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Old 05-29-2012, 02:48 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Found help - Shuttle swashplate

I'm not sure this is the proper place for this question, but here goes. I converted my Shuttle to electric and spooled it up for the 1st time. I haven't flown this heli before. I noticed that the swashplate was gaining left cyclic as I increased the throttle. The pitch and all cyclic movements are operating normal. Since the heli has a natrual tendency to move to the left, the left cyclic from increaseing the throttle magnifies the movement. I'm using a T7C for the tx. Should I reverse the swashplate somehow in the tx menu?

Thanks in advance
Tman

Last edited by Tman49; 06-03-2012 at 04:22 PM.. Reason: Got info needed
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Old 05-30-2012, 05:17 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Hi!

First, be sure that your swashplate is correctly set-up, i.e. use a leveling tool and be sure that it is level everywhere from min to max pitch. Then check the max cyclic deflection at max/min elevator and aileron. Be sure there's no binding. If you have a "swash ring" function on your tx, enable it only after you've done the setup.

Then, make sure that your blades are balanced and have the same center of gravity. Fix any issues with tracking tape.

Then, check the blade tracking. You should be able to get this absolutely perfect.

Then, check your throttle curve. For normal throttle, I first find out what percent throttle gives me the right head speed in a hover, say that is 60%, but it may be different for you, then I set my throttle curve as:
  • 0%
  • 60%
  • 60%
  • 60%
  • 60%
For flat curve. If you want to set up idle curves, do that after you have the normal one working ok.


If all that doesn't help, then you have to start disassembling the head, replacing main and feather shaft...


Let us know how it goes.
Ciao,
Bob
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Old 05-30-2012, 09:00 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Default Shuttle swash

Bob,
Thanks for the input. As I was putting this heli together, I paid close attention to the construction of the head assembly per owner's manual. When I spooled it up, everything appeared good except the aileron servo applied left cyclic. I haven't seen any signs of binding. I will inhibit mixing of the "swash ring" for now. I'll recheck the levelness of the swashplate.

I've balanced blades before, but never focused on the center of gravity. Is that balancing each blade at their center point? If you mean have the center point be the same for each blade, that sounds like a little more precise of a task. Sounds like I may have done this procedure wrong or incompletely. I've just made sure a pair of blades were balanced. I'll check the blade tracking also.

Another HF member asked if I had the T7C on H-1 type swash. I have it on HE3 type swash. I did that because of the position of the aileron and elevator pushrods. After reading the info on H-1 type, I can see how it could be the correct type. I'll try that and see what happens.

You mentioned
what percent throttle gives the "right headspeed" for hover. I'm assuming the process is to hover, and since my esc has data logging, check the esc for the data. Then set up the throttle curve for that % that produces hover. I don't see my tx producing that kind of info. If I sound like a newbie, that's because I am.

Thanks for your time.
Thomas
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Old 05-31-2012, 03:27 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Tman49 View Post
Bob,
Another HF member asked if I had the T7C on H-1 type swash. I have it on HE3 type swash. I did that because of the position of the aileron and elevator pushrods. After reading the info on H-1 type, I can see how it could be the correct type. I'll try that and see what happens.
Oh Yea! If you are using the normal shuttle swashplate set up, (I don't think there is any other one) then the SWASH on the tx MUST BE SET TO H-1, which means one servo per function. This is the way swashplates were designed before tx's were programmable.

So forget everything else I said and fix that NOW. The rest should be of only minor, even insignificant consequence compared to the wrong swash setting on the radio.

I'm sorry I didn't mention that in my first post, but it never even occurred to me. Do you have the shuttle manual? It should be clearly explained in steps 28 & 30, I think.

Keep us informed - and don't give up!
Ciao,
bob
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Old 05-31-2012, 10:26 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Default Shuttle swash

Thanks for the follow up Bob. I hope to have time to work on the heli very soon. I'll be in touch. Thanks for your time.

And thanks Helifreak!

Thomas
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Old 06-03-2012, 02:47 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Default Shuttle swash & beyond

Well I got that problem solved! It's on H-1 type swash, and working fine. I spooled it up in my basement and I was impressed and nervous at the same time. As I mentioned earlier, this was the 1st time for this heli. The original Shuttle I had was nitro (acquired it Nov. 2011), and had problems w/that *#+! belt start! So some of the parts went on the 2nd Shuttle I got in a super deal.

Now I need to concentrate on the gyro control. When I had it light on it's skids it spun to the left. I have the GY520 set to slow response per the suggestion of the gyro manual. I also need to see if I can get the room for a ball on the servo horn. Right now I have the rod Z-bent connected to the horn. I see some play in that connection.

Finally, I checked the data from the Phoenix Lite on the computer. I'm not sure what all that data means or what I'm suppose to take from it. Temp, wattage, and voltage are understandable. How can knowing the Voltage Ripple, Ampere hours, Throttle In, Power Out, help me? Is the RPM the motor or headspeed?

Got any answers?
When I get it up like I want it, it'll be part of the Airwolf fuse. That's my dream.
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Old 06-04-2012, 07:17 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Tman49 View Post
Well I got that problem solved! It's on H-1 type swash, and working fine.
Great! I was sure that was it!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tman49 View Post
Now I need to concentrate on the gyro control. When I had it light on it's skids it spun to the left. I have the GY520 set to slow response per the suggestion of the gyro manual. I also need to see if I can get the room for a ball on the servo horn. Right now I have the rod Z-bent connected to the horn. I see some play in that connection.
The GY520 is a GREAT gyro and will definitely be able to do the job. Be sure that the tail is mechanically correct. You can check this by trying to hover with the gyro on rate (also called "normal") mode and adjusting the linkage so that the tail is +/- stable in steady hover. This adjustment doesn't have to be very precise. The idea is that with tail servo centered there should be enough pitch on the tail blades to counteract the torque generated at hover rpm. Then set-up heading hold mode without changing the linkage length.

You can try to put some thin plastic shims/washers between the Z-bend and the servo-arm to take up the slop. I used some old bits of servo arm, filed a grove to lock into the push-rod on my Lama which is really just an adapted Shuttle.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tman49 View Post
Finally, I checked the data from the Phoenix Lite on the computer. I'm not sure what all that data means or what I'm suppose to take from it. Temp, wattage, and voltage are understandable. How can knowing the Voltage Ripple, Ampere hours, Throttle In, Power Out, help me? Is the RPM the motor or headspeed?
The RPM is motor RPM, use a headspeed calculator to get the headspeed: http://heli.dacsa.net/calcv3/

Don't worry, you are very close to seeing that Airwolf fly! But be patient!!! I've been building my Lama for over a year and still not ready for the maiden flight... The longer you spend building the more fun it is!

Ciao,
Bob.
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Old 06-06-2012, 08:54 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Man-o-man, I feel so dumb sometimes. When I stop and think about it, there is no way the esc can tell what the headspeed is. Of course the RPM is the motor rpm. Thanks for not calling me a dumba$$.

Thanks for the info also. Now got to find some time to work on it again, flyin time is here.
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Old 06-07-2012, 05:07 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Man-o-man, I feel so dumb sometimes...
Hey man, don't be so hard on yourself! We've all been there, gone through that... Some of us like me, go through it again and again and again... You can't imagine how many times I've tried to paint three white tail blades yellow, and still haven't got 3 yellow blades... If I were capable of being embarrassed, it would be embarrassing

Keep at it! Keep communicating! No one will make fun of you on Helifreaks!

Now to remove the yellow paint and try again.

Ciao,
Bob
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