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Old 07-03-2010, 10:24 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Flymentor vs Copilot 2

Okay guys I need some help now. I have purchased both systems, and would like to get into doing some A/V for fun. The helis are the HK500GT and the CX450ME. Now I think the 500 would be the better platform for the a/v ship, so some opinions on theses systems would be helpfull. Most of the terrain I would be flying over to start with would mostly be flat , but would like to take it into the hills for some a/v as the rockies are next door. Any thoughts? Thanx in advance!
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Old 07-04-2010, 12:58 PM   #2 (permalink)
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CP2 is really flight recovery and not designed to hold your heli in a perfect hands off hover.
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Old 07-06-2010, 04:34 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vanguy View Post
CP2 is really flight recovery and not designed to hold your heli in a perfect hands off hover.

but it has been done
but you are still correct
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Old 07-06-2010, 10:28 PM   #4 (permalink)
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The biggest problem is there is such a thing called perfect level terrain, you end up always has to adjust for level
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Old 07-07-2010, 03:41 AM   #5 (permalink)
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I just baught it, when i wake up i'm going out and fly see how copilot react, i never used such of a thing.
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Old 07-18-2010, 09:09 AM   #6 (permalink)
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The flymentor just uses the 3 axis gyro to maintain stability, set it up level and that's the initial reference. The drawback might be that the gyro resolution and rate change measurements can lag in some fast manoevures. It also has some issues with rapid temperature changes, then many gyros do that too but it is a problem to be aware of.

The CP systems use the IR horizon as a reference, there isn't any significant lag with the IR measurement system. As you get higher the IR horizon does tend to level out, it's just a matter of going high enough!

Both will recover from inverted flight IF you give them enough air space. The bias in both is to try to roll back to horizontal as this is slightly easier and shouldn't loose too much altitude. For both recovery is going to be 'safer' if you are carrying some forward or reverse speed, in both if the tail gyro response and set up isn't really good then forward is better.
The Flymentor gyro does work but the mechanical/electonics set up is far more critical and it does lack a bit of resolution so recovery from invert with some tail first motion can look really messy. THE CP with a good tail gyro and set up is going to be much cleaner.
How much is 'too much' depends on the heli set up and the system set up. If you've damped out the aileron/elevator/pitch responses in the flymentor set up (set at less than 100% so reduced throws) then as much as you can get is maybe enough!

So for areas where you can see the horizon CPs work well, where the horizon isn't level with big hills close it can get confused. Same on sloping ground, it can let the heli slide down the slope, it's quite correctable and fun at 30+ degrees (it's hilly and forested around here). This can lead to some quirks if you are in valley or an enclosed space where it can cause more problems than its worth. You can fudge the calibration but it isn't going to be happy. Drop down below a ridge and it'll scoot off, sometimes quite fast which can be surprising.
The Flymentor really doesn't care as it is working against it's initialisation references to determine when it's level. It also seems to handle adverse conditions well and will keep the heli stable in quite gusty winds. Mines handled a 10mph base gusting to 15 and kept remarkably stable.

Of the two I'd prefer the Flymentor as it works almost anywhere and would probably be the system of choice for video work. The more sopisticated 'real' version with GPS would be the dogs but is of course much much more expensive.

Of course you always have the option of flying the heli yourself.
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Old 07-27-2010, 04:04 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
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The flymentor just uses the 3 axis gyro to maintain stability, set it up level and that's the initial reference. The drawback might be that the gyro resolution and rate change measurements can lag in some fast manoevures. It also has some issues with rapid temperature changes, then many gyros do that too but it is a problem to be aware of.

The CP systems use the IR horizon as a reference, there isn't any significant lag with the IR measurement system. As you get higher the IR horizon does tend to level out, it's just a matter of going high enough!

Both will recover from inverted flight IF you give them enough air space. The bias in both is to try to roll back to horizontal as this is slightly easier and shouldn't loose too much altitude. For both recovery is going to be 'safer' if you are carrying some forward or reverse speed, in both if the tail gyro response and set up isn't really good then forward is better.
The Flymentor gyro does work but the mechanical/electonics set up is far more critical and it does lack a bit of resolution so recovery from invert with some tail first motion can look really messy. THE CP with a good tail gyro and set up is going to be much cleaner.
How much is 'too much' depends on the heli set up and the system set up. If you've damped out the aileron/elevator/pitch responses in the flymentor set up (set at less than 100% so reduced throws) then as much as you can get is maybe enough!

So for areas where you can see the horizon CPs work well, where the horizon isn't level with big hills close it can get confused. Same on sloping ground, it can let the heli slide down the slope, it's quite correctable and fun at 30+ degrees (it's hilly and forested around here). This can lead to some quirks if you are in valley or an enclosed space where it can cause more problems than its worth. You can fudge the calibration but it isn't going to be happy. Drop down below a ridge and it'll scoot off, sometimes quite fast which can be surprising.
The Flymentor really doesn't care as it is working against it's initialisation references to determine when it's level. It also seems to handle adverse conditions well and will keep the heli stable in quite gusty winds. Mines handled a 10mph base gusting to 15 and kept remarkably stable.

Of the two I'd prefer the Flymentor as it works almost anywhere and would probably be the system of choice for video work. The more sopisticated 'real' version with GPS would be the dogs but is of course much much more expensive.

Of course you always have the option of flying the heli yourself.
that makes me feel better thanks, im even happier with my FM now
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Old 07-27-2010, 08:29 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Well I have recieved both now, and have installed the CP II in the 450, but am having issues programming the tx. As for the flymentor, that will go into the 500 for an a/v platform. It sure looks alot easier to work with and set up than the CP II. The amount of wires are a tight fit on a 450. Also should have the field programmer for the FM early next week. Now just have to finish building the 500!
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Old 07-27-2010, 08:59 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Ordered Flymentor for B400. Hope it helps.
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Old 07-27-2010, 09:34 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Ohh it will work wonders on your Blade especially with the DX7. Keep the present gyro though
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Old 07-28-2010, 04:24 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pril250 View Post
Ohh it will work wonders on your Blade especially with the DX7. Keep the present gyro though
I've been reading the online manual before the FM arrives. Not quite sure about using the present gyro.
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Old 07-28-2010, 05:19 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by bugbitten View Post
I've been reading the online manual before the FM arrives. Not quite sure about using the present gyro.
Why is that
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Old 07-29-2010, 05:56 PM   #13 (permalink)
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FM + Quark = SWEET!!!

Jim
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Old 07-29-2010, 06:08 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Here here Same combo
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Old 07-29-2010, 06:39 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Okay. I reread the manual. I see that I can use my 520s with FM.

I just ordered a 2nd unit today. One for my heli-mechanic buddy. One for me.

We'll read up on the forums to figure out the install.
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Old 07-29-2010, 07:00 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Sounds good, there is a great deal of help available here if it be in existing posts or by directing questions at those who have been through the ropes. Good luck
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