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Old 10-21-2009, 05:04 PM   #41 (permalink)
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Default Front Hole VRS. Rear Hole

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Originally Posted by MrRPM View Post
Shawn, that's a good question... I have not even tried it... probably some other testers for KBDD have, but I bet they quickly went back to the leading hole. (or maybe there is not a big difference) I think even you would not care, as the front hole flies nice and fast!

Yes, it would be interesting to know Bob's pitch ranges. I have to check mine again... I believe 14 and 10 with 25% expo. I didn't think my flips were quite as fast as Bob's; I should check it out again...
What was the whole concept between the two holes? You guy's were saying to make them even quicker? On the rear hole would it be primarily for stick banging 3D? Second why would the blade act like that is it because of moving more of the paddle's weight forward would takes less torque,input to make them react,which in turn would speed them up?? Just cerious!! I just like to know the WHY? I bought three set's to match all my tail blades!
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Old 10-21-2009, 06:56 PM   #42 (permalink)
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"probably some other testers for KBDD have, but I bet they quickly went back to the leading hole."

I have KBDD paddles installed and flown on the following machines: Knight 3D, Atom 500, Trex 450 SE, Trex 450 Pro, Trex 600E, Caliber 700, Raptor 50.

I have used the rear hole on all of these machines.

On slower responding machines, such as the Trex 600E and the Raptor 50, the paddles sped things up nicely over the stock ones. The Caliber cyclic sped up considerably but the ship retained its extreme smoothness. The Knight 3D was sped up over the stock paddles. The Atom and the Trex 450 Pro are extremely quick, the Trex 450's are close behind.

The paddles speed up the cyclic but, IMHO, there is no loss of stability. The first flight after installing them can be kind of shock, though.

I have only flown with the flybar installed in the rear hole of the paddle-I figured if the object of using the KBDD paddle was to speed things up, I was going to speed things up as much as possible.

Set up properly, the helicopters can still fly very smoothly, but when you want to do something very quick the ability to do so is right there.

I am not, nor do I pretend to be, a young 3D hot shot (not much for 3D at all), but I am having an absolute blast with how fast these things are.

I have a set installed on the Thunder Tiger Mini-Titan but have only test hovered. It should be flown later this week or early next week. I will be testing them on the Cypher as well.


Using the rear hole, by the way, moves the very sharp leading edge of the paddle further forward of the feathering axis (as well as more of the paddle's surface area). Any slight deflection will make the paddle want to feather more, as opposed to the paddle wanting to streamline itself with regard to the relative wind-hence the faster response when the flybar is in the rear hole.

And yes, I am biased...
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Old 10-21-2009, 07:57 PM   #43 (permalink)
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Ah Clem, Thank You for the great explaination! That's the way to clear up and answer most everyones questions, it did for me anyway I don't think I have anything to add to that,I think I know how I want to screw them on now,I just got them so I think Ill go try them before dark Thanks Again.
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Old 10-21-2009, 08:18 PM   #44 (permalink)
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Anytime!
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Old 10-21-2009, 10:25 PM   #45 (permalink)
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Yep, great write up Ah Clem. KBDD asked me to fly for them just mere weeks ago; they are great people! I have a little 3D skillz, but not a huge fleet to test stuff on like you. There is so many variables when tuning any given heli. My earlier comment was just a gander that most pilots would not care about the rear hole... however, you have done some good testing on a wide range of models and it really goes to show that the more tunability the better! I will have to try the other holes some time. Also, will get their paddles back on the Protos, but it will definitely need the forward hole and a bunch of expo. Hopefully in the spring I'll be flying a 600 as well.
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Old 10-21-2009, 11:51 PM   #46 (permalink)
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Mr. RPM,

Very cool!

Yes, the KBDD people are great people. Glad to hear that you are flying for them too!

I am looking forward to the new paddles on the Mini-Titan. In the hover, it felt slightly more stable than it had with the stock paddles.

I always preferred the way the Mini-Titan flew compared to the Trex 450 SE. The Mini was much more agile. After I put the KBDD paddles on the 450 SE's, the 450's were more agile than the Mini-Titan.

I figure the KBDD paddles on the Mini-Titan will make it quicker again than the Trex's, but I will have to fly it to find out.

It is, by the way, nice that KBDD designed the paddles with two holes, so that people can adjust the cyclic response to their own taste.

You are in good company, by the way-Finless prefers to use the front holes in the paddles.
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Old 10-22-2009, 05:36 PM   #47 (permalink)
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I got the chance to fly the Mini-Titan with KBDD paddles today.

HOLY [email protected]!

Much quicker than stock and more stable!

The Mini is now, in my estimation, just a hair quicker than the Trex 450 SE with the same paddles (its pretty close). The Mini feels smoother and more stable than the Trex (again, IMHO).

The sound of the machine in flight changed also to more of a high pitched buzz (the sharp leading edge on the paddle, I assume).

Again, I have the flybar installed in the rear hole on the paddle.

I will be giving my stock Mini-Titan paddles away to a friend who is in the process of learning now-I am spoiled!
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Old 10-22-2009, 10:55 PM   #48 (permalink)
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Default KBDD ON MY 450-SE-V1

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Originally Posted by Ah Clem View Post
I got the chance to fly the Mini-Titan with KBDD paddles today.

HOLY [email protected]!

Much quicker than stock and more stable!

The Mini is now, in my estimation, just a hair quicker than the Trex 450 SE with the same paddles (its pretty close). The Mini feels smoother and more stable than the Trex (again, IMHO).

I Didn't get to fly mine last night ran out of daylight! "Dam!!!,Again!!"
Anyway Like you said HOLY [email protected]! IF someone puts theese paddles on and can't notice the difference in response of the Cyclic,collective and all of the rest of the head movements than they need to set the transmitter down and walk away!!!! WOW!! and not because everyone else is saying it!! WOW!! THEY TURNED MY 450SEV1 INTO A DIFFERENT FLYING MACHINE!! and I'm running them in the front hole.With 30% Expo. I could only Imaging what she would do with the fly bar in the rear hole without any expo!! That would be SICK!! and like you said about stability. The cyclic inpuy is right now and you think it's going to get away from you but it doesn't it comes back real nice!! as for forward flight they tracked great. I have no complaints Now it's time to fine tune them for my flying style with some radio adjustments!! And put a set on my V2!

The sound of the machine in flight changed also to more of a high pitched buzz (the sharp leading edge on the paddle, I assume).

Your not kidding about the sound! Same thing here I had my little girl with me and seh even noticed it when I put it in Idle up,She went from standing next to me to standing behind me I lost my little spoter! lol! But the trade off is small just fly it a few more feet away from yourself!! ha! ha!

Again, I have the flybar installed in the rear hole on the paddle.

If I get brave and try the rear hole how much expo should I dial in to start?

I will be giving my stock Mini-Titan paddles away to a friend who is in the process of learning now-I am spoiled!
Your not kidding for the price you cant go wrong!!
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Old 11-07-2009, 05:45 PM   #49 (permalink)
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Just tried the 50 size on the rear hole for 600N and wow, much better cyclic response, you don't need to yank the stick as much when doing tic-tocs. Was using V-paddles which are normally pretty good.

These are keepers. Also not pitchy in FFF, very good paddles IMHO
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Old 11-07-2009, 08:06 PM   #50 (permalink)
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4cyclic,

Good review.

Amazing how quick they are and are, as you pointed out, not pitchy at all in Fast Forward Flight!
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Old 11-09-2009, 04:26 PM   #51 (permalink)
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These paddles are really amazing. I've put them on both the 450Pro (front hole) and 500 (rear hole). The paddles speed up the cyclic nicely. However not pitchy in FFF and not the give a pretty stable feel. I love them.
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Old 11-13-2009, 05:01 PM   #52 (permalink)
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WOW WOW WOW

I have been trying to get my T450se to do flips and rolls quicker for a while now. I turned my HT65mg to 6volts. Got the trueblood dampers. Maxed out my pitch. elevator, and aliron settings, Increased HS to 3200rmp. Still was doing big loops instead of tight flips with t450. I just put the KBDD paddles on and Oh my, I had to go back and turn down all settings that I just mentioned! Also added expo like Bob and everybody else said. Im not even a hard 3d pilot. A must have for any T450 user. Oh yea I had the gorilla paddles with no weights and it flew spot on just couldnt get it to flip or roll quickly!
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Old 11-14-2009, 10:34 AM   #53 (permalink)
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Just a quick FYI: I now have these paddles on both my heli's and I'm liking them!
On the Beam I could not distinguish them in any way from the Stubz CF paddles that I previously had, neither in cyclic response nor in stability.
On the Atom, they give WAY faster cyclic than the stock paddles, just what I was looking for. I didn't notice any pitching but it's quite windy here so I can't tell for sure yet.
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Old 11-14-2009, 07:22 PM   #54 (permalink)
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After seeing Finless Bob's video and reading all the comments on these paddles i went
and ordered them. Hope they work out for me too.
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Old 11-28-2009, 03:28 AM   #55 (permalink)
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Put my first 5 flights on the KBDD paddles today. OMG!!! Holly cow these are fast. I was like a lot of folks and had my cyclic maxed and very little expo before running 3200rpm gov'd. Swapping the paddles and turning my exo up to 30% was too fast for my level. Took a little tweaking but got it down to a level I felt a little more comfortable with. Probably about halfway between stock and KBDD paddles with identical settings. Absolutely love them! I'm running the orange paddles and the visibility is awesome in crappy cloud cover. Very happy with them in the front hole. Tracking was great in FFF. Probably the best bang for the buck upgrade in my opinion. Can't wait to get better and crank them up to full force.
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Old 11-28-2009, 08:23 AM   #56 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nwmtech View Post
Put my first 5 flights on the KBDD paddles today. OMG!!! Holly cow these are fast. I was like a lot of folks and had my cyclic maxed and very little expo before running 3200rpm gov'd. Swapping the paddles and turning my exo up to 30% was too fast for my level. Took a little tweaking but got it down to a level I felt a little more comfortable with. Probably about halfway between stock and KBDD paddles with identical settings. Absolutely love them! I'm running the orange paddles and the visibility is awesome in crappy cloud cover. Very happy with them in the front hole. Tracking was great in FFF. Probably the best bang for the buck upgrade in my opinion. Can't wait to get better and crank them up to full force.
HA!!! Same here!! I"m glad I put them on the forward hole. I can't really imagine what the rear hole must be like!!!


I"d also agree about the best bang for the buck upgrade comment. DRASTIC change in flight characteristics!!
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Old 11-28-2009, 01:11 PM   #57 (permalink)
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"I can't really imagine what the rear hole must be like!!! "

Really, really, really quick-but still stable when you neutralize the cyclic!
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Old 11-28-2009, 04:28 PM   #58 (permalink)
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Well.....I always have, and still do, prefer the front hole. Seems to me thats just common sense. :o
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Old 11-28-2009, 05:07 PM   #59 (permalink)
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Old 11-29-2009, 12:39 AM   #60 (permalink)
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he put a smiley, so maybe pun intended... lol
I like the front paddle hole as well. Tried the rears for a time, and yes, a bit quicker... also, yes, still stable with no input. However, I felt it wanted to pull or pitch slightly through fast maneuvers (such as a loop). I didn't need to input quite as much elevator... even though it still tracked great and didn't pitch up suddenly. It wasn't horrible, but just strange feeling, so the front hole is great for me and I still need 25% expo. I really love these airfoil designs KBDD has come up with; seems to really do what paddles are meant to do!
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