Help freaks, why are my 500 so dull after a crash?

felborn · 07-19-2008, 11:02 AM

Had my 500 now since it was released, and got around 200 flights on it, and 3 crashed. First 2 crashed was from the famous glitch, last one was me beeing a jackass

It started out a complete beast in the air, insane power and headspeed and loads of fun. Way way more than my Trex600 running on 11T. I ended up setting the throttle curve to 95-90-95 since I dont to much 3D and dident want there to be to much of a difference between my 500 and 600. This worked out great until I crashed a few weeks back. No big deal, replaced the whole tail with the new torque tube system, replaced main gear and a few other items, and went from 420mm SAB blades to the new align/rotortech 425mm blades. Motor still running 13tooth pinion.

So, went out after the crash and notice there beeing a big difference. I figured it was the blades at first, but I got two other friends both using the same Align blades and they both got nice punch and pop with them. I was out testing with a friend to compare our helis. One thing I noticed also was the prollonged flightime I was getting, after 6:40mins on a 3000mAh Maxamp pack I put back 2004mAh, while my friend running an identical pack on hi's 500 used 2048mAh on 6min. So 40 secs more flighttime and still I used less power. He's running a 100-91-100 curve while I was using 100 flat. We did not have a logger at the time, but there was no problem noticing the difference between the two, he had alot more pop and better headspeed on his bird. Both packs where mine used the same amount of cycles and bought at the same time, both delivering the same performance on my heli.

I first thought my ESC could have been reset or something, so I set it up from scratch again today, middle timing and fast responce. No change what so ever, just did two packs on it and I cant really notice a difference at all.

So now im wondering what on earth is wrong, why cant I get my Trex to run like it used to? I have a pair of SAB blades on order to compare, but I dont think thats the problem as my friends both run the same Align blades and are very happy with them. I also ordered new bearings for the main shaft, but bad bearings should show as more power used? I can get 6mins and put back around 1800mAh on my 2500mAh Evolights pack, and 7mins putting back around 2100mAh on my 3000mAh packs. I would think bad bearings or other mechanical binding would also show on the flighttime?

I really got no clue whats wrong here... Thinking about a new motor, or maybe even a new ESC, but both are a real shoot in the dark. Anyone got any bright ideas as to whats happening? Why on earth did my Trex suddenly mellow out so much?

felborn · 07-20-2008, 02:05 AM

Really noone who got any opinions on this? Im really stuck here, and dunno what to do to fix this. Any and all opinions and advice would be greatly appriciated.

psindrup · 07-20-2008, 02:22 AM

Hei Norge

Your longer flight times, and the fact that you believe that you can hear a difference between your and your friends heli, indicates head speed. -> Lower head speed, indicates ESC or ESC setup

I know that you have reprogrammed your ESC, but are you absolutely sure that you did it correctly (with a linear throttle curve during setup)

Your lower power consumption indicates that everything runs freely.

To get "facts on the table" I think you need to tack the head speed.

De bedste hilsner

Peter

arky · 07-20-2008, 02:32 AM

My Align ESC did this to me i had another and swaped it out all is fine now, it sill works but with reduced power running the old ESC, i am running an after market motor though z20/1700 it pulls 35amps so slightly more and may have worn the ESC out who knows ?

jason

mattkreps · 07-20-2008, 02:42 AM

sounds like you motor bearings are bad. If you hold the tail drive and spin the main gear how many times dose it spin. It should be fairly free.

psindrup · 07-20-2008, 02:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mattkreps

sounds like you motor bearings are bad. If you hold the tail drive and spin the main gear how many times dose it spin. It should be fairly free.

If that was the case, he wouldn't get longer flight times than his buddy.

Peter

felborn · 07-20-2008, 04:01 AM

I will do a couple of flights with the E-logger connected and check my actual headspeed. Very odd, everything was working perfectly until that last crash. Both blades and main gear are fairly free spenning, cant notice any difference there.

When this crash did happen, the battery was ejected during the crash and was disconnected from the ESC while still running I guess. No real reason why that should damage anything tho, but im wondering if it did not the less. I set it up again last nigth, running an linear throttlecurve and all, but no change. The 500 ESC's aint got the best rep, we had one die on it's very first flight. Poor guy was hovering when it lost power, autoed down and that was that, completely dead ESC... Still find it odd that it should operate perfectly, just not at full capacity tho. If im getting a new ESC, it's gonna be a scorpion for sure thistime,

Right now im wondering if I should just get a 14T pinion and see how that works tho, might be a 5$ fix?

BlackTitanium · 07-20-2008, 04:01 AM

Did you try using your friends LiPo?
Yours may be losing it's punch.

felborn · 07-20-2008, 04:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackTitanium

Did you try using your friends LiPo?
Yours may be losing it's punch.

We did both, I tried one of his pack, and he one of mine. No difference, his heli was still lively as ever and mine was just as dull. As I said in my first post, when we compared the packs on the charger I had spendt less power in my 6:40mins than he did on 6mins. So deffently a big difference in how much the helis draw.

psindrup · 07-20-2008, 04:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by felborn

We did both, I tried one of his pack, and he one of mine. No difference, his heli was still lively as ever and mine was just as dull. As I said in my first post, when we compared the packs on the charger I had spendt less power in my 6:40mins than he did on 6mins. So deffently a big difference in how much the helis draw.

Did you see my post at #3?

Please comment (as I was the first to respond to your question)

Peter

felborn · 07-20-2008, 04:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by psindrup

Did you see my post at #3?

Please comment (as I was the first to respond to your question)

Peter

Aye, packs are charing now. Aint got a tach, but hopefully my Elogger will tell me my current headspeed

psindrup · 07-20-2008, 04:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by felborn

Aye, packs are charing now. Aint got a tach, but hopefully my Elogger will tell me my current headspeed

Please report back.

Held og lykke med "fejlfindingen"

Peter

Gernejr · 07-20-2008, 08:55 AM

Just a thought but did you check Pitch on blades?

felborn · 07-20-2008, 09:37 AM

Well, actually managed to put in one whole pack before the damn rain got me again... Looking at the graph I think I might have got my wires crossed, headspeed seems to be around 2400-2600RPM, whiche is pretty much where it used to be before the crash as well. Maybe it really just is the blades afterall? I got some new SAB blades on it's way from Readyheli, so I will find out soon enough. Sure does seem alot duller than it was before tho...

I got the thing working correct, 162Tooth main gear divied on 13T gives 12.46, so I put in 12.5. Thats correct aint it?

Nutsinboltz27 · 07-20-2008, 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gernejr

Just a thought but did you check Pitch on blades?

+1, this can make all the difference in the world.

justin keaton · 07-20-2008, 09:51 PM

yea check your pitch, cause about every time i crash the pitch is off about 2 or 3 degrees if it a hard crash. just caus the links havent come off or broke dont mean they didnt get crammed down a turn or 2

vicrc · 07-20-2008, 11:36 PM

If you are using the stock 500L motor the magnets will move causing it to be misaligned and result in less power. Change out the motor.

felborn · 07-21-2008, 02:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vicrc

If you are using the stock 500L motor the magnets will move causing it to be misaligned and result in less power. Change out the motor.

Hmm, that could indeed sound correct from what I am experiencing. I would think the magnet moving would case the motor to operate less effiecient tho? Im wondering if I could do a cheap trick and just install 14T pinion to fix the problem?

Aint getting another 500L motor thats for sure, gonna be Scorpion 1600KV if I need a replacment...

psindrup · 07-21-2008, 04:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vicrc

If you are using the stock 500L motor the magnets will move causing it to be misaligned and result in less power. Change out the motor.

Really?

Peter

MiniCwik · 07-21-2008, 12:14 PM

What is your pitch range? I still have not seen you answer that question.

Motor issues would be much more evident.

07-19-2008, 11:02 AM	#1
felborn Registered Users Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Sandnes, Norway	Help freaks, why are my 500 so dull after a crash? Had my 500 now since it was released, and got around 200 flights on it, and 3 crashed. First 2 crashed was from the famous glitch, last one was me beeing a jackass It started out a complete beast in the air, insane power and headspeed and loads of fun. Way way more than my Trex600 running on 11T. I ended up setting the throttle curve to 95-90-95 since I dont to much 3D and dident want there to be to much of a difference between my 500 and 600. This worked out great until I crashed a few weeks back. No big deal, replaced the whole tail with the new torque tube system, replaced main gear and a few other items, and went from 420mm SAB blades to the new align/rotortech 425mm blades. Motor still running 13tooth pinion. So, went out after the crash and notice there beeing a big difference. I figured it was the blades at first, but I got two other friends both using the same Align blades and they both got nice punch and pop with them. I was out testing with a friend to compare our helis. One thing I noticed also was the prollonged flightime I was getting, after 6:40mins on a 3000mAh Maxamp pack I put back 2004mAh, while my friend running an identical pack on hi's 500 used 2048mAh on 6min. So 40 secs more flighttime and still I used less power. He's running a 100-91-100 curve while I was using 100 flat. We did not have a logger at the time, but there was no problem noticing the difference between the two, he had alot more pop and better headspeed on his bird. Both packs where mine used the same amount of cycles and bought at the same time, both delivering the same performance on my heli. I first thought my ESC could have been reset or something, so I set it up from scratch again today, middle timing and fast responce. No change what so ever, just did two packs on it and I cant really notice a difference at all. So now im wondering what on earth is wrong, why cant I get my Trex to run like it used to? I have a pair of SAB blades on order to compare, but I dont think thats the problem as my friends both run the same Align blades and are very happy with them. I also ordered new bearings for the main shaft, but bad bearings should show as more power used? I can get 6mins and put back around 1800mAh on my 2500mAh Evolights pack, and 7mins putting back around 2100mAh on my 3000mAh packs. I would think bad bearings or other mechanical binding would also show on the flighttime? I really got no clue whats wrong here... Thinking about a new motor, or maybe even a new ESC, but both are a real shoot in the dark. Anyone got any bright ideas as to whats happening? Why on earth did my Trex suddenly mellow out so much?

07-20-2008, 02:42 AM	#5
mattkreps Registered Users My HF Map location Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Rancho	sounds like you motor bearings are bad. If you hold the tail drive and spin the main gear how many times dose it spin. It should be fairly free. __________________ Trex 450SE V2, Trex 500 CF, Trex 600 Nitro Pro DX7, AR7000s, JR770s 2.4 is for people who only listen to AM radio (like me)

07-20-2008, 08:55 AM	#13
Gernejr Registered Users Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Miami, Fl	Just a thought but did you check Pitch on blades? __________________ Cheers, Glenn To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. Outrage Fusion 50 FBL SK720 12s Xera 4025-560,Kon.HV 80 ,JR8717,OR 9088 on 6v TP 6s 65c 3300's Trex 700CHP FBL SK720 MX510,Kon HV 80, JR 8717,OR 9188, 6v, TP 6s 45c 4400's

07-20-2008, 09:37 AM	#14
felborn Registered Users Thread Starter Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Sandnes, Norway	Well, actually managed to put in one whole pack before the damn rain got me again... Looking at the graph I think I might have got my wires crossed, headspeed seems to be around 2400-2600RPM, whiche is pretty much where it used to be before the crash as well. Maybe it really just is the blades afterall? I got some new SAB blades on it's way from Readyheli, so I will find out soon enough. Sure does seem alot duller than it was before tho... I got the thing working correct, 162Tooth main gear divied on 13T gives 12.46, so I put in 12.5. Thats correct aint it? Attached Thumbnails

07-21-2008, 12:14 PM	#20
MiniCwik Registered Users Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Michigan	What is your pitch range? I still have not seen you answer that question. Motor issues would be much more evident. __________________ T-Rex 600 ESP picking up soon thanks to To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. T-Rex 500 CF w/ TT/Kasama tail/HS5245MG's/401/9257(flies superbest!) T-Rex 450 V2.5 w/ Scorpion -8 V2/CC 35A/HS65HB's/401/9257/Align V3 head & torque tube upgrade (flies superb) Crashing is half of the "learning" ... right?

07-20-2008, 02:05 AM	#2
felborn Registered Users Thread Starter Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Sandnes, Norway	Really noone who got any opinions on this? Im really stuck here, and dunno what to do to fix this. Any and all opinions and advice would be greatly appriciated.

07-20-2008, 02:22 AM	#3
psindrup Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Denmark	Hei Norge Your longer flight times, and the fact that you believe that you can hear a difference between your and your friends heli, indicates head speed. -> Lower head speed, indicates ESC or ESC setup I know that you have reprogrammed your ESC, but are you absolutely sure that you did it correctly (with a linear throttle curve during setup) Your lower power consumption indicates that everything runs freely. To get "facts on the table" I think you need to tack the head speed. De bedste hilsner Peter

07-20-2008, 02:32 AM	#4
arky Registered Users Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Dorset UK	My Align ESC did this to me i had another and swaped it out all is fine now, it sill works but with reduced power running the old ESC, i am running an after market motor though z20/1700 it pulls 35amps so slightly more and may have worn the ESC out who knows ? jason

07-20-2008, 04:01 AM	#7
felborn Registered Users Thread Starter Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Sandnes, Norway	I will do a couple of flights with the E-logger connected and check my actual headspeed. Very odd, everything was working perfectly until that last crash. Both blades and main gear are fairly free spenning, cant notice any difference there. When this crash did happen, the battery was ejected during the crash and was disconnected from the ESC while still running I guess. No real reason why that should damage anything tho, but im wondering if it did not the less. I set it up again last nigth, running an linear throttlecurve and all, but no change. The 500 ESC's aint got the best rep, we had one die on it's very first flight. Poor guy was hovering when it lost power, autoed down and that was that, completely dead ESC... Still find it odd that it should operate perfectly, just not at full capacity tho. If im getting a new ESC, it's gonna be a scorpion for sure thistime, Right now im wondering if I should just get a 14T pinion and see how that works tho, might be a 5$ fix?

07-20-2008, 04:01 AM	#8
BlackTitanium Registered Users My HF Map location Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Monroe, WA	Did you try using your friends LiPo? Yours may be losing it's punch.

07-20-2008, 09:51 PM	#16
justin keaton Registered Users Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: morristown tn,	yea check your pitch, cause about every time i crash the pitch is off about 2 or 3 degrees if it a hard crash. just caus the links havent come off or broke dont mean they didnt get crammed down a turn or 2

07-20-2008, 11:36 PM	#17
vicrc Registered Users Join Date: Jan 2008	If you are using the stock 500L motor the magnets will move causing it to be misaligned and result in less power. Change out the motor.

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode