Soft start ain't so soft....

[Mystic3D]

Originally Posted by joe1l

I only use a 5v Nicd pack to program the HV ESC, YGE only specifies 5v in the documentation, i've never seen 6.5v recommended.

Yea I fried a Program Card II with 7.4V, by mistake.

[zeeflyboy]

Originally Posted by joe1l

I only use a 5v Nicd pack to program the HV ESC, YGE only specifies 5v in the documentation, i've never seen 6.5v recommended.

http://elektrorc.com/article_info.ph...0878bfe851a82b

"the Prog Card operates on 4 to 6.5V - we do not recommend operation outside this range."

[WayFastWilly]

Heres what I think you have to do, maybe this is wrong? it seemed to soften my initial start...

with the dx8 - set throttle travel to 101% on low and high endpoints.
calibrate with prog.card your stop and then full power. then go back and reset your travel to 100%.

this way throttle stop would be just 1 tic above stick lowest position and full throttle would be 1 tick before stick full up position..

does that seem right?

"The speed controller has a fixed throttle curve setting, so
that with all usual transmitters the stop and full power
points are linearly connected. With all programmable
transmitters, the throttle range should be set to default
(±100%), the center point set to zero and throttle trim
enabled. Nevertheless, with some transmitter types the
range needs to be adjusted. For that the throttle
endpoints have to be set so that one notch before lowest
stick position the motor is stopped and that one notch
before full power the motor is actually at full power. Full
power is indicated by the LED that is completely turned

off."

[Steve Evans]

Soft start on the YGE only works properly when fed with analog servo timing. If your SK720, or whatever, is set for a digital throttle servo the startup will be much quicker. Try both and the difference will be clear. With a digital servo setting the startup is slightly soft, but not as much as with analog.

Steve

[MikeOscar]

Originally Posted by Steve Evans

Soft start on the YGE only works properly when fed with analog servo timing. If your SK720, or whatever, is set for a digital throttle servo the startup will be much quicker. Try both and the difference will be clear. With a digital servo setting the startup is slightly soft, but not as much as with analog.

Steve

Apologies for this epic thread bump.
Since no one had replied to this thread since this post, I just wanted to share this solution worked perfectly to solve my soft start problems, which were identical to the ones described in this thread. Changing to analog servo in my Spartan finally gave me a true soft start, after struggling for a couple of months to solve this issue.

[zeeflyboy]

Interesting - I never solved the problem... I don't seem to have any option as regards digital/analog for the ESC on the controller either.

It's now in a different heli with different motor and very low headspeed gearing (only about 1350rpm at full speed) and it's STILL not particularly soft lol...

I'm tempted to get rid of it entirely, which is a shame because other than the start issue it's a good ESC.

[Steve Evans]

Originally Posted by MikeOscar

Apologies for this epic thread bump.
Since no one had replied to this thread since this post, I just wanted to share this solution worked perfectly to solve my soft start problems, which were identical to the ones described in this thread. Changing to analog servo in my Spartan finally gave me a true soft start, after struggling for a couple of months to solve this issue.

Are you using gov store? I see that the Vortex has a gov, but that electric is to be supported in a future release. Have you tried the existing gov?

Steve

[MikeOscar]

I'm currently running internal YGE governor using gov store. I'm very happy with this combination, but because the YGE lacks an autorotation bailout function I plan on switching to the external Spartan governor once it becomes available. In preparation for this switch I"d already wired my throttle signal to the ESC via the FBL controller, which lead to the soft start problem.

[Groundzero]

I have the 160 YGE on my 700E and also had ALL of the exact problems with soft start. I purchased the new program card III and have only used a 4.8V to program it. NOTHING I have done calms it down. It is dangerous to say the least. It will destroy a set of blades in an instant. I have learned to live with it, but I keep my finger tightly on the throttle hold button until I back away. I can finess the throttle and have it jump only very very slightly. I use it with the microbeast and I have tried all forms of programming and settings. I use a Futaba 10 channel and have tried the 9303 with the same results. I have lived with it for a year but would really like the option of a soft start like I have on all my other heli's. I really like the controller. It stays cool and doesn't have the arc weld spark like a Castle. It has no spark at all but with this setup it is just waiting for the opportunity to jump up and bite you hard.

[Groundzero]

I had the same huge kick at startup. I wanted to use the gov store but was hesitant to run it up to the full 100%. I found the problem in my case was setting up the endpoints in the Futaba 10C. Online it suggested 99% and 1%. It really kicked hard when I calibrated the radio to the esc using those settings. I thought about it and my radio sets my high endpoint to 100 and my low point to 100 so I used 99 and 99 and that did the trick. It does still have a very very slight kick at startup but not the mule kick I had before. With my 700 the tail would go about 30 degrees to the right and because of the way that the tail fin sits on the ground it would dig in and the gyro would really put the pitch in to try to get it back to the neutral position so much so that the first time I tried to run it up it broke the link to the blade but luckily did no damage. It sounded like the main blades were really at high pitch but what it really was I figured was the tail blades increasing pitch to try to get back to the neutral position. Another factor was the trim. I tried it with the trim in the center position and also with the trim set to the lowest position. It calibrated with the trim in the center but I had to lower it so that it would stop the motor. I love the YGE because I have the capacitors added where I do not get any spark when I plug it in and also have a huge heat sink so it runs very cool. It is incredibly smooth in the governor store mode. I did take off both the main and tail blades when going to 100% and it turned out to be no big deal. I have a healthy respect for what that motor can do. I hope this helps, it really calmed mine down. I may even try a higher spool up speed so that I feel comfortable with autos.

[ilyxa]

Had the same issue: huge kick at initial spool-up. Solution for me: correctly set PWM freq. My motor is TT OBL 50/05 630kV, default PWM is 8khz, mine is 14khz. Work like a charm No kick at all, great.

[zeeflyboy]

I tried all sorts of pwm settings (and a lot more besides) - in the end the solution for me was a Kontronik Jive 80HV lol. Smooth as silk start up now!

[ilyxa]

Originally Posted by zeeflyboy

I tried all sorts of pwm settings (and a lot more besides) - in the end the solution for me was a Kontronik Jive 80HV lol. Smooth as silk start up now!

this will be plan B

[KevinB]

Hello.

Yes, if you have a ProgCard II, you shouldn't use it if the Rx voltage is over 6V. That one stumped me a few times in the past as well. I bought a Progcard III which I use at 8.2V with no issues.

As for the soft start issue, this is what has worked for me. ( using a VControl and the Vbar gov. I think it would apply for any other external gov as well )

The start up speed in the YGE is set to Plane-middle ( since the external governor is controlling the motor including the startup ) If your external governor doesn't have a bail-out setting, you could probably leave this at the heli setting. The YGE instructions for use with the Vbar gov say Plane-middle, so that's what I use. If the Skookum instructions are different, follow those. Perhaps if you are unsure about your ext gov setup, leaving it at Heli-middle would be safer to start with? Or move the motor pinion away from the main gear until you know the start is soft......so you don't shred a main gear.
I also set the following: Brake-off, Gov-off, Freewheel-on.

Next I set the throttle endpoints on the radio/ext. gov to 90 low and 100 high. Then with the Progcard, set the low and high endpoints on the YGE. Last, set the low throttle endpoint in the radio/ext. gov to 100.

You can play with where the low radio endpoint is while setting the YGE's low endpoint. If you take it too low (ie: 80), there will be a delay between switching out of Hold and when the motor actually starts up.

If I just set the YGE endpoints with the throttle at 100/100, I can't stop the blades from folding on startup.

Hopefully this solves your problem. Sorry if I'm repeating something already suggested.

EDIT: Oh........I guess I should have kept reading one more page before posting. You switched ESCs.


KevinB

[Smoggie]

I'm having the same issues. I've tried different timings and PWM (Kontronic Pyro motor in Kasama Dune). It's set to Heli-slow, and 2% start up power. I'm using the internal governor in Gov-Store mode, flat throttle curves on all flight modes, governor works fine in flight.
But I still get a kick as the motor initially powers up, enough to 'ding' the back of the blades when i originally set it to heli-middle, heli slow is better but the initial kick is still there. Once the kick is over the run up to full RPM very progressive (too slow if anything). Throttle calibrated was done using the manual stick method.

Any ideas?

[dgunawan]

I made a comparison video of my Fusion 50 spooling up with 2 different values of an ESC parameter, startup speed.

Fusion 50 Spool Up Comparisons (0 min 18 sec)

In a video earlier in the thread showed another heli spooling much slower, which is more desirable. With my setup now, heli slow, at least it doesn't kick or fold the blades. But I'm sure it could've been better.

If you watch the video on YouTube site, I've listed my electronic setup.

[Smoggie]

Originally Posted by Grumpy_Old_Man

I'm having the same issues. I've tried different timings and PWM (Kontronic Pyro motor in Kasama Dune). It's set to Heli-slow, and 2% start up power. I'm using the internal governor in Gov-Store mode, flat throttle curves on all flight modes, governor works fine in flight.
But I still get a kick as the motor initially powers up, enough to 'ding' the back of the blades when i originally set it to heli-middle, heli slow is better but the initial kick is still there. Once the kick is over the run up to full RPM very progressive (too slow if anything). Throttle calibrated was done using the manual stick method.

Any ideas?

Bumping my old question.

I'm still having this issue with a YGE 90HV. The initial 'kick' as the motor engages is enough to ding the back of the blades against the grips, even with the blades very tight.

I've tried everything zeeflyboy talked about and like him, it's all failed to solve the problem. I'd put it down as just a fundamental issue with this model of ESC but strangely some others have no problem at all, and my other different rated YGE ESC's are fine.