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Old 04-12-2009, 10:30 PM   #1
gww528
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Default A123 10S2P Knight 600e

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Originally Posted by Chris
<snip>

So tell me how you have the 10S2P arranged in your Knight? I've been looking at mine, and it looks like the little angled frame separator will need to go to the bottom of the frame, and I'll need to figure out some way to get a velcro strap at the back for the rear pack. Other than that, it looks like it should be pretty easy to try it.

I actually flew mine on 10S1P and the voltage worked great with the stock gearing and motor, but of course the pack was pretty unhappy pumping out that much power and the flight was short.
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You are correct, the angled frame is moved to the bottom of the frame. I use to have the Castle HV85 there but moved it to the outside side frame. This will leave you a clean open space from the motor to the front. A 10s1p (5x5) will fit there and another 10s1p will sit in front of it hanging from the battery support. These will run in parallel to give you 10s2p. Tons of power & nothing gets hot. i.e. battery, motor, ESC
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Old 04-13-2009, 07:14 AM   #2
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Ah, so you're actually sitting the pack on that frame spacer, not suspending it from the top like the forward pack! Excellent.

OK, I see an experiment coming up with my Knight. Sorry you had to try it first, I think you had your Knight before I did.
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Old 04-13-2009, 07:52 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by JustPlaneChris View Post
Ah, so you're actually sitting the pack on that frame spacer, not suspending it from the top like the forward pack! Excellent.

OK, I see an experiment coming up with my Knight. Sorry you had to try it first, I think you had your Knight before I did.
I made a little angle bracket with velcro. On the backside corner of the battery there is another piece of velcro. This way it is very easy & quick to shove the battery in and not worry about it rubbing against the motor. Then just tighten the velcro strap against the bottom bracket and that battery is going nowhere. You know how to hang the other battery in the front.
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Old 04-13-2009, 07:53 AM   #4
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Brilliant! I'll just need to find another spot for my BEC, since it currently sits on the frame spacer.
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Old 04-14-2009, 09:49 AM   #5
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More photos with and without the packs mounted would be nice to see.
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Old 04-17-2009, 10:13 PM   #6
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Quote:
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More photos with and without the packs mounted would be nice to see.
You're right, Kenneth. How about these?

I haven't flown it yet, but it's ready to go. AUW is a hefty 9 lbs 8 oz / 4.3kg, which is 1 lb 3 oz / 528g more than my fully fueled Knight 3D, and 1 lb 8 oz / 680g heavier than when carrying 8S 3700 lipos. The 600E actually has more horsepower available than the nitro, but the disk loading will obviously be higher. If I like the power level, I can always get some Mavrikk G5 Pro 620 wide chord blades for it.
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Old 04-17-2009, 10:37 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by JustPlaneChris View Post
You're right, Kenneth. How about these?

I haven't flown it yet, but it's ready to go. AUW is a hefty 9 lbs 8 oz / 4.3kg, which is 1 lb 3 oz / 528g more than my fully fueled Knight 3D, and 1 lb 8 oz / 680g heavier than when carrying 8S 3700 lipos. The 600E actually has more horsepower available than the nitro, but the disk loading will obviously be higher. If I like the power level, I can always get some Mavrikk G5 Pro 620 wide chord blades for it.
Pictures?! You do not need my pictures, when you have Chris's. Nice pictures, that is my exact setup. BTW nice bracket also. Looking forward to hear how you like it. What will the 620mm wide chord blades do for you?

Thank you
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Old 04-18-2009, 08:14 AM   #8
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Pictures?!Nice pictures, that is my exact setup. BTW nice bracket also. Looking forward to hear how you like it. What will the 620mm wide chord blades do for you?
I thought you might like that bracket, it's left-over scraps from a real airplane project from a few years ago (as are the rivets holding it to the bottom plate).

The 620s would just help lower the disk loading a little, since it's carrying more weight. I'm not going to order any until I see how it feels in flight on the 600s.
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Old 04-18-2009, 08:22 AM   #9
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Thanks Chris. Wow, that sure looks like a lot of weight to be hanging off an unsupported cantilever right out the front of the heli. It looks as if the CF plate would snap off in a hard landing, taking the Rx with it and maybe ripping some servo leads, but of course looks can be deceiving.
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Old 04-18-2009, 09:18 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by kgfly View Post
Thanks Chris. Wow, that sure looks like a lot of weight to be hanging off an unsupported cantilever right out the front of the heli. It looks as if the CF plate would snap off in a hard landing, taking the Rx with it and maybe ripping some servo leads, but of course looks can be deceiving.
Actually, that forward A123 pack weighs less than the 8S 3700 lipo that normally hangs there. Plus, if you check how far the pack goes, when it tries to bend the forward part of the tray (G10, btw... not CF) the aft end of the pack pivots up to stop it.

I'm sure in a hard enough crash it might break or crack it, but it's an easy to replace bit.
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Old 04-18-2009, 09:20 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by kgfly View Post
Thanks Chris. Wow, that sure looks like a lot of weight to be hanging off an unsupported cantilever right out the front of the heli. It looks as if the CF plate would snap off in a hard landing, taking the Rx with it and maybe ripping some servo leads, but of course looks can be deceiving.
The front battery is butted against the other battery which gives it support & is not so likely to snap on a hard landing.

Chris, on your 600e, you have what I think is velcro or foam between frames next to the secondary receiver antenna. Well... where that foam (?) is, I place a second gyro support plate (you can order for a few bucks). This is where you can place your receiver. You can then just turn your receiver around with the servo plugs facing forward and the antenna closer to the swash plate. You will want to move the secondary receiver to the lower side frame.
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Old 04-18-2009, 09:24 AM   #12
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Ah, neat idea! I have all the extra wires tucked in there, and that piece of foam just makes it look neater. I want to order the 'thumbscrew' type canopy standoffs too, so I'll pick up that gyro plate when I order.
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Old 04-18-2009, 09:29 AM   #13
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I see what you both mean about the other aspects of the geometry that make it stronger, thanks for explaining.
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Old 04-19-2009, 09:19 PM   #14
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Default It flies!

I took the Knight out today for a test run on the 10S2P setup despite the high winds (20+ mph). The flight performance was great! The extra weight actually made it fly very well in the wind compared to the feel with the lipo packs. It felt much more "comfortable" with the extra weight and power was absolutely not an issue.

I had my timer set to 4.5 minutes, and I put 3053 mah back into the pack. Assuming I can get 3900 mah out of the pack (~85%) before it starts to dump, it looks like I can get at least 5.5 minutes with a good safety margin. I might get even more, since fast sport flying in high winds burns a lot of power (lots of pitch!) and I was running about 2200 rpm headspeed too.

I need to put the data logger on it for the next flight to verify current draw and headspeed, but so far it looks promising.
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Old 04-19-2009, 10:48 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by JustPlaneChris View Post
I took the Knight out today for a test run on the 10S2P setup despite the high winds (20+ mph). The flight performance was great! The extra weight actually made it fly very well in the wind compared to the feel with the lipo packs. It felt much more "comfortable" with the extra weight and power was absolutely not an issue.

I had my timer set to 4.5 minutes, and I put 3053 mah back into the pack. Assuming I can get 3900 mah out of the pack (~85%) before it starts to dump, it looks like I can get at least 5.5 minutes with a good safety margin. I might get even more, since fast sport flying in high winds burns a lot of power (lots of pitch!) and I was running about 2200 rpm headspeed too.

I need to put the data logger on it for the next flight to verify current draw and headspeed, but so far it looks promising.
Ya, the 10s2p works well in the wind. You can definitely do better than ~85% around 91%. The packs really get cooking on the 2nd & 3rd charge when they are still warm.

Now let me know how those 620mm wide cord blades work out when you get them.
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Old 04-20-2009, 09:57 AM   #16
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Cool, that should get me into the 6 minute range. I will also probably back the headspeed down a little, especially if/when I get those 620s on there.

It worked well enough that I'm no longer in any hurry to buy more lipos for it.
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Old 04-20-2009, 10:02 AM   #17
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Cool, that should get me into the 6 minute range. I will also probably back the headspeed down a little, especially if/when I get those 620s on there.

It worked well enough that I'm no longer in any hurry to buy more lipos for it.
Idle Up #2 is 2200 use sometimes on windy days. Idle Up #1 is 1950 rpm, now I am not doing any intense 3D but it seems to be a good head speed.
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Old 04-20-2009, 10:30 AM   #18
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I don't do intense 3D either, just loops, rolls, flips, and I'm working on inverted and backwards. I'll give 1950 a try and see how it does.

I gotta say though, the extra weight really made it groove. I've always liked lower disk loading on my small helis, but I'm beginning to think it's possible to have a big one too light! At least for my flying style, anyway.
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Old 05-08-2009, 01:34 AM   #19
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Hi Guys,

I was just looking for the kind of info. that you've been giving! 10s2p on Knight 600e!! Thanks!!

Does anyone have any ideas as to when the Odin 700E will become available, and what it's frame might be able to handle???

The Joker2 can handle 15s2p (if I'm not mistaken), as can the Trex 700E (with a custome frame) i....so, that's kinda what I'm expecting the Odin 700E to be able to hold! I wonder what the fly time will be on a pack that size???

Thanks again for the info.

Andrew
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Old 05-10-2009, 08:47 AM   #20
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No word yet on the Odin E, but it should be a beast.

I put two more flights on my 600E using the 10S2P, this time on a non-windy day. I also flew it again with the 8S lipo for comparative purposes. Now that I've flown it more, and in reasonable weather conditions, I think I can come to a conclusion:

It is freaking FANTASTIC on A123!!! If you were to hand the sticks to someone and just let them fly it, there is no way they would guess it's a 9.5 lb machine. It still feels nimble and tossable, but when you start doing "big" moves it easily outshines the lighter lipo version, with energy like a freight train for those big vertical lines.

In short, I will be spending money on a Mastech power supply instead of any more batteries. I will take these two 10S bricks and permanently wire them together and just leave it strapped in, charging in place. With a Mastech, charge time will be short enough I won't need more than one pack. Recharge data this time shows 6.5 minute flights in ST-1 (2050 rpm) and 5.5 in ST-2 (2222). Not too shabby.
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