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Old 06-08-2010, 04:14 PM   #1
whirlybird 1
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Default FINLESS thoughts on Stabilization systems

Bob
Please would you express your thoughts as to the value, of the CPII system to pilots, who are still having trouble with forward fligtht after learing to hover!!!
I still seem to having great difficulty with coordinated turns.
There are only a few heli guys at our local field and no one wants to take on the responsiblity to buddy box.
I do have a flight sim also, but again not so much help.
Would setting up the CPII as a bail out system, help reduce the number of BAD OUTCOMES learing foword flight.
I guess I dont learn as fast as I did when I was young.
At around $200.00 it seems that it would be money well spent and the pay back would be fast if it helped avoid only a few BAD OUTCOMES.
One more thing ...... Will you be attending the Lexington KY fun fly again this year? We meet last year. I was the one that you suggented to "GET RID OF THE TRAING GEAR".!!!!!! (which I have)
Hope to see you there again. Your advice is always welcomed!
Mike
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Old 06-10-2010, 11:02 AM   #2
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"Bear With"...
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Old 06-10-2010, 11:50 AM   #3
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Cp2 is AWESOME..This unit should help u out mucho..You will not be disappointed..
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Old 06-10-2010, 03:25 PM   #4
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Most are not going to like my answer on this one. I am not a believer in using these to learn to fly. I think they are great for the AP guys, etc where they need stability and assistance when taking pictures, etc.

As for learning to fly I think they CHEAT you from learning how to react yourself and make corrections, adjustments, etc. At least for today and getting into 3D flying.

We are getting into a world where autonomous flight is becoming a reality for even hobbyists. While that's great and all and I am sure that part of the hobby is fun, you have to set yourself to what you want to do. If you want to learn to fly where you are 100% in control then do that. If you want something that can almost fly itself, well do that... It's what your looking for. I think if you want to get to full 3D flying this will not help you get there. Might help for starting and general flying but at some point you will be taking the unit off and then may have to relearn the feel and possible bad habits this unit taught you.

I am sure 10 years from now RC heli's could be a mix of fully autonomous to not so much and new things can be done. If I could jump ahead 10 years I am sure I would be in awe of what people are doing and what controls have gyro's or other electronics all over them doing stuff for the pilot. Heck maybe a anti-crash system....
But it wont be the exactly the same hobby. It will be a a heli hobby but a very different hobby. Kind of like how it was in 1980 vs today. Same hobby but very different.


Yes at this point I will be at the LMAC funfly. Thats my plan! See you there

My 3 cents,
Bob
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Old 06-10-2010, 03:56 PM   #5
whirlybird 1
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Thanks for your take on the CPII.
I want to use it as a "bail out system" only. THe system would be off unless I to get into a situation that I cant recover from, then a bail out switch could be set and stable flight reestablished. Dont want to fly with it on, any time except as a last resort to prevent a crash.
Dont think I would be tempted to leave it on in normal flight????
Great to hear that you will be at the LAMC fun fly again this year!!!!!!!
See you there
Mike
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Old 06-10-2010, 04:12 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Finless View Post
SNIP
As for learning to fly I think they CHEAT you from learning how to react yourself and make corrections, adjustments, etc. SNIP
+1

To me, the idea of a "bail out" switch is scary.
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Old 06-10-2010, 04:25 PM   #7
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My system will have a rocket to shoot the heli up before opening the parachute for a gentle recovery
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Old 06-10-2010, 06:42 PM   #8
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Problem with the bail out switch idea is most crashes by the time you hit a switch it's too late let alone the attitude it might be in and the time it would take for the unit to recover. Honestly I don't think it is going to work like that in reality.

I want a switch like in that movie where Silvester Stallone is a cop and gets frozen for like 30 years and they wake him up to fight a bad guy. In that movie the car is about to trash and POOF it turns into a cannoli (fills with foam). We need that on a heli. Not an airbag but a instant FOAM ball

Bob
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Old 06-10-2010, 06:47 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Finless View Post
Problem with the bail out switch idea is most crashes by the time you hit a switch it's too late let alone the attitude it might be in and the time it would take for the unit to recover. Honestly I don't think it is going to work like that in reality.

I want a switch like in that movie where Silvester Stallone is a cop and gets frozen for like 30 years and they wake him up to fight a bad guy. In that movie the car is about to trash and POOF it turns into a cannoli (fills with foam). We need that on a heli. Not an airbag but a instant FOAM ball

Bob
Demolition Man- The best "bad" movie ever.

So prophetic in many ways. I think they really were looking into that foam crash system around the time that movie was made.
Instant totalling of a car for a rear end accident is probably one reason we don't already have it.

It'd be cool to see it used in something like NASCAR though if they could really get it to work.



And now these are coming for motorcyclists, same type of mechanism could trigger the foam, could be hard to breathe though.
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Old 06-10-2010, 07:23 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Finless View Post
Problem with the bail out switch idea is most crashes by the time you hit a switch it's too late let alone the attitude it might be in and the time it would take for the unit to recover. Honestly I don't think it is going to work like that in reality.

I want a switch like in that movie where Silvester Stallone is a cop and gets frozen for like 30 years and they wake him up to fight a bad guy. In that movie the car is about to trash and POOF it turns into a cannoli (fills with foam). We need that on a heli. Not an airbag but a instant FOAM ball

Bob
Maybe an inevitable crash as you describe it can't be salvaged by the 'bail out' method but you read of enough instances of such 'saves' where loss of orientation that could otherwise lead to a crash. So there is some benefit there not to mention the boost in the pilots confidence.....
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Old 06-10-2010, 08:08 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Finless View Post
Problem with the bail out switch idea is most crashes by the time you hit a switch it's too late let alone the attitude it might be in and the time it would take for the unit to recover. Honestly I don't think it is going to work like that in reality.

I want a switch like in that movie where Silvester Stallone is a cop and gets frozen for like 30 years and they wake him up to fight a bad guy. In that movie the car is about to trash and POOF it turns into a cannoli (fills with foam). We need that on a heli. Not an airbag but a instant FOAM ball

Bob
i do like the switch mod,Nightflyr did for on/off off the CP-2 CP-2 has saved me and paid for itself on my 500 already.
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Old 06-11-2010, 08:57 AM   #12
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I'm not even using CP11 as I have Flymentor fitted to a CopterX 450, but I wanted to comment as a relative newbie on stabilisation in general. I am just pprogressing from hovering/gentle flight to circuits and FFF and I find that the FM is a great help. I know it is sort of cheating for the purists, but I have made bigger strides since fitting it than I would have dared before. I still have to react the same way as I would without it, it's just increased my confidence and helps out in those moments when my old eyes lose orientation. I could try-fly/crash/repair over and over again and no doubt I would get there if I didn't lose heart and quit, but FM has projected me several s worth of non-crashes and hours worth of experience down the line.
I'm all for it
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Old 06-11-2010, 09:50 AM   #13
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There is an automatic bail out switch installed, just center the right stick and CPII returns to level flight.

You can control how near to centered the stick needs to be before it levels out using "stick priority" in the setup.

I'm still pretty new to all this, but I find that the heli flys the same with CPII on or off when the stick is moved off center. When near center, its super stable hovering.

When I loose orientation and want to go back to level, I move the stick to center and it flattens out and then go from there.
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