Fun, Learning, Friendship and Mutual Respect
START  HERE


Unregistered
Go Back   HeliFreak > R/C Electronics Support > Thunder Tiger GT5 FBL System


Thunder Tiger GT5 FBL System Thunder Tiger GT5 Flybarless Electronics


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 02-04-2012, 03:55 PM   #1
guruduck
Registered Users
 
Posts: 154
 

Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: USA
Default Ail and Ele settings not working. Help

A brand new GT5 setup on my 500. All directions and gyro sense are correct.
TX all channels ATV 100%. According tO the manual I use Pitch, Ail, Ele to set
Pitch +/- 11 degree and cyclic +/-6 degree.

I have to lower Pitch to 60 in order to get 11 degree.
But Ail and Ele have no effect at all. No matter what value, I got same servo movement.

Do I need to setup in TX ATV? Or the servo limit? But that was not what I have read so far.

I m stuck at this point. Please help

Guruduck
guruduck is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 02-04-2012, 05:13 PM   #2
NitroAl
Registered Users
 
Posts: 599
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Gold Coast Australia
Default

use servo travel, section 14 in the manual. You will have to do the collective after you have done this in the menu you are currently trying to use, in that menu the Aileron and elevator settings only change the agility of the helicopter in flight!
__________________
CustomHeliParts/KDE TRex 700N
ThunderTiger X50 FBL
Ely.Q Vision 90
Ely.Q Vision 50
NitroAl is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 02-05-2012, 04:09 PM   #3
jdanks
Registered Users
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Oregon
Default

You also want to make sure that your overall gain is set to 100.
jdanks is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 02-05-2012, 04:24 PM   #4
guruduck
Registered Users
 
Posts: 154
Thread Starter Thread Starter
 

Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: USA
Default My understandings of G-T5

Thanks NitroAI and jdanks,

the manual is very confusing and incomplete... After reading so much on this forum and TDR's, I kinda grasp the idea. Correct me if I am wrong.

Before programming the G-T5,
(1) Set Tx to Normal (mechanical) swash mode.
(2) Set all servo ATVs on Tx to 100, except Aux 2 (Channel 7). See below.

Do the followings on G-T5.
Cyclic setup
(1) Use Zero point (icon= horn +/-) to set zero degree on all servos, swash level.
(2) Use Servo travel (icon= horn, double end arrows moving) to set cyclic to 8 to 10 degree. The actual amount is not important. But make sure all cyclic servos have the same value.
(3) Use Pitch menu (icon= swash, pitch mix) to set +/- 11 degree. Leave Ail and Ele to default 100.
(4) Do not use Servo limit (icon= horn, A and B) for cyclic. Set to default 250.

Tail setup
(1) Use Zero point (icon= horn +/-) to set zero degree on tail servo and get a 6 degree tail pitch.
(2) Use Servo limit (icon= horn, A and B) to set the mechanical limit of tail slide pitch

P, is the gain (agility) of the gyro. Like the Hiller setting in other fbl unit
I, is the stability. Like the Bell setting in other fbl unit

Another thing I am not sure is how to set the overall gain 60 and 100 switchable. In my DX7, Aux 2 is a toggle switch. I programmed the ATV on Aux 2 (Channel 7) to have +100 and -60. There is no way to program positive value in the negative position of the switch. Will G-T5 take the absolute value instead of + and - ?
Or should I set the Tx to use Aux 2 to give Gyro function and program the Gyro gain to 60 and 100 in association to the Flight mode (normal, Idle Up 1 and Idle Up 2)?

Please bear with me as I only have experience with Skookum and 3GX.
Thank you
Guruduck
guruduck is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 02-05-2012, 09:16 PM   #5
guruduck
Registered Users
 
Posts: 154
Thread Starter Thread Starter
 

Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: USA
Default Mechanical binding after exit to normal mode.

Ok. I read the V2 manual over and over. Now I have a new understanding. But still haven't figured out how to avoid binding in non-programming mode and the switchable gain.

[Corrections to above procedure]
Cyclic setup
(1) Use Zero point (icon= horn +/-) to set zero degree on all servos, swash level.
(2) Use Servo travel (icon= horn, double end arrows moving) to set cyclic until no mechanical binding at max collective and cyclic inputs. The actual amount is not important. But make sure all cyclic servos have the same value.
(3) Use Pitch menu (icon= swash, pitch mix) to set +/- 11 degree. Leave Ail and Ele to default 100.
(4) Do not use Servo limit (icon= horn, A and B) for cyclic unless max or min values in Step 2 are not enough. Otherwise, set to default 250.

Now I was able to produce Pitch +/-11 degree and Cyclic +-9 degree within the programming menu. But once I exited the programming mode, or timeout 25sec, all the bindings were BACK . W.T.F.. I swear I saved the parameters.
Total gain was at 100.

Another thing I am not sure is how to set the overall gain 60 and 100 switchable. In my DX7, Aux 2 is a toggle switch. I programmed the ATV on Aux 2 (Channel 7) to have +100 and -60. There is no way to program positive value in the negative position of the switch. Will G-T5 take the absolute value instead of + and - ?
Or should I set the Tx to use Aux 2 to give Gyro function and program the Gyro gain to 60 and 100 in association to the Flight mode (normal, Idle Up 1 and Idle Up 2)?

Please help.
Guruduck
guruduck is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2012, 01:42 AM   #6
mrultralite
Registered Users
 
Posts: 1,743
 

Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Abbotsford BC canada
Default

My limited understanding from anther thread was to just use the rate & HH in gyro as 100 & 60 . I don't own a DX 7 so those other options don' exist for me.
mrultralite is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2012, 02:29 PM   #7
guruduck
Registered Users
 
Posts: 154
Thread Starter Thread Starter
 

Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: USA
Default

Would someone please help?

PLE-E-E-ASE

Guruduck
guruduck is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2012, 03:40 PM   #8
mrultralite
Registered Users
 
Posts: 1,743
 

Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Abbotsford BC canada
Default

sorry i can't help. i'll be facing the same problem myself soon i bet. i think the experts here are fed up with newbies. Silence usually means they have covered it already Thanks for posting that great summary, by the way.
A revised manual sticky ? there are only a couple of major errors now. I notice they are trying to appeal to english speakers with their video series, but they are stuck at 5 with further ones too difficult even for them.
mrultralite is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2012, 03:48 PM   #9
swalko
Registered Users
 

Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Slovakia
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by guruduck View Post
Now I was able to produce Pitch +/-11 degree and Cyclic +-9 degree within the programming menu. But once I exited the programming mode, or timeout 25sec, all the bindings were BACK . W.T.F.. I swear I saved the parameters.
Total gain was at 100.
1.) Set Pitch mixer in G-T5 to 127 (maximum).
2.) Change servo travels in G-T5 to produce +/-11 degree pitch.
3.) Measure cyclic throw in menu, test for servo binding out of menu and report your results.

I mean that you have too long servo arms for FBL:
Quote:
Originally Posted by guruduck View Post
I have to lower Pitch to 60 in order to get 11 degree.
Guruduck

Last edited by swalko; 02-06-2012 at 04:53 PM..
swalko is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 02-06-2012, 05:03 PM   #10
guruduck
Registered Users
 
Posts: 154
Thread Starter Thread Starter
 

Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: USA
Default

Ok. I moved the links to inner servo arm holes. I set Pitch mix to 127 and used Servo Travel only to set Collective pitch to +/- 11 degree. The cyclic pitch automatically gave me +/- 8 degree. All Servo Travels were set to 60. Everything was fine in programming menu. No binding.

But as soon as I quit programming, The cyclic throws were back to +/- 12 degree. Collective was find. Stayed at +/- 11. Bindings occurred at max collective and cyclic.

On a second try, I lowered the Pitch mix to 120. Got +/- 10.5 on collective and almost +- 8 degree on cyclic. But again, as soon as I quit programming mode, cyclic throw went back to maximum. Since collective was lowered, bindings were not so severe as before.

Any ideas why cyclic limits were reset after quitting programming mode?

Thanks in advance.
Guruduck
guruduck is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 02-07-2012, 02:19 AM   #11
swalko
Registered Users
 

Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Slovakia
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by guruduck View Post
Ok. I moved the links to inner servo arm holes. I set Pitch mix to 127 and used Servo Travel only to set Collective pitch to +/- 11 degree. The cyclic pitch automatically gave me +/- 8 degree. All Servo Travels were set to 60. Everything was fine in programming menu. No binding.

But as soon as I quit programming, The cyclic throws were back to +/- 12 degree. Collective was find. Stayed at +/- 11. Bindings occurred at max collective and cyclic.

On a second try, I lowered the Pitch mix to 120. Got +/- 10.5 on collective and almost +- 8 degree on cyclic. But again, as soon as I quit programming mode, cyclic throw went back to maximum. Since collective was lowered, bindings were not so severe as before.

Any ideas why cyclic limits were reset after quitting programming mode?

Thanks in advance.
Guruduck
Your cyclic limits was not reset, that is the way how G-T5 work. If you get binding only in far cyclic corners at maximum and minimum collective, dont be afraid, you newer reach these positions in flight. Based on you settings you posted, i think that you have still too long servo arms or not best suitable head geometry for FBL.
swalko is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 02-07-2012, 11:39 AM   #12
guruduck
Registered Users
 
Posts: 154
Thread Starter Thread Starter
 

Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: USA
Default

Thanks Swalko

This is iffy to have bindings in normal flight by hoping the pilot will never reach the extreme input

The way I believe G-T5 can improve in this area. Once the limits are programmed, they should remain within limit no matter it is in program mode or flight mode. I will continue to play with the servo limit until no binding in flight mode before I dare to spin it up.

Yes. My model has inherit geometry problem with fbl. And I am using an after market fbl head. This makes the case worse. It is a known problem to the manufacturer and users. Hope they will update the frame design to cope with this new technology.

All-in-all, I have much confidence in this unit and I will get through this soon.

Thank you
Guruduck
guruduck is offline        Reply With Quote
Old 02-09-2012, 08:00 AM   #13
NitroAl
Registered Users
 
Posts: 599
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Gold Coast Australia
Default

You have to remember that the roll and flip rates are controlled by the gyro's so what you see on the bench is the gyro adding more and more cyclic because the gyro is chasing the requested roll or flip rate but it is not seeing a matching response in the heli so just keeps going!
__________________
CustomHeliParts/KDE TRex 700N
ThunderTiger X50 FBL
Ely.Q Vision 90
Ely.Q Vision 50
NitroAl is offline        Reply With Quote
Reply




Unregistered
Go Back   HeliFreak > R/C Electronics Support > Thunder Tiger GT5 FBL System


Thunder Tiger GT5 FBL System Thunder Tiger GT5 Flybarless Electronics

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


Copyright © 2004-2011 - William James - Helifreak.com