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Hurricane 550 Discussion and support of the Gaui Hurricane 550


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Old 12-16-2008, 04:02 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default New Hurricane Frame Design

Hi Guys

I have been working on this design on and off for a few months now and have decided to push it forward again, and I would really like your feedback on it.

If I get enough interest then I would consider making a few sets for other people.

I have designed a new one piece frame with direct to swash servo mounts that will accept full size servo's.



I don't take credit for any great new ideas I merely combined some of my favorite design aspects from a couple of other Hurricane frames that I liked for example direct to swash servo mounting idea from the CHP frames although modified to accept full size servo's and the one piece frame idea from the Hurricane 425. The servo's shown in th epictures are the exact dimensions of a Spektrum DS821.

I have currently built a full size prototype using acrylic instead of Carbon for trial purposes and found that the battery mounting position was slightly wrong and I could not fit the canopy properly, so the pictures attached show the revised battery position.
I will have another revised frame set cut in acrylic soon and depending on the results I have just enough 2mm carbon sheet to have a final set cut in carbon.
I will post some pictures of the 1st acrylic prototype later this evening
The Arced lines shown around the frame represent the outline of the canopy when installed. Also shown on the Heli are a pair 4100 3sell Lipos one on top of the other. These are the largest pack that I fly with so if these fit then almost any battery configuration should fit.

I have designed the frame set to be a straight swap for the standard carbon framed hurry using all the std hardware like bearing mounts etc.

Some of the components shown in the attached pictures are in Red some are Blue some are in Grey and some White. The components in RED are optional and represent std items that I have redesigned.

Items shown in Grey are std hurry components such as the top main shaft bearing block

The motor mount is shown in RED as I have modified it to accept a frame stiffener to be bolted to the back of it. Not dissimilar to Marco's STIFFY.

The lower main bearing block is shown in red as I have modified it to accept a full size main shaft bearing for the OWB shaft. the lower OWB shaft bearing block has also been designed for a full size main shaft bearing. This idea is yet to be proven as i am not sure there is enough space to allow for the thicker bearings. I have yet to assemble the OWB shaft and take any measurements.

I have further stiffened the drive line with two more frame stiffeners to try and eliminate any potential frame flex that could alter the mesh of the gears that mate with the main gear. Each frame stiffener should ideally have its own shape but to reduce the number of different parts I have reused the same component.

Also any component shown in RED could be used on a STD carbon framed Hurricane

I have shown the STD swash anti rotation bracket as this will be required on this frame.

Components shown in Blue are all new and are required when you use this frame e.g. the 120 degree servo mounts and the Frame spacers

The frame has been designed around and is shown with the Raptor / Trex600 landing skids but as we all know the Std hurry skids will bolt up with very minor mods.

So guys please let me know your thoughts.

Many thanks

Ben
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Last edited by Borneoben; 12-20-2008 at 06:53 PM..
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Old 12-16-2008, 05:24 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Very creative Ben, good work. Just a few of things that hit me ....
* That's a lot of battery hanging that far out front - are you sure that it will not muck up the balance ??
* The only down side of a single piece frame is obviously that you cannot have any "sacrificial" bits - might it not be better to have a two-piece frame with cheap and easy to replace lower sections.
* How much more powerfull does a servo have to be to be direct to swash rather than push / pull ?

Obviously a lot of thought gone into it though.

Mike.
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Old 12-16-2008, 06:38 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Hey Mike

Thanks for your comments, constructive critisism is what this is all about!!

The battery shown in the drawings is a 6cell lipo same as i currently fly with, admittedly its a bit on the large side at 4100mah but i manage to get it to balance and fly fine. Some people mount their Lipos in Hurricnaes with standard plastic and carbon frames this way with both packs on the top.
My thinking behind designing it this way from the start is it helps keep the weight higher up in the frame to help make rolls more axial. Also some people are starting to use 6 cell packs as opposed to 2x3cell packs for the convenience.

The battery is also shown in a forward position and can be moved back up the battery mount closer to the motor with no problems. The battery mount itself is also adjustable for and aft so there should be n problem figuring out the best positon for correct CoG

I hear what you say about not having any sacrificial parts to the frame but i was aiming for lightness with this one. The Hurricane 425 and CHP frames didnt have a lower sacrificial frame. However I would highly recommend that you use plastic bolts or tie wraps to mount the landing gear.

To be honest i have no idea how much more powerfull the servos would need to be in a direct to swash system. I doubt weather they see much more load than the normal hurricane system due to the fact that none of the levers reduce the throw of the servo increasing the mechanical advantage. Also the CHP fram flew just great from all accounts with the smaller 9650 servos. The big dissadantage of the direct to swash system is the un balanced load seen by the servo when in comparison to a push pull system which will balance the load on the servo output spline. PLus the push pull helps to eliminate slop in the control system.
The advantage of direct to swash is initial set up and simplicity plus lower parts count and less weight. plus it moves the weight of the servo's higher up in the heli helping with the axial rolls.

The pictures of the prototype frame with canopy and battery show that the adjustment n the battery mounting tray.
This is the first prototype and you can see that on the drawings in the first post the battery is much higher up and it interfers with the canopy.
Oh and the prototype frame dosent have the Servo mounts on it yet either as I am still waiting for them to be machined.

Thanks for the interest

Ben
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Old 12-16-2008, 06:49 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Wow - that looks really good - nice one

The question about teh push / pull was exactly as I said - just don't know, as well as the load being one sided, presumably the aamount of force needed will depend on flying style, length of servo arms, size of blades etc..

Looking good though

Mik.
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Old 12-16-2008, 07:25 AM   #5 (permalink)
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looks GREAT Ben.... maybe I could send you some Walmart cutting boards to hvae the frames made


seriously though.. let me know when you get a final design on how much a set of frames would cost...

I do have one question though.. where is the gyro mount?
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Old 12-16-2008, 07:27 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Nice job Ben!
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Old 12-16-2008, 07:31 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Hey mystic will be a while till i can offer anyone anything for sale!!

The gyro will be mounted in the standard position i just havent got a plate installed yet
Alternativleyit is possible to mount the gyro in the frame in the tail servo locationas long as you have a bom mounted tail servo.

Wal Mart???? it will be Carbon all the way for this Baby!!
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Old 12-16-2008, 08:12 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Hey Wazzer, will it be ready to fly this Saturday?
I am really interested to watch it
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Old 12-16-2008, 12:58 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Way cool wazzer.. Looking forward to seeing more progress.. Keep us updated.

The plexi/plastic mock up makes me want to fly a glass version.
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Old 12-16-2008, 04:52 PM   #10 (permalink)
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I like the clear frames. Wonder Woman would be proud.
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Old 12-16-2008, 05:09 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Ben
It looks great. My first though was that there was not enough room for the lower battery than I saw how you stacked your batteries.
Do you have a picture of the canopy on with the stacked batteries?

Good work
Mark
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Old 12-16-2008, 07:52 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Ben...

Looks good.....but man, you should be flying....unless you are doing this "At work"...then it's OK.....

Will be interested in watching your progress...

Mike D
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Old 12-16-2008, 10:45 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hurry_can View Post
Hey Wazzer, will it be ready to fly this Saturday?
I am really interested to watch it
Haha Would love to mate but unfortunately its still missing a few items!!!

It will definitely get flown just not sure when need a few more coffers in the heli budget for a new RX ESC compete HEAD etc!!
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Old 12-16-2008, 10:51 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Markeydoo View Post
Ben
It looks great. My first though was that there was not enough room for the lower battery than I saw how you stacked your batteries.
Do you have a picture of the canopy on with the stacked batteries?

Good work
Mark
Hey Mark

As mentioned in previously i manage to get the angle of the battery mounting tray wrong with the prototype frames in the pictures and the battery's wont fit under the standard plastic canopy. The drawings show the new battery location which is a little more forward and angled down.

In the side view you can see the rough outline of the canopy and it should give plenty of room inside for almost any 6cell battery combination and maybe even A123.

If someone can post some dimensions of the A123 cells I can draw them up and see how they would fit. That would be really quick and easy to do.

I am hoping to get the servo mounts machined very soon and a new set of acrylic frames cut with the revised battery mount position so i can reassemble and test with canopy on.

I am very tempted to test fly the heli with the Acrylic frames as when bolted up with all the spacers etc its surprisingly stiff!! i would be too worried about the landing gear mounting tabs though as they wouldnt take much of a knock to break.

Thanks for the interest guys

Ben
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Old 12-16-2008, 11:23 PM   #15 (permalink)
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zip tie the gear on and land it real gentle....well... you should be landing soft anyways... are you trying to say you're one of those guys that slams the heli down to land it??
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Old 12-17-2008, 12:44 PM   #16 (permalink)
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everybody knows that wazzer still uses the training gear!!! hahaha i can send insults all the way from belfast, n.ireland... hahahaha

seriously tho how the heck did you put that together? i wouldn't have thought someone with sun-baked jungle-kissed grey matter could put something so sophisticated together, and with cad (??) illustrations as well! the only question i have is because the lack of the wider lower frame halves, would there still be enough room to comfortably place the rx/wires? i really like that you can put a 6s or 2x 3s on top and there's a plate on the bottom which seems perfect for the esc! good job waaahzer
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Old 12-17-2008, 01:20 PM   #17 (permalink)
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I want Ben to send me the clear frame to fly
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Old 12-17-2008, 01:41 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Hi everybody,

First of all : the A123 dimensions (2300mA/H) : 27mm diam., 66mm long

Then : here are some pictures of my new frame, home made !

I designed it in order to put my 8S A123 pack.

The upper part of the frame is the Gaui CF frame, the lower part is made of bended 5086 aluminum alloy, 1.6mm thick.
It is a bit wider than the Gaui CF frame, so my A123 pack fit perfectly in it !
Unfortunately, my charger can't charge 8S (Hyperion 610i Duo), so I had to put wires to charge it as 2 x 4S pack.

This material will be far more crash proof compare to the CF ! In deed, it is very easy to bend, so it won't break during the crash.
The weight of the overall is similar to the CF frame.
I still need to paint it and to put all the wires correctly, but I couldn't wait for that, I wanted to try it first !

The balance of my heli is better, and my A123 pack will not move anymore during a flight !

I am waiting for your comments !

Sonny.
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Last edited by Sonn113; 12-17-2008 at 04:42 PM..
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Old 12-17-2008, 05:18 PM   #19 (permalink)
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It looks like you power your heli with two sticks of dynamite.
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Old 12-17-2008, 09:33 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobbybe View Post
everybody knows that wazzer still uses the training gear!!! hahaha i can send insults all the way from belfast, n.ireland... hahahaha

seriously tho how the heck did you put that together? i wouldn't have thought someone with sun-baked jungle-kissed grey matter could put something so sophisticated together, and with cad (??) illustrations as well! the only question i have is because the lack of the wider lower frame halves, would there still be enough room to comfortably place the rx/wires? i really like that you can put a 6s or 2x 3s on top and there's a plate on the bottom which seems perfect for the esc! good job waaahzer
Well the sun doesn't fry the Grey matter when you're sat in an air conditioned office all day!! Its JB's brain that gets fried on site.

I use a combination of AutoCAD and SketchUp for these drawings. I cant highly recommend SketchUp enough its a great program for 3D drawing and its free to download. I use the pro version for work and use the extra features allot.

Yes the lower frames are just wide enough for small RX like the AR6200 but an AR7000 will have to be mounted on its side inbetween the frames.

Yes the plate below the batteries is designed for the ESC, the space above it is meant for the BEC and or Datalogger I also presumed that people would mount some of the electronics on the outside of the frames. The frame is the same width as the CHP frame as its predetermined by the bearing blocks and motor mount boom clamps etc. I did think of machining all new bearing blocks and desiging and new better motor mount (something that makes adjusting gear meash easier!!) to widen the frames a little but that kinda defeats the idea a bit as i wanted to use as many of the standard Gaui parts as poss.

I have a new motor mount design that is a direct replacment for the Std Gaui one and it should work on all Gaui and aftermarket frames. Pictures to follow

Cheers All
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