V-Bar Tail Tuning and Troubleshooting Guide with Mikado Logo Example

[vad0r]

Hi Justin,

Thanks a lot for your quick response

I will try this at the field this week end.

Thanks again.

Vad0r.

[helinuwby]

ok i got one for ya, on my logo 600 and vbar, my tail is soft, mushy is the best way to describe it i put my gain over a 100 to 105 it stops solid, in the any thing lower it just starts getting mushy again now on fff or if i kick the out to left say 30 degress it get a severe wag, as i decrease main another 15 to 20 points it will go away, if i leave the gain high and just piroette to the left not stopping going in to the wind, it is fine
my complaint with vbar is
tail is not solid
and wags when the tail steps out to left or when it loads to the left, even if im just doing stationary piroettes, and u go straight to center, tail does not stop solid
best way to describe its coasting to a stop

i have done the compinsation, and i have went up on the stop gains but no help
what else to do

[vad0r]

Hi,
Back from the flying field, I have tested the following parameters (thanks Justin Pucci for your help);
-First flight : P and I Gain 75/75 , Collective 15 / Cyclic 5
-Second flight : P and I Gain 70/70 , Collective 10 / Cyclic 3
Obviously the tail wagg is still here but a bit "less",
here is the second flight :

[Justin Pucci]

Vad0r,

It does sound better, but it still sounds over-gainy to me. Did you re-tune your common gain (the slider on the front page) once you made those changes? Go back and read the first part of section 2 in my original post about how to tune the tail gain. Good luck!

Cheers,
-->Justin

[heliwaz]

I cant see the tail wag due to the video but it sounds like its entering a fast wag at times. In which case doing what your doing means its way to high. Put it in a hurricane & see if it wags then ( I didn't watch the whole video, internet isn't the best), but i saw some instances where it was & it protested instantly). Turn down the main gain. Also test it in wind because its bound to do it then. Also in a hurricane.
It shouldn't do what its doing at either of the P & I locations.
Setup up bank switching so you can control your gain from your radio, confirm that the gain changes when you have your vbar connected to your computer, then go fly.

[vad0r]

Originally Posted by Justin Pucci

Vad0r,

It does sound better, but it still sounds over-gainy to me. Did you re-tune your common gain (the slider on the front page) once you made those changes? Go back and read the first part of section 2 in my original post about how to tune the tail gain. Good luck!

Cheers,
-->Justin

No I didn't, I will do it today and let you know. Thanks a lot for your help.

[carlocivicsi]

i set everything up in the vbar software. i was told to adjust the dual rates on the radio to achieve the 9 or 10 degrees cyclic since i have the express software. but when i adjust the dual rates like shown in the video a get a slow respond to the movements of the sticks.

i have no idea how to fix this.

here is the link:

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XmVPf8Gj_ms[/ame]

[MrMel]

Do NOT use DR to limit cyclic, that is NOT the correct way to setup a heli.
Watch my setup videos.

If you have too much throw in cyclic step, mecahnical change is only way
That said, you cannot judge anything from what it does on bench

[carlocivicsi]

Originally Posted by MrMel

Do NOT use DR to limit cyclic, that is NOT the correct way to setup a heli.
Watch my setup videos.

If you have too much throw in cyclic step, mecahnical change is only way
That said, you cannot judge anything from what it does on bench

According to Rainer from vbar he told me to use DR to adjust cyclic to desire degrees. I'm running EXPRESS software. So I'm confused. If I leave everything 100 in DR it gives me way to much cyclic. I don't wanna crash my heli. You got like 100 videos. Can you give me the link to the video where you say you explain this. Thanks

[MrMel]

DR is used to control rollrate in express, not limit the mechanical throw.

Start a new thread where you post your vbr file.

[carlocivicsi]

Originally Posted by MrMel

DR is used to control rollrate in express, not limit the mechanical throw.

Start a new thread where you post your vbr file.

https://www.helifreak.com/showthread...26#post3290926

here it is like you asked. thanks.

[BakedMopar]

Okay I have a question. I was having some kick on punch outs and rainbows. I needed the precomp up in the 40 range so I decided to to try the 75/75/75 10/3 settings. Today I was testing and had a wag in hover. I lowered and lowered but it didn't go away so I went up. It doesnt wag now and the tail doesnt sounds angry, flies well to me but gain values seems high (115 common, was 100 with stock settings). I know that every heli is different due to setup etc but Is this uncommon or maybe it was too low common gain with stock settings also?

[Justin Pucci]

Having a common gain of 115 is not uncommon by any means. I tend to see people's helis optimize between 95-115 quite frequently, so if you've fixed your kicking and wagging problems and the heli flies well, then I think you're done!

Good job!

Cheers,
-->J

[Tuonoblu77]

Hello at all,
I need some help to tune tail of my Trex700 nitro with V-bar blu linee ver.5.2.5:

1 problem) If I do some pitch pumps from the hovering the tail rotate CCW more or less 5 °-10° and after an instant back in axis. Seems it reacts a bit late then recovers. I have a fast tail servo MKS BLS980.

2 problem) If I do some fast CCW piro and stop, tail stop perfet but if I do some CW piro and stop, tail go beyond 5°- 10° and after an instant back in axis.

Below you can find my settings for tail,
Thanks for the help

[crash1000]

I have the exact the same problem having the bls251 and my numbers are also identical to yours.

[Justin Pucci]

Originally Posted by Tuonoblu77

Hello at all,
I need some help to tune tail of my Trex700 nitro with V-bar blu linee ver.5.2.5:

1 problem) If I do some pitch pumps from the hovering the tail rotate CCW more or less 5 °-10° and after an instant back in axis. Seems it reacts a bit late then recovers. I have a fast tail servo MKS BLS980.

2 problem) If I do some fast CCW piro and stop, tail stop perfet but if I do some CW piro and stop, tail go beyond 5°- 10° and after an instant back in axis.

Below you can find my settings for tail,
Thanks for the help

Blu77 and Crash,

Try setting your P gain, I gain, and acceleration to 75/75/75 and your collective and cyclic precomps to 13 and 3, respectively. Enable your optimizer and then go tune your common gain.

A common gain of 70 is very low for a 90-sized machine and is likely the cause of your ccw kicking in punch outs...you just don't have enough holding power at that low value. Once you've tuned your common gain per my OP or MrMel's videos, adjust the stop gains to get the tail stopping that you're after.

See my post #31 on adjustment of precomps with respect to P and I gain, should you find the need to tweak them further.

Good luck!

Cheers,
-->J


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Tuonoblu77]

Many thanks,
As soon as the freeze ends (temperature -10 °) I'm going to try.
Bye
Giovanni

Originally Posted by Justin Pucci

Blu77 and Crash,

Try setting your P gain, I gain, and acceleration to 75/75/75 and your collective and cyclic precomps to 13 and 3, respectively. Enable your optimizer and then go tune your common gain.

A common gain of 70 is very low for a 90-sized machine and is likely the cause of your ccw kicking in punch outs...you just don't have enough holding power at that low value. Once you've tuned your common gain per my OP or MrMel's videos, adjust the stop gains to get the tail stopping that you're after.

See my post #31 on adjustment of precomps with respect to P and I gain, should you find the need to tweak them further.

Good luck!

Cheers,
-->J


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[rcthai9898]

Stopping of the tail. Clockwise, counterclockwise, not equal.
What do I need to set up.
Thank you.

[tmafra]

Im having a hard time with my X5s tail.

The gain is at 70% but i cant get rid of the tail wag no matter what i do.

Ive rebuilt the tail like 10 times everything looks perfectly smooth but it just wont go away!

It takes off fine, but after a few pitch pumps it starts wagging slowly.

I lowered the I GAIN to 40 it was better but the tail started feeling a bit loose.

Then i lowered the P GAIN all the way to 60 and it wag faster, specially with high pitch imputs

Should the Gyro gain change after changing P and I gains? it didnt seem to make any difference

Im almost giving up and leaving it this way... it flies very nice, but the wag sure is annoying to look at

[seemore74]

Don't know if this has been asked before but can I control the tail gain on my miniV from my radio? (futaba 8fg)