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2009, 02:53 PM   #6
My 2 Cents
Registered Users
 
Posts: 660
 

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: USA
Default

Questition. I went to go grab my 2 spair 700 gears to compair them to my 600 gears. I was going to buy this hub last night as soon as I seen it because I loved the idea of doing this. But before I did, I noticed that your hub mounts the 700 main gear upside down. If you look at the webbing of the gear they are supposed to be in a straight line from the pinion in the oposite direction to take the brunt force of the HV. Just take a 700 and look straight down at it (notice which way it turns) then do the same with the 700 gear on the 600. By flipping the main gear upside down like that isn't it making it weaker then stock? I mean I know you havnt had it strip, but neither have I with the stock gear. (stock gear&4200watts) Knock on wood...450+ flights

I was wondering if it would be possible to machine the hubs flange lower on the hub. I think if you did this, you can put the screws to hold the main gear on from the underside of the gear and then have the gear right side up. Sorry for my crappy explination. I have no programs to draw any diagrams on this computer. Hope you guys understand what I mean.

Either way... Great company, great person, great product. Keep up the good work Mr. Keg
My 2 Cents is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2009, 06:50 PM   #7
My 2 Cents
Registered Users
 
Posts: 660
 

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: USA
Default

So I had to try and come up with a better explination. So I took out the sharpy and note pad . Below the arrows indicate the direction of rotation, if you were looking straight down at the heli from the top. The dotted lines with pen indicate what I think would be the direction of force. Also took 1 pic from my 700 so you could see the gear on their. Please if the webbing is not a big deal then let me know. As you can see by the 2nd pic the 700 offers ALOT more meat for that pinion so I would love to do this mod. I am just curious about things before I buy.


Thanks,
My2Cents
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	3gear1.jpg
Views:	1330
Size:	61.8 KB
ID:	94111   Click image for larger version

Name:	Sidebyside.jpg
Views:	816
Size:	86.2 KB
ID:	94112   Click image for larger version

Name:	M2C700N.jpg
Views:	913
Size:	62.8 KB
ID:	94113  
My 2 Cents is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2009, 07:44 PM   #8
Duke600
Registered Users
 
Posts: 1,542
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Cypress, CA
Default

I knew what you were saying. I jut got the hub in the mail but i still need to buy a 700 gear to check it out. I will try it out next weekend.
Duke600 is online now        Reply With Quote
Old 04-26-2009, 10:34 PM   #9
KDE Direct
Registered Users
 
Posts: 1,286
Thread Starter Thread Starter
 

Join Date: May 2006
Location: Washington, U.S.A.
Default

Hey My2Cents,

I understand what you are saying and you brought up a good point, but overall the strength will be almost equivalent between the two concepts. Similar to some aftermarket racing car rims, dirt bike rims, and other high-end racing concepts, the webbing will typically sweep back in the order of the T700 upside down (as the main gear case upgrade is using). I've been testing the T700 design on multiple setups (8S, 10S, and 12S) and have never stripped a gear, so the strength is more than adequate with the gear upside down (which shows off the aesthetics of the KDE Direct upgrade also ). In my older setup using the stock 600 gear (powered by a NEU 1912/1YH on 10S and 13T pinion), I stripped numerous gears and had to perform autorotations to land (the gear would shread so hard they turned into smooth frisbees! LOL). Even since I've switched to the significantly larger T700 main gear, I haven't stripped a gear since or even popped a tooth. Overall, the main gear case and T700 gear on the T600 is a great upgrade for HV setups that are pushing the power!
__________________
-- KDE Direct, Inc. --
KDE Direct is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 04-27-2009, 04:12 AM   #10
My 2 Cents
Registered Users
 
Posts: 660
 

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: USA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kegerator View Post
Overall, the main gear case and T700 gear on the T600 is a great upgrade for HV setups that are pushing the power!
Sounds good to me. You will be seeing my order for 3 of them, plus those nice bearing blocks, other nice ESP parts, oh and some of the bottum plates for the 250 later this week!

Thanks
My 2 Cents
My 2 Cents is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 05-02-2009, 01:25 AM   #11
duke666
Registered Users
 
Posts: 539
 

Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Hampshire,UK
Default

Hi Guys,

I was wondering how the slightly different gear ratios may (or may not) effect the load on the motor and ultimately flight times using the following as set up examples:

Scorpion 4025-630 on 12s aiming for approx 2100 with 600 mains.

600 main gear 170t with 15t pinion
700 main gear 164t with 14t pinion

Duke
__________________
T-REX 600ESP, 12S, SCORPION 4025-630, JIVE 80HV, JR8717, BEAST-X, EDGE FBL LE-603, LE - 95, OUTRAGE LIPO.
T-REX450 PRO, 6s.
T-REX250, HK2206 - 3900. SCORPION 25A ESC V2, OUTRAGE LIPO.
duke666 is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2009, 08:40 PM   #12
aucmax
Registered Users
 
Posts: 968
 

Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Caribou, ME
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kegerator View Post
Yes, the hub is designed for the stock 600 one-way clutch bearing. The design is similar to the improved Align versions, in which the entire one-way is supported inside the hub with thick aluminum side-walls, thereby preventing the one-way lock-ups that first plagued the 600. I've had over 200+ flights with this setup and haven't seen a lock-up since.
I've been using one of your previous 600e hubs with bearings pre-assembled and encased with grease. Can that unit be used with the 700N main gear? I looked for mine on your site but can't find it anymore? Guess you're not making it anymore now that this new hub is being offered?
__________________
Not one of us is as smart or knowledgeable as all of us bonding together.
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


Brett
aucmax is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 05-13-2009, 09:41 PM   #13
KDE Direct
Registered Users
 
Posts: 1,286
Thread Starter Thread Starter
 

Join Date: May 2006
Location: Washington, U.S.A.
Default

Hey Brett,

You may have the KDE Direct brand confused with another company, as this is the first hub I've released for the TREX 600E. I always found the stock Align hub to work great for the standard 600E gear set, so this is why I researched into allowing use of the stronger, taller gear set of the 700 for high-voltage, high-power setups on the 600E.
__________________
-- KDE Direct, Inc. --
KDE Direct is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 08-02-2009, 07:56 AM   #14
martn1sw
Registered Users
 
Posts: 196
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Hungary
Default

Szia !

I think good ? The ideal setup with 12S Scorpion 630kv setup ?

T 700 main gear 164T
KDE main gear case
14T Pinion

The original 600 E main gear very fast broken

Thank's

by
__________________
Pilot Peter Martin
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
My Galery:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
martn1sw is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 08-03-2009, 06:46 PM   #15
My 2 Cents
Registered Users
 
Posts: 660
 

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: USA
Default

150 Combined flights on 2 700gear upgrade hubs and they are working like a champ.
Thanks Keg
My 2 Cents is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 08-27-2009, 10:30 AM   #16
poketrader
Registered Users
 

Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: goolwa beach
Default

did any of you guys have problems after install?
i have the hub ,havent run it yet as it is like warped . the gear meshes but goes up and down when moving around as normally would , any ideas .. thanks in advance guys
poketrader is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 08-27-2009, 10:32 AM   #17
poketrader
Registered Users
 

Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: goolwa beach
Default

is like a warped gear so put new one in and still same so i am thinking hub or bearing , all new bird .. esp 600 put normal gear set in is fine and ran straight as should when head turned ...
poketrader is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 09-08-2009, 10:24 AM   #18
Bobbyk
Registered Users
 
Posts: 1,268
 

Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Born in London, Live in ATL, Heritage from Ghana
Default

Are you able to do this for the 600N, I think you have one for the 700N



Thanks

Robert
__________________
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
<<< Ashlyn, daddy loves you more than his heli's, don't mind mummy >>>
<<< ..............MA Spectra G (Supporting Made in USA), DX7.............. >>>
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bobbyk is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 09-13-2009, 11:07 PM   #19
dieselracer
Registered Users
 
Posts: 1,312
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: VIsta Ca
Default

I have been using the hub for some time now, but not with the align 700 main gear. The align 700 gear stripped very easy, i would say easier then running the 600 main gear. I ended up using the Microheli .7 cnc main gear. Which is the only main gear, that can stand all the abuse i can throw at it. I have been trying to strip it in flight, and i have not been able to, no matter how hard i try, unlike the align 700 main gear that i can strip very easy. Funny thing is that most of the stock 700 main gears i stripped in a way i have never seen before. It striped in sections. The first 1/6th of the gear would be stripped the next 1/6th will be fine, followed by the next 1/6th was stripped again and so on. Like if the gear was flexing. I think ideally i would like a CNC gear like the one microheli makes for the 700, but for the 600. I would say around 11mm tall, which is the height of my modified Microheli 700 CNC gear.

heres a short video of the align 700 main gear,and how easy i can strip it.

dieselracer is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 09-14-2009, 03:35 PM   #20
KDE Direct
Registered Users
 
Posts: 1,286
Thread Starter Thread Starter
 

Join Date: May 2006
Location: Washington, U.S.A.
Default

I never managed to strip a gear on my T600E (or my other team pilots) with the upgrade installed, so this is the first I've seen of this happening. I've been doing a lot of research on the gearing stripping issues (I personally have been flying a T700E 12S setup and had been stripping the stock T700N gears left and right) and my team and I have found great solutions to stop this from occurring for most setups. The Align T700N gear is surprisingly very strong when the pinion is fully supported, as it seems it's the flex at the motor pinion due to the high-bending forces that is causing the problems. Just a flex of +0.010" is enough to strip the gear, so the best two options we've found are:

1. Make sure your gear mesh is PERFECT - meaning, almost zero play between the pinion and the main gear. It comes down to feel and practice, but this is the most critical part.
2. It's worth installing a counterbearing if you are running 12S setups and the one I've been using is the Mikado 6mm counterbearing (MIK 4148) which works excellent (ReadyHeli and other vendors carry it). This prevents the bending loads from flexing the shaft and is easily installed (although it took a bit of rework to make it fit no my T700E).

Since I've been using these two items, I haven't stripped a gear on my T700E and that's with over 7 hp peaks in power! I'm running the same motor as you (NEU 1915H/1.5Y) and I haven't had a problem since using the counterbearing.
__________________
-- KDE Direct, Inc. --
KDE Direct is offline        Reply With Quote
Reply




Unregistered
Go Back   HeliFreak > R/C Helicopter Support > KDE Direct Upgrades and Accessories


KDE Direct Upgrades and Accessories KDE Direct Upgrades and Accessories Factory Support Forum

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


Copyright © 2004-2011 - William James - Helifreak.com