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Old 05-05-2017, 02:59 PM   #81 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by BRANDON L View Post
Yes you are correct and that's a shame too because I heard nothing but good about the pro series. I never owned or seen one in person though.
I have a 550X and it's been a fantastic heli. Flies great and it's been very reliable. I was sad to see it go.

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Like i said I think a lot of people especially noobs would buy a replacement airframe for spare parts or if they have a bad crash.
I did exactly that. I actually have three 550Xs. I snapped up two non-combo kits when they were blowing them out at fire sale prices. I got one for not much over $200 with some stacked e-coupons. Heck, just the frames, blades and canopy alone cost over $200.
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Old 05-05-2017, 03:12 PM   #82 (permalink)
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Ultra micros like the mcpx/ncpx were Blade's bread and butter and people are ditching them for the XK-110 and v977. That's what that comment was aimed at.

180 is a decent heli but other than the cost of blades my Mini P costs about the same to crash only flies much better. Rather pay more per crash to have every single​ flight be more satisfying/fun. Guess if you're still crashing a lot it might be worth it but for me it's not.

Nothing has to compete with the 230, it's just a big nano. Nothing special about it and think my nano cpx even handled wind better.

Yes Number likes his nano but he put real motors in it which is exactly my point. No SAFE with some balls. Exactly what I'm asking for instead of another unreliable, gutless heli aimed at beginners which they already have more than enough of.

Can't say a heli is great if you replaced major components and doubled the purchase price in the process.

Oxy2 is the same price as the 180 if you try to get the 180 even close to the same quality/level of performance but that's more than I care to spend on a little heli. Makes crashing cost as much as a 450 which totally eliminates the only reason I have to fly a small heli.

I want something reliable, with some pop but still cheapish to crash. Not expecting Oxy2 performance​, just enough to be fun instead of disappointing.


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Nope, and I never said it was a powerhouse. However, lots of people liked the original nCPX. Ask the member named Number here. He'll tell you and he can fly the crap out of his.

What's a viable alternative option for the 230S from another manufacturer? What's another option for TT tail 180CFX? Since you said same class/price range, the OXY 2 is larger and considerably more expensive to get flying than a STOCK 180CFX. Yeah, it just got discontinued, but plenty are still around for purchase.
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Last edited by learnedthehardway; 05-05-2017 at 03:33 PM..
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Old 05-05-2017, 03:27 PM   #83 (permalink)
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I was joking around with another member here that with our luck we'll see the Blade 800S with SAFE and a large motorized tail .. LOL
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Old 05-05-2017, 03:32 PM   #84 (permalink)
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Nothing has to compete with the 230, it's just a big nano. Nothing special about it and think my nano Cox even handled wind better
The 230S is far from being just a big nCPX/S. Just the difference in size class alone puts them far apart. And 1S versus 3S, seriously? LOL I never had a Nano, but I did have a hair bigger mCPX which was basically the same thing as the nCPX, so compare those two as being very similar. The 230S is dual brushess, which even the newer nCPS isn't, has real metal geared standard sized servos, has a much better and separate FBL/RX unit, separate dual esc, etc. The 230S flies great and I find it to handle the wind quite well. Better than my 180CFX does, even. I also enjoy flight times of 5.5-6min easily of some pretty sporty flying versus three-ish minutes from the ultra-micro stuff.

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Originally Posted by learnedthehardway View Post
No SAFE with some balls. Exactly what I'm asking for instead of another unreliable, gutless heli aimed at beginners which they already have more than enough of.
Who cares about SAFE? Don't like it, don't use it. Same as we do with our iKONS and other FBL units that have the same SAFE type features. Remember, that also includes a rescue feature that so many were going gaga over with the MSH update. Many of those people wanted it and weren't beginners at all, so it's definitely value added to many people outside newbiedom. And, while the 230S isn't a rocket ship, it isn't gutless. Just look at all of the videos out there of people really flying them. It's also not unreliable. In fact, it's been one of the most reliable helis they've ever released, especially in the micro category. It's certainly not as bad as the POS nCPS that so many people hate. Most everyone who owns a 230S really likes it.

Last edited by Mike680; 05-05-2017 at 03:43 PM..
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Old 05-05-2017, 04:36 PM   #85 (permalink)
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I think something like this guys nano would be a great seller. Its 2s double bl, external esc's and a micro brain with cf frame. Bling optional.
That's my mCPX, I feel flattered by you re-posting it. Yes that would be something more expensive than Blade would be willing to produce. Just the cost of the uBrain and the brushless outrunners is more than HH charges for a whole heli that size. Though it is the ultimate setup for a micro in my mind and that's why I built it.

Is it worth the money? I think it is, I really enjoy the hell out of that little guy and it flies like my bigger ones having a proper FBL controller. Sorry Blade, but I feel your controllers just don't class with the ones from guys like MSH and Mikado.
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Old 05-05-2017, 04:51 PM   #86 (permalink)
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That's a cool little heli, but they'd probably have to price something like that at $400+ and very, very few would pay it. Any videos of that particular heli flying? I wonder how heavy it ended up and if flight times are super short because of that and the extra power.
Thanks, I don't have any videos since I lack a sport camera I can use while flying. The heli weights 83g all up and spins 125mm blades at 5600 rpm governed, no bog with 12 degrees plus/minus pitch. I use the nano-tech 2S 300mA batts. I fly moderate sport with the timer at 6 minutes leaving cells at 3.7V. I'm not an advanced pilot, only intermediate. Even so I still appreciate collective punch and it has a lot.
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Old 05-05-2017, 05:24 PM   #87 (permalink)
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Most everyone who owns a 230S really likes it.
I just read a long thread about the 130 S at RCG. It has real potential with dual outrunners and a 3S battery. Sounds like a lot of people are not happy with how it flies, goes back to my opinion about Blade's electronics. Though if they can fix the problems with an update, that might restore their reputation. I think that also happened with the 230 didn't it?

I tried doing the dual brushless outrunner thing on a Nano CPX. It just never popped my bubble in terms of performance. I've since parted it out and am currently selling it off. I've finally come to the conclusion that 1S is not worth the effort. For outdoor flight 2S is minimum and 3S ideal.

I would have liked to build my mCPX for 3S, but it always comes down to housing the battery. Anything but a stock configuration requires too many modifications and it can be hard if not impossible to find a battery the right size.

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Old 05-05-2017, 05:47 PM   #88 (permalink)
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I just read a long thread about the 130 S at RCG. It has real potential with dual outrunners and a 3S battery. Sounds like a lot of people are not happy with how it flies, goes back to my opinion about Blade's electronics. Though if they can fix the problems with an update, that might restore their reputation. I think that also happened with the 230 didn't it?
The 230S never really had widespread tail problems, but they did release a few firmware updates for it. The 180CFX had a bad tail kick at first on many helis. Mine had it. They released a firmware fix for it. I put a micro iKON in mine.
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Old 05-06-2017, 08:53 AM   #89 (permalink)
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Good point. Let the entire flight team get one of the models. I think all of them except the 360CFX have some sort of complaint from users. The 230S needs the cable and the calibration method which was implemented after release. Tell your pilots to test all modes not just flip into IU2 and fly the crap out of it. Even the Trio I read some have gear mesh issues. Just make sure they are thoroughly tested by real world pilots for a while to flesh out the bugs.

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The 230S never really had widespread tail problems, but they did release a few firmware updates for it. The 180CFX had a bad tail kick at first on many helis. Mine had it. They released a firmware fix for it. I put a micro iKON in mine.
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Old 05-06-2017, 09:22 AM   #90 (permalink)
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I had my 5th or 6th crash on the 230s a couple of weeks ago in about 20 months of ownership. At least 50 percent of my crashes have been into snow. But this crash is the first one where I saw a frame brake. This was not the normal frame break.

The frame separated in such a way that the complete head, servos, main shaft, main gear and upper frame came apart as one complete piece. It was actually a very gentle crash. I have never failed to hit TH on any of my crashes and the original main gear still looked new. Just a light slop from about 3 feet onto a wet ground.

I lost links as I never bothered to look for them, bent feathering shaft but the frame seperation managed to break a servo ground lead. So a total rebuild with some servo soldering required.

I was going to post this in the 230 forum but I think its better here as Mr Petroto is taking notes. A frame break could be pretty demoralising for a beginner. I am not the type to Blame Blade for heli problems after a crash. I am not the type to call support generally either.

However Mr Petroto, the 230s frame would only need a little love and care in the original design and manufacture to remove the biggest weakness in a heli that is in some ways (I know its all relavative) one of the best helis, for its intention, that you have produced.
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Old 05-06-2017, 09:23 AM   #91 (permalink)
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Good The 230S needs the cable and the calibration method which was implemented after release.
Not all of them. Mine didn't need it and the calibration flight function worked out of the box for me when I played around with it at first. I did do every firmware update since I already had the cable for my 180CFX. None of the updates changed the way my 230S flew, which was a good thing. Turns out it's the same cable to program Spektrum AS3X receivers for their planks, too, so it actually turned out to be money well spent.
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Old 05-06-2017, 09:28 AM   #92 (permalink)
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However Mr Petroto, the 230s frame would only need a little love and care in the original design and manufacture to remove the biggest weakness in a heli that is in some ways (I know its all relavative) one of the best helis you have produced.
I think the 250CFX already has that "love and care" in its frame. It's the logical upgrade (or even replacement) for the 230S and the carbon fiber frame is reported to be darned near indestructible. I've never even seen a 250CFX but, if it flies as well or better than the 230S, they could probably just discontinue the 230S since it's so similar. Frame and motor aside, it's virtually the same heli with slightly longer blades. Same head, tail assembly, electronics, etc.
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Old 05-06-2017, 09:53 AM   #93 (permalink)
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Hey Mike, I thought I read the 250CFX tail blows out for one reason or another?

I have not bothered to follow it much after that.

Has the 230 been dropped in favour of the 250 then?
I read on RC groups the 230 had been discontinued?

The 230 is so light and except for the frame issues fairly durable and easy to repair. I don't mind the plastic frame its just too thin and cheap currently.

I feel like the Blade engineers need direction from us guys.
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Old 05-06-2017, 10:13 AM   #94 (permalink)
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Not all of them. Mine didn't need it and the calibration flight function worked out of the box for me when I played around with it at first. I did do every firmware update since I already had the cable for my 180CFX. None of the updates changed the way my 230S flew, which was a good thing. Turns out it's the same cable to program Spektrum AS3X receivers for their planks, too, so it actually turned out to be money well spent.
I guess I'm talking Spektrum but there is an obvious connection here (excuse pun). I have never bought another FBL that did not come with the cable to progam the FBL.

The Spektrum paradigm seems to be, release FBL with firmware that will require updates but do not provide the cable. Thus forcing customers to buy the proprietary and expensive cable.

Sometimes I wonder why so called intelligent men like ourselves continue to buy their products once we have had the experience to know better.

The only point of the above post is that they might eventually listen. This is just our hobby and kind of like a bad government we don't depend on them to live.

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Old 05-06-2017, 08:29 PM   #95 (permalink)
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Hey Mike, I thought I read the 250CFX tail blows out for one reason or another?

I have not bothered to follow it much after that.
I haven't been following it lately, either, but I don't remember any widespread reports about it. Seems like pretty much all pf the posts I've recently run across about the 250CFX have been very positive.

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Has the 230 been dropped in favour of the 250 then?
I read on RC groups the 230 had been discontinued?
I don't think it's been discontinued. The only recent discontinuation I know of is the two blade original 180CFX.

Quote:
The 230 is so light and except for the frame issues fairly durable and easy to repair. I don't mind the plastic frame its just too thin and cheap currently.

I feel like the Blade engineers need direction from us guys.
Oh, they know EXACTLY what they're doing. They guaranteed themselves many, many more 230S frame sales by re-designing the area of the frame where the front of the skids attach. The 230S frame is like 98% the same as the old Blade SR frame, which had a reinforcing plastic frame strut molded in on each side to prevent those frame arms from breaking very easily, which they absolutely do on the 230S frame because they were removed for absolutely ZERO reason.
Notice those little extra plastic frame struts right in the key area in the Blade SR frame below? Yeah, now they're quite suspiciously missing on the 230S frame. Thanks, Blade.
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Old 05-07-2017, 04:19 AM   #96 (permalink)
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Mike,

I would hope they were aware of the removal of those supports. For sure they must have compared the 230s design to the original SR.
But I am not convinced they did it with intention to increase sales. They may well have thought it was an improvement. Engineers do make mistakes. Maybe the final design was not peer reviewed. Maybe the creme de la creme of engineering trades, the tool maker messed up.

But your point has made me think. Probably the cost of retooling the molds to rectify these type of problems is not worth it to Blade/Horizon. So perhaps myself and others asking for resolutions to problems like a cheap plastic frame is unrealistic. It ain't going to happen because they don't intend keeping the models around long enough to be worth fixing.

The 230s is a really nice little heli if you don't ever crash it. And realistically it needs a very lite frame to function as it does.

I now think Steve Spetrotto's ( I got it right this time ) question was purely with regard to new helis from Blade. They will produce firmware updates to existing models but when it comes to correcting part manufacturing issues maybe that is out of the question.

I wonder if this gets just as frustrating for the heli engineers. Blade obviously have some fairly talented guys working for them.

Anyway, it is what it is. Blade do some good stuff. Regardless of what some people think of the Safe technology and rescue, these little AR636 type controllers in these type of helis are a great thing for getting beginners started in CP. There is no fly bar head to set up after a crash and they don't have to understand an FBL system either.

Sorry, thats a bit long winded I know.
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Old 05-07-2017, 07:05 AM   #97 (permalink)
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Changing material generally doesn't require re-tooling.
Just adjustments to process parameters.

How about a material that CA will stick to so we can repair things?
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Old 05-07-2017, 07:37 AM   #98 (permalink)
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Maria,

Is it OK if I call you that.
Sorry I know my humour is shit. Can't help it.

Thats an interesting point. So theoretically they could use the same molds with a different material to improve part strength and quality?

Are you a Toolmaker?
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Old 05-07-2017, 02:48 PM   #99 (permalink)
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Maria,

Is it OK if I call you that.
Sorry I know my humour is shit. Can't help it.

Thats an interesting point. So theoretically they could use the same molds with a different material to improve part strength and quality?

Are you a Toolmaker?
Many call me MF (and other such abbreviations)

I worked as a maintenance tech on plastic injection molding machines in a previous life. I know we had 2 molds that we ran with 3 different materials (cheap to more expensive). All we had to do was adjust temperature, cooling rates and injection speeds.

That was around 25 years ago, so maybe things have changed.
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Old 06-23-2017, 10:00 AM   #100 (permalink)
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Hey Guys,

Much apologies for not getting back to you all sooner. We have been taking notes behind he scenes.

Its our mission to make you guys happy and better yet, get more people back into the heli hobby.

The team and I greatly appreciate your feedback.

Here are a couple questions:

Is SAFE not a selling factor to you guys? Do you feel that it helps bring more people into the helis?

It seems like we have the right mix of products in our line up. You guys are all seemingly agreeing that we need to just update our current line. In other words, improve what you have and don't make additional platforms unless they are ground breaking.

What is the most popular size in your opinion? ( I know, based on sales) but curious to see what you guys think.

What sort of things should we be innovating? Plastics, electronics? Geometry? Etc...


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