Max altitude? - HeliFreak
Fun, Learning, Friendship and Mutual Respect START  HERE


Unregistered
Go Back   HeliFreak > R/C Helicopters > Aerial Videography and Photography > FPV and Real time Video


FPV and Real time Video Discussions of receiving video in realtime from the aircraft


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 11-29-2008, 03:04 AM   #1 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
Posts: 73
 

Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Gig Harbor
Default Max altitude?

Thinking about trying something.

Don't immediately shoot me down when I tell you I want to fly me T-rex halfway into the troposphere! LOL

I know it's possible.

Most fliers know how to calculate disc loading, if you don't here's how. Just by dividing your heli's weight by it's rotor diameter... Actually by 3.1415.. multiplied by the rotor diameter squared divided by 4.

It's just going to give you the area of the rotor disc in comparison to it's weight.

I typical RC heli is 1 to 3 kg/square meters of rotor area...

While a full scale heli has 30 to 50 kg/square meters of rotor area...

RC helis also have like ten times the RPM in their rotor heads...


http://www.eurocopter.com/publicatio...EN&news_id=317 If a full scale heli can reach 30,000ft, I bet with determination and the right FPV setup, you could bring the curvature of the earth into view from your model.


Need to prepare electronics for sub zero temperatures, thinking of an insulated fuselage with a couple chemical-heat packs in it if the electronics don't generate enough heat...

Need to work on improving radio range, I know a lot of todays 2.4ghz systems can transmit almost a mile! But I'm going to use an FM system because I know how to amplify it's signal...

The receiver for the wireless camera.... Ohh what to do? But where there's a will there's a way.

Also going to put several high capacity packs in parallel for this since it takes time to reach high altitudes, is going to decrease it's disc loading, but what can you do?


EDIT: Might stick with 2.4ghz after all... http://www.shireeninc.com/products/m...ts/amplifiers/
__________________
MA .90 who knew it could mulch magpies...
Kiwi of Nitro is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 11-29-2008, 10:36 AM   #2 (permalink)
 

Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: planet earth
Default

turbulence?
unklebuck is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-29-2008, 05:23 PM   #3 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
Posts: 73
Thread Starter Thread Starter
 

Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Gig Harbor
Default

Which OSD do you guys run? I need the home arrow feature, distance from home and an altimeter.

I'll be using a 1000mw 2.4ghz TX and 550 line cam, plus a 14dbi high gain antenna. I think that should cut it... Also using a set of high res video glasses...

Where do you guys prefer to buy your equipment from?
__________________
MA .90 who knew it could mulch magpies...
Kiwi of Nitro is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 11-30-2008, 08:57 AM   #4 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
Posts: 1,199
 

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Alexandria, VA
Default

Wow, your idea is CRAZY!!! but hey....someone has to try it
To do what you plan to do.... you need the knowledge... not just about RC. Regarding your questions of the range... some people might have already done some of the homework for you and you can check their works. If you have what it takes (knowledge wise), you should be able to replicate their systems. Just report back with failure and sucess.... I want to know how this goes since someday I would like to do long range flights with FPV

Thomass Cherrer is one of the guys that has done plenty of research on the long distance rx/tx an actually build and sells the system go to far far away areas
He is also working on the video part here If you will have to read many pages but I believe on his first post, he has shared the specs of what he's done and kept it updated so....if you have the knowledge.... you can copy the design.

Tron is another guys that builds and sells this stuff but he uses 869 Mhz though. He is from Spain and has some videos of what he's done... 25km.. not bad.

AnthonyRC is another person that posted having flown 40km (25 miles) with FPV. He lists his equipment throughout his video

Ideas for amplifiers here at the bottom of the first page, you will also find useful links to places like hyperlinktech, framplifiers, etc.

For the OSD, I decided to go with Eagletreesystems's set up. You can get the equipment now and get the "pro", which is just the update later for $20 bucks... not bad, uh. Read more here... they are very active on that forum. By the way, with their system you can also see your TX/RX signal strengh, which would be very helpful for your task. By the way, if you go into orbit.... could you grab this for me, it has a tracker here
Good luck!
__________________
JR X9303 TREX 500, TREX450, Joker 3 (almost ready),Typhoon3D, EZ* FPV, Stryker (Acromaster and EZG still in box)
merlin703 is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-01-2008, 02:39 AM   #5 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
Posts: 73
Thread Starter Thread Starter
 

Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Gig Harbor
Default

Thanks for the info Merlin!

This might get expensive, I can't seem to find out where Thomass Cherrer sells his UHF radio amplifier (if he's making and selling that equipment). I couldn't put that together myself...

Still looking for a more powerful video transmitter... and a receiver antenna that will pick it up... I'm a little lost... I'll research some more...

I head intelligentflight.com is putting out a radio amplification system in a while that will get 100-200km range.
__________________
MA .90 who knew it could mulch magpies...
Kiwi of Nitro is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-01-2008, 02:55 AM   #6 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
Posts: 73
Thread Starter Thread Starter
 

Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Gig Harbor
Default

Ok.

80,000 feet! http://jonpet55.latestdot.net/eos1eng.htm

It was done with a balloon though. I don't know if many helis could maintain lift at those altitudes, or planes, but with their enormous power to weight ratio... Maybe..

It's late, but some time this week I'll calculate the lift at low pressure...

I can see if I need to make main and tail blades with more surface area... These blades will hopefull still fly at low altitudes, and they will be more effiecent and auto better too...

Full scale helis are usually limited in altitude by the tail stalling out... But their tails are less powerful and aren't capable of spinning the airframe around like an RC....
__________________
MA .90 who knew it could mulch magpies...
Kiwi of Nitro is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-02-2008, 12:17 PM   #7 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
Posts: 1,200
 

Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: nYc
Default

Good luck dude. I would just do it like this:

Start by reaching 400ft
then 600
then 800
and so on until you do not have radio link. If it cuts out, in a few seconds it should start working again.

Also, Which airframe will you be using...size,powerplant, run time are all factors. Also consider the air may be blowing harder then on the earth. I would atleast go with a .50 size helicopter, as I am sure a 450 would get thrown around like a rag doll.
__________________
Trex450v2/cxhead,cc35,65MG,9650/401,2221-8/13T
Trex500ESP-8cell beast ICE100,Scorp 1210kv,510's,spartan/MKS8910
Trex600NSP--Hyper50,Align gov,Align pipe,7703D+8900,Hitec 5965's,s3003 for throttle
7c 2.4
DarkHeli is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-03-2008, 02:09 PM   #8 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
Posts: 547
 

Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Baaaston
Default

seems to be an outrageous enderver.. good luck
Bostonewbie is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 12-21-2008, 10:48 AM   #9 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
Posts: 87
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Santa Clara, CA
Default

Good luck, but note that you would be in violation of the AMA safety code & FAA regulations, so if you are doing this from the US, make sure you obtain the appropriate waivers (from AMA) and permissions (from FAA) so they know that there's going to be a model aircraft above 400 ft in a certain place at a certain time, etc. Have to do this all the time with high powered model rockets (which is a more effective way do do what you are wanting to do, by the way...)

Peter+
pvogel is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-28-2009, 04:23 PM   #10 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
Posts: 177
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: USA
Default

Not sure about model aircraft, but real aircraft have to have a transponder in order to operate at or above 10,000 feet msl. You would definitely have to check with the AMA and FAA.
El Bucho is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-29-2009, 01:51 AM   #11 (permalink)
 

Join Date: May 2008
Location: New York City
Default

Have you calculated the round trip flight time into your equation? Keep in mind you need to stay out of the flight path of commercial traffic.
Flightlutions is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 01-29-2009, 03:09 AM   #12 (permalink)
Registered Users
 

Join Date: May 2006
Location: Kuala Lumpur, MALAYSIA
Default

I had a buddy who claims he flew his heli to about 4000 feet (can't tell exactly as we didn't have telemetry back then). Reliable witnesses backed his claim, so I'm just forwarding it here.

This is of course illegal flying height.


To contact Thomas Scherrer:

e-mail: thomas@webx.dk
or go to his thread (if he doesn't have one here at Helifreak):
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=905915


Good luck!
borneobear is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-28-2009, 09:42 PM   #13 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
Posts: 208
 

Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Pompano Beach, Florida
Default

How would you track your heli? For that matter, how would you keep it upright?

I know you've thought of it but I was just wondering.

This is almost too crazy not to try!
__________________
Crash Expert In Training
Pompano Mike is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 02-28-2009, 10:15 PM   #14 (permalink)
Registered Users
 

Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Brunswick Maine
Default

i want to see a vid of that! prepaired, and after the flight ( if its all in one piece! ) but no hard feelings
helidevil is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 03-28-2009, 04:16 PM   #15 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Stevenage, Hertfordshire
Default

At that altitude arn't ya gonna meet up with some jet stream winds?? probably a few hundred mph?

Brave attempt...

Steve
HeliEye is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-05-2009, 02:13 PM   #16 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
Posts: 73
Thread Starter Thread Starter
 

Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Gig Harbor
Default

This is too insane. It would take 30 minutes of traveling straight upward at 30mph to reach 80,000ft.

I can't afford to build a machine for this and risk losing it, I'll just continue building rockets as the multi-stage ones can do this no problem..
__________________
MA .90 who knew it could mulch magpies...
Kiwi of Nitro is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-20-2009, 05:07 PM   #17 (permalink)
Registered Users
 

Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: NY
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by El Bucho View Post
Not sure about model aircraft, but real aircraft have to have a transponder in order to operate at or above 10,000 feet msl. You would definitely have to check with the AMA and FAA.
Transponder ( mode c ) is required for ANY flight above 18,000. Also there are locations that can require its usage all the way to the ground.

Also .. once at 18,000 msl ( Flight level 180 ) The reference changes. Your alt is no longer an actual distance to the ground. But uses a reference setting on the alt. ( 29.92 or is it 29.95 .. I forget )
Kevo450 is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply




Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the HeliFreak forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your REAL and WORKING email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself. Use a real email address or you will not be granted access to the site. Thank you.
Email Address:
Location
Where do you live? ie: Country, State, City or General Geographic Location please.
Name and Lastname
Enter name and last name here. (This information is not shown to the general public. Optional)
Helicopter #1
Enter Helicopter #1 type and equipment.
Insurance
Please select your insurance company (Optional)
Helicopter #2
Enter Helicopter #2 type and equipment.
Helicopter #3
Enter Helicopter #3 type and equipment.
Helicopter #4
Enter Helicopter #4 type and equipment.

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On




Copyright © Website Acquisitions Inc. All rights reserved.
 

SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1