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Old 01-10-2009, 09:52 AM   #201 (permalink)
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You can’t expect a 2S to have the same power as a 3S pack, as you have 1/3 rd less energy to play with. You either use it up quicker, or accept a slower headspeed.

Tim.[/quote]

Which makes me wonder why they didn't design the v2 around a 3s system. Flying on 2s either has a lack of power or a severe lack of flying time with the upgrade motor. I was stunned when flying the T-rex 250 as it had a lot more power sustained for 4:30 seconds of flight.

Here's my personal videos and findings for the gaui 200, although it is a v1 the stock power systems are exactly the same.

First I'll start with a complete stock video, The low power system keeps me on my toes throughout the whole fight. Their is enough power to do what they say 3d however I'd say it's just enough to get by ? This stock setup wasn't much fun to fly, took a lot of collective management because the motor just dind't want to pull through like I wanted it to. Can anybody tell if the headspeed sounds close to Finless' videos by any chance ?

Hurricane 200 practice (2 min 14 sec)


and just for comparison heres a video of the 200 on the 5150 motor , headspeed was a lot more consistent through the flight even through high power demand situations. The only downside I had with this motor is the short flights of 2:30 - 3:00 before my batteries was getting very hot.

Gaui 200 practice 200 (2 min 30 sec)


Conclusion , I do think the stock power systems is underpowered and can use some definete beefing up if they want to stay in the competition with Aligns 250 imo.
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Old 01-10-2009, 10:56 AM   #202 (permalink)
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Jujiro..... Your stock setup is pretty much the same as mine! Thanks for those vids. You pretty much showed and said the same things I did. Flys good but could use a little more power.

Tim, you are correct about the 2S, pinion, etc... What got this going was I flew mine as it came out of the box. I didn't get another pinion in my box. Thats is what I call stock or out of the box. I commented that I would like a little more power and got jumped on that I have something wrong because I should get a lot more power STOCK, and out came all these vids showing a lot more head speed.
I was beginning to believe I did have some problem! Like maybe my motor, ESC or batts may not have been working like others do. Now that I am seeing others share vids of their stock setups, I am seeing I do not have a problem.

Thanks!

Bob
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Old 01-10-2009, 11:01 AM   #203 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Finless View Post
I just got word that Kyle's vid was using gaui batteries. If that is true what about the rest? Pinion, motor, ESC, etc?


Bob
That would make sense as Ray has long said the Gaui batterys perform better than the rest.
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Old 01-10-2009, 01:26 PM   #204 (permalink)
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Then there must be different levels of Gaui battery. The ones I got were absolutely horrible.

At any rate, I'd wager well over 90% of people who buy the 200, would be better served by a 3S setup. When I ran the stock 200V1 on 3S, it had AMPLE power (at like 70% throttle) to carry the extra weight. It felt more solid in the wind, and it did crazy pitch pumps and tic tocs.

Bob, if you are still interested, try 3s with a lower throttle curve. It'll cure the mush, and still be "stock" Be careful with the woodies though, I blew up the 250 using the Gaui woodies, and the 200 on 3s can spin way faster than the 250.
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Old 01-10-2009, 01:56 PM   #205 (permalink)
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by unklebuck View Post
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BTj51fibd0A

videos don't lie. you said the motor needs more power. YOU are the one who is being defensive. i'm not going to tell you jack, because apparently, you know everything. this video is a stock 200. whether the pilot is a pro or not is irrelevant. just watch the lack of power on this video and tell me who is BSing

and then watch this video. cheers
http://www.vimeo.com/2781681
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Old 01-10-2009, 02:07 PM   #206 (permalink)
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What are the RPM's reading?

In RC Heli Magazine's review they had the following RPM's logged with an Eagle Tree, this is with a stock Gaui 4800Kv motor on a V1, using a Dynam Battery, I dont know what the difference between that batt and the stock Gaui batt is tho.

normal 3260
Idle1 3400
idle 2 3800

(using +-9deg)
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Old 01-10-2009, 02:20 PM   #207 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unklebuck View Post
and then watch this video. cheers
http://www.vimeo.com/2781681
There seems to be a lot of claims that a particular heli was set up "stock," and that Bob's problem is not with what he set up, but how he set it up. Is anyone sure that one stock setup is the same as another? I've never seen a Gaui so I don't know, but do these components have model numbers on them? Maybe if we had the model number of the motor and ESC, and the number of teeth on the pinion in this video, some doubt as to what was set up would be eliminated.
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Old 01-10-2009, 02:24 PM   #208 (permalink)
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FYI I am going to tach the head speed. for those that say they cant tach the head because the tach does not go high enough, you still can. just HALF the number. I will use the Skytach and mine only goes up to 2600. So If I think my head speed is say 3000, I will start with 1500 in the tack and move around from there until I see the blades top just like normal. If I read say 1650 on the tach then I just double my number 1650 X 2 = 3300 rpm. Have done it this way for years since electrics like the 450 started having head speed above my tach limit. Works like a champ!

So if others want to do this test and have a tach feel free to do so.
I am going to tach and video today with the gaui batts and then my new 2S Outrage and READ what the head speed difference is, if there is any.

Bob
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Old 01-10-2009, 02:28 PM   #209 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by unklebuck View Post
and then watch this video. cheers
http://www.vimeo.com/2781681
It's hard to guage the headspeed because of the out of track blades, or maybe I just can;t get past the sound of that oscilation. You also did not mention what battery you were using other than it was 850ma, so I am pretty sure that is not the stock battery.

No one is saying you cannot get good headspeed with a guai 200 v2, they are saying the out of the box power system is lacking. I agree 100% with jujiro, the question is more about 2s vs 3s than anything else. You can certainly get 2s to work pretty good for you if you change the pinion, maybe get better batteries, heck even get a better motor . . . however it seems to me a 3s system out of the box would be a better option. You are going to get more run time, and not pull as many amps from the battery and in short it's going to be much better in the long run.

The Guai looks like a great heli, but if I was going to get one . . . i'd go 3s from the start and get different pinions to support that. Not technically stock, but a better heli at that point.
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Old 01-10-2009, 02:31 PM   #210 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unklebuck View Post
and then watch this video. cheers
http://www.vimeo.com/2781681
Hmmm actually... that head speed does not sound as high as the other videos you shared or Kyles video! But it's also not a apples and apples comparison. That is a flybarless heli and every heli I have seen flybarless with the same components used as the flybared version, the heli has a little higher head speed. Also he is not using a Gaui battery is he? NOT apples to apples so this shows nothing really.

So far every video from others like Juri, bpd964, etc using my EXACT setup (not a different batter, flybarless, etc) is just like mine.

I am about ready to run out and shoot and TACH the head speed with my outrage pack. I am pretty sure I am going to see a difference but we shall see and it will be measured for FACTUAL data.....

Stay tuned....

Bob
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Old 01-10-2009, 02:40 PM   #211 (permalink)
 

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It's hard to guage the headspeed because of the out of track blades, or maybe I just can;t get past the sound of that oscilation. You also did not mention what battery you were using other than it was 850ma, so I am pretty sure that is not the stock battery.

No one is saying you cannot get good headspeed with a guai 200 v2, they are saying the out of the box power system is lacking. I agree 100% with jujiro, the question is more about 2s vs 3s than anything else. You can certainly get 2s to work pretty good for you if you change the pinion, maybe get better batteries, heck even get a better motor . . . however it seems to me a 3s system out of the box would be a better option. You are going to get more run time, and not pull as many amps from the battery and in short it's going to be much better in the long run.

The Guai looks like a great heli, but if I was going to get one . . . i'd go 3s from the start and get different pinions to support that. Not technically stock, but a better heli at that point.
i said on the video what battery i was using. it's an a plus 850 mAh 15c. they worked about as good in my V1 as the STOCK gaui 2S batteries. by the way, let's get one thing straight. there is no STOCK battery offered by gaui with any of their kits. they do make lipo's, but they are not STOCK. no battery is for this heli. that is what bob was sent. i wish to christ i had a damn gaui 2S, believe me.

i won't bother to shoot my headspeed because frankly, i could care less what it is. and anyway, bob says it's not apples to apples with the heli's because of the fact that my heli is a flybarless "set up"
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Old 01-10-2009, 02:42 PM   #212 (permalink)
 

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Originally Posted by Finless View Post
Hmmm actually... that head speed does not sound as high as the other videos you shared or Kyles video! But it's also not a apples and apples comparison. That is a flybarless heli and every heli I have seen flybarless with the same components used as the flybared version, the heli has a little higher head speed. Also he is not using a Gaui battery is he? NOT apples to apples so this shows nothing really.

So far every video from others like Juri, bpd964, etc using my EXACT setup (not a different batter, flybarless, etc) is just like mine.

I am about ready to run out and shoot and TACH the head speed with my outrage pack. I am pretty sure I am going to see a difference but we shall see and it will be measured for FACTUAL data.....

Stay tuned....

Bob
bpd was not using a gaui 2S battery, and juri's headspeed with a gaui 2S is higher than yours imo.

and thanks for the tip on the sky tach. i never knew that.
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Old 01-10-2009, 02:50 PM   #213 (permalink)
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reading this forum makes me laugh. ppl in this post are arguing for no reason. seriously, it was just a statement Bob said. he says it about other helis he gets as well, and ppl dont start flipping. here we are, arguing about headspeed when ppl in Africa are just trying to find water to live. this problem is a big one compared to finding water :S...no rhyme or reason to the anger.
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Old 01-10-2009, 02:51 PM   #214 (permalink)
 

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bob is the only one who flipped. read the posts(and some were edited).
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Old 01-10-2009, 03:01 PM   #215 (permalink)
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So Unklebuck is Rotorhead58d... Makes sense now.....
You got banned once for pounding on people right? I though you swore you were done with Helifreak? Honestly I don't care either way.... I will let Will decide.

But yes... this is not apples to apples.

In the end if I just cant get the head speed then lets look at this logically as there is no magic. I will be eliminating the battery as a possible problem right? So we can quit arguing about that. Then it will come down to that SOME of us got an ESC or motor that is not performing like others. That in fact could be the case couldn't it? I mean what else would cause the difference at 0 pitch?
I know, I know... could be belt too tight or pinion.... Well a free standing head spin will show how free the system is and thus belt. Pinion mesh? Well I will show again it is set right to eliminate that argument.

Anyway gotta get out there and get testing the new battery. If there is not much difference then I got what I got.... Is it too hard to believe I got something that is performing differently than others?

Quote:
bpd was not using a gaui 2S battery, and juri's headspeed with a gaui 2S is higher than yours imo.
I dissagree... have them qued up side by side and flip back and forth and listen. Since my video does not spend much time on the ground, and ESC may not have been up fully yet before I lifted off, its hard to compare but the hover is pretty close if you ask me. Now do that with Kyle's video for instance.
Last night I had my brother in law over who knows nothing about hels. I asked him to listen to some of these. He agreed in the head speed differences and those that sound similar to mine.

Bob
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Old 01-10-2009, 03:11 PM   #216 (permalink)
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Nobody here is saying that the stock system doesn't work at all , just that it could use a little more grunt to it for harder flying . Sometimes I think some gaui followers can't take some negative comments on their helis. Like I love the T-rex 250 but out of the box it's roll- flip rates are a tad slow on stock equipment. They get a lot better with the addition of a 16 T or /and CF blades .

There is a big difference in performance of a flybarred and flybarless heli, I just learned that first hand last week. My T-rex 500 was even more of a rocket than it was stock after changing it to flybarless @[email protected]
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Old 01-10-2009, 03:19 PM   #217 (permalink)
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I think there are a few people taking every word too serious, this doesn't have anything to do with Gaui. But there seams to be some kind of affinity
Once more, big thanks to Bob for doing those videos! Please don't take those guys too serious.
-klaus
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Old 01-10-2009, 05:08 PM   #218 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jujiro View Post
Sometimes I think some gaui followers can't take some negative comments on their helis.
Totally thinking the same thing. And the fact that it wasn't even a negative comment in the first place, just the thought that it could use more power.
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Old 01-10-2009, 05:27 PM   #219 (permalink)
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Yep... and it's these same guys that have been banned from here many times for doing this same thing over and over again. Beating on anyone that says something even slightly off about the heli and not just me. They have their own forum, they have said many times on their forum they are done with Helifreak, have said many times to "let me do my thing over here and they do their thing over there" but yet cant stay away from here and let that happen! Coming here and impersonating someone you are not just shows how deceitful they are. I hope some are seeing that now.

I will admit I went WAY overboard in my reaction the other night. To many I apologize for that. I am an "A" type personality so when I get accused of "not setting up right" with no basis of fact behind it, I get defensive and defend myself. Poor Will is constantly consulting me to forget it and ignore it and move on and NOT go to their level. Well I am human and make mistakes but will try to learn from each one I make.

I think now we are seeing where this came from. Same guys different handle and day, same story. I should have guessed it but was too "A" type to see it.

Anyway I got the vids shot and will be posting them probably tomorrow AM. I am getting what is pretty consistent with what others have shown.

In the end I enjoy this heli, feel it is built very well and all this drama aside... If you interested in a heli this size I highly suggest taking a look at this model. I will continue to play with mine and power it up a little more. I may go 3S as some that have far more experience are suggesting. Thanks!

Bob
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Old 01-10-2009, 07:21 PM   #220 (permalink)
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Bob, have you had any problem with slop in the grips? Mine is brand new (got it for x-mas) and I've crashed it once so far. To be sure, I changed the spindle as I was told that loctite might build up in them and cause the slight "click" of slope that I am getting when I pull the grips. It is only about 1 mm or so but I was told there should be none.

I made a thread to see if anyone had a clue and they all said that it was something to do with the spindle. https://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=112289

I know that I have all the washers in the grips as the manual states.

I am still puzzled though. Should I maybe grind the screws down a little?

Thanks!
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