Fun, Learning, Friendship and Mutual Respect
START  HERE


Unregistered
Go Back   HeliFreak > R/C Electronics Support > BeastX FBL System


BeastX FBL System BeastX FBL Flybarless System Software and Hardware Support


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 12-04-2011, 08:49 PM   #1
nick779
Registered Users
 
Posts: 937
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Default any futaba owners have issues with 0 pitch at midstick?

i set up my beast x, as per the manual, on the swash leveling step, everything is 90 with 0 pitch, but after the beast x initializes my midstick is -6 degrees does anyone else have that problem?

at midstick in the servo menu, my pitch channel is at 0 but i have -5 degrees, i have no subtrim, my travel is 100/100 my pitch trim is INH and my hover trim is INH....

im baffled...

also when i get to the cyclic geometry point, my blades dont start at 0 degrees, is that normal?
__________________
DX8i, 8FGS, Phoenix, icharger
Trex 450 pro V2, ÁBeast, HS-5065's, Ice Lite 50, GensAce, Exi FG 325's 450MX
Pr˘tos 500 6s 16T ÁBeast, 9650s H6080, Ice Lite 75, WR 5A BEC, SAB
nick779 is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2011, 12:16 AM   #2
ziper_it
Registered Users
 
Posts: 1,020
 

Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Italy
Default

No issue here.

Are you leveling at menu G while subtrim is active?
ziper_it is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2011, 01:30 AM   #3
Souskei
Registered Users
 
Posts: 538
 

Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: SoCal
Default

Do u have a futaba TX or futaba servos?

I have futaba 3156 as my cyclics and had a similar issue (using a dx8) and I had to redo step k like 4 times before it would be 0 at mid stick when all the other setups were perfect.
It was weird but finally worked.

Good luck!
Souskei is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2011, 04:29 AM   #4
nieves50
Registered Users
 
Posts: 439
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: All over the place
Default

Do you have a linear pitch curve when you set it up? Might want to check that...
__________________
AMA #976001
HELIS: TREX 500 (6s), Trex 600 ESP (12S) & Trex 550 (12S): ALL FBL
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

PLANKS: Hangar 9 Pulse 60, Alpha 40 & Great Planes Revolver
nieves50 is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2011, 06:13 AM   #5
nick779
Registered Users
 
Posts: 937
Thread Starter Thread Starter
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Default

Im using a linear pitch curve and 5065mgs

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk
__________________
DX8i, 8FGS, Phoenix, icharger
Trex 450 pro V2, ÁBeast, HS-5065's, Ice Lite 50, GensAce, Exi FG 325's 450MX
Pr˘tos 500 6s 16T ÁBeast, 9650s H6080, Ice Lite 75, WR 5A BEC, SAB
nick779 is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2011, 07:28 AM   #6
ziper_it
Registered Users
 
Posts: 1,020
 

Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Italy
Default

What about menu G? You should at least give one rudder input to get all three servos at neutral position before leveling swash and setting 0 pitch.
ziper_it is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2011, 10:39 AM   #7
airjawed
Registered Users
 
Posts: 5,357
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Cliffside Park NJ
Default

+1.. menu G looks like it hasn't been done correctly.

First remove cyclic servo horns. Then power up and get to Menu G.... at this point put servo horns on as close to 90 as possible. Then using the procedure in the manual for Menu G make the individual horns perfectly 90. Then exit the setup menu and see if all your horns go to perfect 90. With the collective stick at midstick(motor unplugged).

After the servo horns are set for 90 then make sure your links are the correct length. Typically I measure according to manual and it should be correct. This should also help with your issue with the cyclic geometry step being off at the start.
__________________
Trex 450 Pro 3xDS410M + MKS8910A+, Align FBL head w/Microbeast, CC 45 Gov@ 3400rpm(max timing, outrunner mode), Scorpion 2221-8 on 14t, Edge FBL main and tail, CF boom, CC BEC @ 6V
airjawed is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2011, 10:41 AM   #8
ChrisH
HF Support
 
Posts: 11,361
 

Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: CA
Default

Have you disabled hover pitch and hover throttle in the radio?

Roll the LD and RD knobs and see if your pitch/throttle curves change, these mixes need to be inhibited.
ChrisH is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2011, 10:49 AM   #9
nick779
Registered Users
 
Posts: 937
Thread Starter Thread Starter
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisH View Post
Have you disabled hover pitch and hover throttle in the radio?

Roll the LD and RD knobs and see if your pitch/throttle curves change, these mixes need to be inhibited.
Both are inhibited, and I use a swash leveler for step g basically the same way you guys describe, it has to be the beast x, because my 8fgs pitch channel is at 0 midstick and on the pitch curve its dead center, I set 0 pitch on step g I believe with my servo horns all 90 and my swash leveled using minor adjustments for each of the 3 servos...
Is there a chance that when you set your collective limits I may have not had the stick fully down or up, and its messing with things? Should I have 0 pitch at midstick on that step too?
Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk
__________________
DX8i, 8FGS, Phoenix, icharger
Trex 450 pro V2, ÁBeast, HS-5065's, Ice Lite 50, GensAce, Exi FG 325's 450MX
Pr˘tos 500 6s 16T ÁBeast, 9650s H6080, Ice Lite 75, WR 5A BEC, SAB
nick779 is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2011, 10:52 AM   #10
airjawed
Registered Users
 
Posts: 5,357
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Cliffside Park NJ
Default

Right now when you power up with stick at zero do the servos go to 90? Motor unplugged.
__________________
Trex 450 Pro 3xDS410M + MKS8910A+, Align FBL head w/Microbeast, CC 45 Gov@ 3400rpm(max timing, outrunner mode), Scorpion 2221-8 on 14t, Edge FBL main and tail, CF boom, CC BEC @ 6V
airjawed is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2011, 12:04 PM   #11
Blades_Cuts
Registered Users
 

Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Virginia
Default

Reset MB, at set up menu, hold the button for 10sec and the swash will jerk 3 times.

You have to redo everything, including receiver set up after you reset MB.
Blades_Cuts is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2011, 01:52 PM   #12
garyji
Registered Users
 
Posts: 1,964
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Western North Carolina
Default

To be clear. You must exit Step G with a colored light on. When you finish centering the last servo don't push rudder again. Just exit to "H".

G.
__________________
T-450 Sport FBL, T-550 V1 FBL, T-600E Pro. Red Goblin 700. Goblin 500. 350 QX. Bunch of little Blades, and Planks. DX8, Full scale Jet Plank Driver, U.S. Navy Ret.
garyji is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2011, 03:55 PM   #13
nick779
Registered Users
 
Posts: 937
Thread Starter Thread Starter
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blades_Cuts View Post
Reset MB, at set up menu, hold the button for 10sec and the swash will jerk 3 times.

You have to redo everything, including receiver set up after you reset MB.
ive done that already

Quote:
Originally Posted by garyji View Post
To be clear. You must exit Step G with a colored light on. When you finish centering the last servo don't push rudder again. Just exit to "H".

G.
thats what i do... with the light on any color, my swash is level and my main blades are at 0 pitch, without touching the TX i hit the button on the mb,

does that set the 0 pitch on the tx? or does the step when you set max -/+ collective set midstick by taking the middle of the servo travel?
__________________
DX8i, 8FGS, Phoenix, icharger
Trex 450 pro V2, ÁBeast, HS-5065's, Ice Lite 50, GensAce, Exi FG 325's 450MX
Pr˘tos 500 6s 16T ÁBeast, 9650s H6080, Ice Lite 75, WR 5A BEC, SAB
nick779 is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2011, 04:56 PM   #14
ziper_it
Registered Users
 
Posts: 1,020
 

Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Italy
Default

Midstick is set at menu G, that's why 0 pitch must be set at menu G. Menu K will let you set min and max pitch while keeping 0 pitch at mid stick.
Another way to check 0 pitch is entering param menu A (trim, remember not to move the ail/ele or you will trim and remember leaving the menu before spooling up).
ziper_it is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2011, 05:23 PM   #15
sutty
Registered Users
 
Posts: 7,489
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Manchester, England
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by nick779 View Post
also when i get to the cyclic geometry point, my blades dont start at 0 degrees, is that normal?
In my opinion this is the key to your issue. If your blades are not at zero when you enter set-up point J, then you have either done something wrong to this point, or it is faulty. The reason I say this is that at steps G and J in the MB set-up, your Tx values are irrelevant. The MB outputs its own known adjusted centre pulse value, which is 1520 uS when you go into G, and close to it as you leave G, which is what you find in J. This being the case this will be the value that it will send to your cyclic servos during set-up point G, in the reference position i.e. 1520.

When you then create the modified positions for each of the servos it now has a new centre value stored. For example these might be 1507, 1529, 1519. As soon as you leave G these values should be stored to the MB. Once you go to step J, the MB will output these stored values to the servos, so if you do not get 0 degrees at this point, having already had it at G, then either you didn't do it right, or the MB has somehow forgotten.

When I exit G, if I do it with a light on, the servos do not move, and they remain where they are, so it must still be zero at H and J. If you do this with your stick at zero, when you get to step I, your swash should shoot to the bottom, because step I responds to your stick inputs so you can set the motion correctly. When you go from I to J it should shoot back up again to the stored new centres created at G.

If I leave H with my stick accurately at mid stick, there is no swash movement as I go into I either, so it stays put all the way through.

Do this.

Go into set-up G, push rudder to the left, once, briefly check for 0, you should have it, you've already done it. Push Tx collective stick to mid stick, to ensure swash should not move, then exit G to go into H. Nothing should move. Now go from H to I, nothing should move (Might be a tiny twitch here, as it is difficult to put your Tx stick at exactly mid stick, but it should stay level. If it is exactly at mid stick, and it moves a lot, there is an issue here). Now exit I and go into J, nothing should move (except again, maybe a tiny twitch). If nothing does move (significantly), then you must still have zero on your blades at step J.

I know this is a bit of overkill, but I thought it couldn't hurt so I have just made a little poor quality video to show that nothing happens between G and J when you are at mid stick on the Tx, unless there is something wrong. Will have to wait for it to cook on youtube I guess.



Let us know what happens with yours.

Cheers

Sutty
__________________
Regards, Sutty
BeltEXI, mCX, mSR, 4G3, FBL Trex250SE ÁB, FBL Trex450Pro ÁB,
FBL Trex550e VX1, FBL Trex600ESP ÁB, Parkzone P51D, QRX350Pro
sutty is online now        Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2011, 06:42 PM   #16
nick779
Registered Users
 
Posts: 937
Thread Starter Thread Starter
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ziper_it View Post
Midstick is set at menu G, that's why 0 pitch must be set at menu G. Menu K will let you set min and max pitch while keeping 0 pitch at mid stick.
Another way to check 0 pitch is entering param menu A (trim, remember not to move the ail/ele or you will trim and remember leaving the menu before spooling up).

ill try that




Quote:
Originally Posted by sutty View Post
In my opinion this is the key to your issue. If your blades are not at zero when you enter set-up point J, then you have either done something wrong to this point, or it is faulty. The reason I say this is that at steps G and J in the MB set-up, your Tx values are irrelevant. The MB outputs its own known adjusted centre pulse value, which is 1520 uS when you go into G, and close to it as you leave G, which is what you find in J. This being the case this will be the value that it will send to your cyclic servos during set-up point G, in the reference position i.e. 1520.

When you then create the modified positions for each of the servos it now has a new centre value stored. For example these might be 1507, 1529, 1519. As soon as you leave G these values should be stored to the MB. Once you go to step J, the MB will output these stored values to the servos, so if you do not get 0 degrees at this point, having already had it at G, then either you didn't do it right, or the MB has somehow forgotten.

When I exit G, if I do it with a light on, the servos do not move, and they remain where they are, so it must still be zero at H and J. If you do this with your stick at zero, when you get to step I, your swash should shoot to the bottom, because step I responds to your stick inputs so you can set the motion correctly. When you go from I to J it should shoot back up again to the stored new centres created at G.

If I leave H with my stick accurately at mid stick, there is no swash movement as I go into I either, so it stays put all the way through.

Do this.

Go into set-up G, push rudder to the left, once, briefly check for 0, you should have it, you've already done it. Push Tx collective stick to mid stick, to ensure swash should not move, then exit G to go into H. Nothing should move. Now go from H to I, nothing should move (Might be a tiny twitch here, as it is difficult to put your Tx stick at exactly mid stick, but it should stay level. If it is exactly at mid stick, and it moves a lot, there is an issue here). Now exit I and go into J, nothing should move (except again, maybe a tiny twitch). If nothing does move (significantly), then you must still have zero on your blades at step J.

I know this is a bit of overkill, but I thought it couldn't hurt so I have just made a little poor quality video to show that nothing happens between G and J when you are at mid stick on the Tx, unless there is something wrong. Will have to wait for it to cook on youtube I guess.



Let us know what happens with yours.

Cheers

Sutty
Sutty thank you so much for the step by step, im just trying to narrow everything down and ill report back tomorrow...

and that video might have been overkill, but it just kept me from asking another question lol...

and i thought setting up a FBL machine would be easy lmao... it is my first kit though...
__________________
DX8i, 8FGS, Phoenix, icharger
Trex 450 pro V2, ÁBeast, HS-5065's, Ice Lite 50, GensAce, Exi FG 325's 450MX
Pr˘tos 500 6s 16T ÁBeast, 9650s H6080, Ice Lite 75, WR 5A BEC, SAB

Last edited by nick779; 12-05-2011 at 10:18 PM..
nick779 is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2011, 10:32 AM   #17
WBFAir
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Stamford, CT
Default

Just a suggestion but first a few questions, did you set up this model in the radio from a blank model?

Or was it a previous model or one that you copied over that you just felt like you had changed over everything right?

As far as my suggestion is, can you put this Tx and this model on any simulators you might have?

Being as it is setup for a no mixing now you should be able to do this and then maybe you could double check that your Tx is sending all the right neutral points or if it might be sending something you just haven't found yet.

Would be a nice way to confirm 100% you are not getting something wrong from the Tx.
WBFAir is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2011, 11:20 AM   #18
sutty
Registered Users
 
Posts: 7,489
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Manchester, England
Default

Wouldn't completely rule out Tx issues, but my point about G and J still stands. Servo positions output at G are created by the MB, and modfied by you at step G and are then stored. These modified positions are again output by the MB at step J, before you start adjusting in J, so if you are no longer getting 0 degrees when you enter J, when you had it in the modified positions at G, then, in my opinion, there is something wrong prior to considering issues with your Tx. I would examine this area first, and ensure that you get the same values/positions at both modified G and at unmodified J.

If of course you do get the same at G and J, in the same way that I did in the video, then of course you must look elsewhere.

Good luck with it.

Cheers

Sutty
__________________
Regards, Sutty
BeltEXI, mCX, mSR, 4G3, FBL Trex250SE ÁB, FBL Trex450Pro ÁB,
FBL Trex550e VX1, FBL Trex600ESP ÁB, Parkzone P51D, QRX350Pro
sutty is online now        Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2011, 08:12 PM   #19
nick779
Registered Users
 
Posts: 937
Thread Starter Thread Starter
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Default

well i just finished my beast setup, ended up moving back to the 2nd hole on my hs5065s
i have +/- 14 collective and 14 cyclic, but my midstick is a hair over +1 degree... which bothers me, but i really dont care right now, its one degree and i just want to maiden the heli
__________________
DX8i, 8FGS, Phoenix, icharger
Trex 450 pro V2, ÁBeast, HS-5065's, Ice Lite 50, GensAce, Exi FG 325's 450MX
Pr˘tos 500 6s 16T ÁBeast, 9650s H6080, Ice Lite 75, WR 5A BEC, SAB
nick779 is offline        Reply With Quote
Reply




Unregistered
Go Back   HeliFreak > R/C Electronics Support > BeastX FBL System


BeastX FBL System BeastX FBL Flybarless System Software and Hardware Support

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


Copyright © 2004-2011 - William James - Helifreak.com