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View Poll Results: What power system do you prefer for a 700 size electric?
BEC 37 26.43%
BEC + UPS Backup 41 29.29%
RX Pack 49 35.00%
RX Pack + UPS Backup 12 8.57%
Other 4 2.86%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 140. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 01-10-2017, 07:32 AM   #21 (permalink)
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So from a weight standpoint. My 2S lipo is 116 grams.

With a BEC type ESC would probably weigh more than my Castle 120 ICE2

I most likely would not notice the difference in flight.

Maybe yes, maybe no

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Old 01-10-2017, 07:36 AM   #22 (permalink)
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My BEC is 40g, my backup 16g. Go figure.
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Old 01-10-2017, 07:56 AM   #23 (permalink)
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Kontronik ESC with integrated BEC and buffer pack. Extremely reliable and neat and clean wiring.
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Old 01-10-2017, 08:02 AM   #24 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thoemse View Post
If it only needs to switch on once it has paid itself many times.
One actually in an indirect way caused my mates Goblin 630 to be wrecked. He had a (quite light) crash and the Rx pack was thrown out on initial impact. Normally that would have killed all power but he had an ultra-Guard fitted which kept the Rx powered and the heli thrashed itself to death (a full re-kit)

Of course if he'd have hit throttle hold he'd have saved it but he froze.
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Old 01-10-2017, 08:21 AM   #25 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grumpy_Old_Man View Post
One actually in an indirect way caused my mates Goblin 630 to be wrecked. He had a (quite light) crash and the Rx pack was thrown out on initial impact. Normally that would have killed all power but he had an ultra-Guard fitted which kept the Rx powered and the heli thrashed itself to death (a full re-kit)

Of course if he'd have hit throttle hold he'd have saved it but he froze.
Hehe you can have the same discussion with rescue. I had my heli wrecked by rescue. If used right it would be good though. Crashing made me the master of throttle hold though.
I can't fly well at all but damn am I good with throttle hold!
I got the crashperience!
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Old 01-10-2017, 08:28 AM   #26 (permalink)
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I run a Castle BEC Pro on my 700 but it's only wired to run on one of the 6s 5000 flight packs.
Not sure I trust any BEC enough to run it on 12s. I'm no electrician, but it just seems like a lot of voltage reduction.
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Old 01-10-2017, 08:31 AM   #27 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BadVad View Post
I run a Castle BEC Pro on my 700 but it's only wired to run on one of the 6s 5000 flight packs.
Not sure I trust any BEC enough to run it on 12s. I'm no electrician, but it just seems like a lot of voltage reduction.
All align combos come with one. It is the Hobbywing 130A V4 ESC and there have been no negative reports about that one.
I would say that BEC is solid. I still went for the Ultraguard because it is cheap and very light. It wouldn't be needed most likely though.
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Old 01-10-2017, 09:41 AM   #28 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grumpy_Old_Man View Post
The option for ESC with internal BEC seems to be missing? That's what I run most of my big helis on. (Hobbywing ESC's or Align rebranded version)
Point taken, but that is a BEC as far as the function goes. It for sure is a different setup, but mostly I'm looking to differentiate between power from the flight pack and power from a separate power source, as well as who feels the need to back them up.

Thanks for your input!
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Old 01-10-2017, 10:50 AM   #29 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ace Dude View Post
Kontronik ESC with integrated BEC and buffer pack. Extremely reliable and neat and clean wiring.
+1 - basically BEC from main power source plus buffer pack

On your question about need to back up, I feel it's an absolute. One needs to ensure maximum possibility of control and ability to remove power to main blades on demand. Without a backup source for RX, FBL and servos that is not possible. Buffer packs are the simplest way to do that with maximum likelihood of being there in the event of most failures. Largest machine I fly without buffer pack is 450 as in 325mm blades.
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Old 01-10-2017, 11:12 AM   #30 (permalink)
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My first 600 (Compass 6hvu) had a 2s rx pack. I loved that because I could safely power up everything but the motor for setup and inspection. The charge lasted for the few flights I would do. It was dirt cheap and weight adding was negligible. I liked this route.

My second 600 (Logo 600sx) I went all out and had a Kontronic 80hv pro on it and used that internal bec. It worked great, had clean and easy wiring, but was expensive.

One day when I build a 700, I'll probably go back to a cheaper opto esc and rx pack or get a new hobbywing with bec. Money will be the deciding factor.

I don't typically run backups.
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Old 01-10-2017, 11:20 AM   #31 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bredler View Post
Point taken, but that is a BEC as far as the function goes.
Ok, I voted 'BEC' on that basis!
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Old 01-10-2017, 11:24 AM   #32 (permalink)
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Kontronik internal BEC and Optiguard backup on my 700's.
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Old 01-10-2017, 11:27 AM   #33 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Relisys190 View Post
So from a weight standpoint. My 2S lipo is 116 grams.

With a BEC type ESC would probably weigh more than my Castle 120 ICE2

I most likely would not notice the difference in flight.

Maybe yes, maybe no
Markus

The Hobbywing 130A with BEC is (based on published data) about 20g heavier than the Castle edge 120, but that includes the ESC to Rx wiring harness which you would have to add to the Rx pack. So to all intents and purposes you save the full weight of the Rx pack (116g in this case).

If you would notice that in flight is debatable, but it's a non-trivial weight saving.
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Old 01-10-2017, 11:45 AM   #34 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grumpy_Old_Man View Post
Markus

The Hobbywing 130A with BEC is (based on published data) about 20g heavier than the Castle edge 120, but that includes the ESC to Rx wiring harness which you would have to add to the Rx pack. So to all intents and purposes you save the full weight of the Rx pack (116g in this case).

If you would notice that in flight is debatable, but it's a non-trivial weight saving.
Yeah, that's true. You don't shave 100 lbs off a race car by removing 100 lbs from one thing; more like 1/4 lb from 400 things. You see the same thing with ultralight backpacking. Cutting down a Toothbrush handle, using a 1 oz smaller fuel bottle, using an old gatorade bottle instead of a nalgene, etc can seem like a fool's errand until you make a pile of stuff that you cut out and it's like 2 lb. Similarly, I'm building a 3.4 meter RC sailplane, and glue/epoxy weight can seriously add up if you're not careful...the weight game in aircraft building is a tricky one for sure.

But back to the point of the RX pack weight savings, if you haven't taken care to save weight at lots of different points, then the extra 116g (4 oz) is kind of just pouring gas on the fire. Definitely non-trivial at 1/4 lb.

I am slowly acquiring electronics for an X7, and I'm thinking I will go with a Jeti 135. Unclear as to whether it will be opto or BEC. It's quite a lightweight and powerful piece of kit either way, so the BEC is looking pretty attractive.
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Old 01-10-2017, 12:06 PM   #35 (permalink)
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I assume "BEC" means built in BEC and not external right?
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Old 01-10-2017, 12:12 PM   #36 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slyster View Post
I assume "BEC" means built in BEC and not external right?
I'm not making that assumption. A RX pack is always an external power source, so an external BEC should count too.
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Old 01-10-2017, 12:21 PM   #37 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slyster View Post
I assume "BEC" means built in BEC and not external right?
Nah, a BEC is a BEC as far as where the juice is coming from is concerned. Whether you've put it on a board in your ESC or on a board in a separate housing doesn't matter for the poll. If you use internal, and/or want to elaborate on your setup with a post, please do!
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Old 01-10-2017, 12:28 PM   #38 (permalink)
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Would you guys say the likelihood of a bec or main pack failure is higher than the bec being overloaded and frying the electronics?

Working on a non-heli setup and cannot fit an R2 buffer unit. It gets obnoxiously expensive to have both the bec guard and optiguard.
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Old 01-10-2017, 12:32 PM   #39 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve_JR View Post
Would you guys say the likelihood of a bec or main pack failure is higher than the bec being overloaded and frying the electronics?

Working on a non-heli setup and cannot fit an R2 buffer unit. It gets obnoxiously expensive to have both the bec guard and optiguard.
Perfect Regulators ProGuard +. It combines the functions of an Ultraguard and BEC Guard and it's only a little more expensive than an Ultraguard. It is BYOB, but batteries in that cell count and capacity are dirt cheap.
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Old 01-10-2017, 12:45 PM   #40 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Steve_JR View Post
Would you guys say the likelihood of a bec or main pack failure is higher than the bec being overloaded and frying the electronics?

Working on a non-heli setup and cannot fit an R2 buffer unit. It gets obnoxiously expensive to have both the bec guard and optiguard.
Not only does it get expensive, but you also significantly increase your number of points of failure.

Sure, lots of folks complain about the initial purchase price of Kontronik, but when you add the cost of an external BEC and any other gizmos deemed necessary I'm not sure you're saving anything and now you have additional wiring and significantly more points of failure.

I never thought I'd own a Kontronik either, but after researching the alternatives and considering the total cost of ownership (TCO), wiring simplicity, reliability, quality of the internal governor, and ease of use, it was a no brainer and my Kontronik ESCs have never let me down.
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