Rebuild Help - HeliFreak
Fun, Learning, Friendship and Mutual Respect START  HERE


Unregistered
Go Back   HeliFreak > R/C Helicopter Support > SAB Goblin 630/700/770


SAB Goblin 630/700/770 SAB Heli Division 630/700/770 - Goblin Helicopters Factory Support


Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 04-23-2012, 07:52 PM   #1 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
Posts: 1,682
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: California USA
Question Rebuild Help

Hay guys i'm rebuilding my Goblin after a crash and I need some help with the head. I went ahead and replaced the main shaft and the spindle (H0079) But when i turn the blade holders i feel some notches (not smooth) I dont remember if it felt that way new or if i still have a unforeseen problem. thanks for your help
__________________
JT
Trex 500, 550 & 600
Gob 700 & 700 KSE
JTAnimal is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 04-23-2012, 08:20 PM   #2 (permalink)
Registered Users
 

Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: UTICA,MI
Default Bearings

JT

Check your bearing including the thrust bearing . You will probably find a notchy one.
Bladestrike is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-23-2012, 09:13 PM   #3 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
Posts: 18,340
 

Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Santa Clara, Ca
Default

Should be smooth. Likely a bad radial bearing or a damaged thrust.

This post is basically useless since Bladestrike said it all.
__________________
MSH USA
Xnova
Xpert
OnTheSnap is online now        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-23-2012, 09:22 PM   #4 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
Posts: 1,682
Thread Starter Thread Starter
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: California USA
Default

Well I'm glad you think it's useless.
__________________
JT
Trex 500, 550 & 600
Gob 700 & 700 KSE
JTAnimal is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-23-2012, 09:26 PM   #5 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
Posts: 975
 

Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Spring, TX
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JTAnimal View Post
Well I'm glad you think it's useless.
I think he meant his OWN post is useless, not the entire thread. Your thread is very helpful.
__________________
Goblin 700C | Goblin 500 Sport | Trex 700L Dominator | Trex 450L Dominator | Trex 250DFC | DJI F450 | Armattan Chameleon FPV
justindewoody is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-23-2012, 11:43 PM   #6 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
Posts: 18,340
 

Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Santa Clara, Ca
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JTAnimal View Post
Well I'm glad you think it's useless.
Lol, yes I meant my comment was redundant. The _thread_ is useful but my _post_ was pointless. (-:
__________________
MSH USA
Xnova
Xpert
OnTheSnap is online now        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-24-2012, 12:26 PM   #7 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
Posts: 1,682
Thread Starter Thread Starter
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: California USA
Default

Sorry, i did not understand your post. To me this is a first so all of this is important. I have never had a serious crash and this is my first 700. But i will start by saying the crash damage on this Goblin is disapointing. Breakaway tail , ya it broke alright! I would have been better off buying a new kit with all the damaged parts on this heli.

I was hovering at 10' checkig some adjustments that we had just made when all the sudden the nose pitched up (i did not move the sticks) so i pushed the nose back down to level and i knew something was wrong i went to land and as i got close to the ground it did the pitch up motion again, but this time it was too close to the ground. our fly field is at the edge of a sod farm and all grass, cut very short. the ground is not very hard but not too soft. the heli did not crash on concrete. but you couldn't tell that by the damage to the heli.

Problem - right now i think the wire to the RX came loose or the FBL controler was bad, i have sent in the controler and am waiting for a reply.

The question i asked at the start of the thread, you guys were correct. the bearing (the one that gets the loctite) was bad on both sides, the thrust bearings were ok. I had some spare bearings that size from ny TRex 550 kit and that fixed the problem but one of the blade holders is bent so just to be safe i ordered the whole head.

So in my opinion if you crash this heli get ready to bend over and keep your vaseline handy, not much will survive. Im just giving info to people that may want it. maybe all 700 size helis are the same way, i dont know, this is the only 700 i have. I had a similar crash on my 550 and the damage was miner.

With that all said, I like this heli. it sounds great, it looks cool, i want it flying again soon. But i will go over everything carefully to make sure its working right. But i dont think its as crash friendly as SAB would have you think.

One last question - when my heli first pitched up, do you think i should have just cut the throttle and auto it down?

__________________
JT
Trex 500, 550 & 600
Gob 700 & 700 KSE
JTAnimal is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-24-2012, 01:13 PM   #8 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
Posts: 931
 

Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Florida
Default

"One last question - when my heli first pitched up, do you think i should have just cut the throttle and auto it down?

Once you know your heli it is easier to make that call. I've hit throttle hold and found no problems. It could be a loose wire as you said or static electricity will do that to either the RX or Flybarless system. For me when I do get a glitch I always bring it to a hover no mater how high I am (if I can & have time) & work the controls. As far as how you handle it I would probably handled it the same way.
gww528 is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-24-2012, 01:33 PM   #9 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
Posts: 18,340
 

Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Santa Clara, Ca
Default

Coming from a guy that's had some insane in air failures, it's always best to hit hold and auto in. My gosh, over the years I've had over 20-30 in flight failures. Mostly from stripping tail gears, ESC's blowing up, exploding tail grips, etc.

After you get your heli back together, make it your #1 priority to learn autos. It's an essential skill that in this case would have reduced the damage dramatically.

ANY heli that goes in under full power will destroy itself. Boom strikes, frames, gears, will all be destroyed instantly. I don't think you're being fair to the Goblin in the sense that you buried it with full speed. In an instant, the blades will fold and wack off the boom. Nothing can save it.

After you learn to auto, the next crucial skill is learning to auto inverted. Sometimes I've had to land it on the head after a failure! But in some cases I was gentle enough to even save the blades. Other times I was high enough to build energy and flip it over and land fine.

Next skill is the left rudder piro flip. Any tail failure will require strong piro skills to right the heli. Then kill the power to stop the piro. Auto in and the heli will weather vane without tail control.

Note that you can setup failures in the sim to practice this stuff.

On the FBL connectors: Always shoe goo every connection, extension etc. If there is ANY outward tension on the wire, it will vibrate out period. So also make sure any tension in pulling the connector in and not out.

Hope some of this helps to save you some misery in the future. IMO, no one should buy a 700 class heli without basic auto skills (not saying you don't already have them, just making a general statement).
__________________
MSH USA
Xnova
Xpert
OnTheSnap is online now        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-24-2012, 01:34 PM   #10 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
Posts: 4,546
 

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Melbourne Oz
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JTAnimal View Post
So in my opinion if you crash this heli get ready to bend over and keep your vaseline handy, not much will survive. Im just giving info to people that may want it. maybe all 700 size helis are the same way, i dont know, this is the only 700 i have. I had a similar crash on my 550 and the damage was miner.
I think it is luck of the draw. There have been a few people post up crash videos and pictures of their Goblins where the impact was large but the damage was relatively light. Remember that each time you step up a size the energy in the drive system and blades along with the weight of the model means the crashes are going to damage more of the model.

When you step up to a 600 or bigger the cost of blades plus canopy is often $200 so even a minor crash will add up very quickly.

//Dennis.
__________________
SOXOS DB7 : SOXOS 600 : SOXOS 550 : SOXOS F3C
Protos 380 : SAB Goblin 700 nightflyer : Jeti DS-16 : Mini Protos FBL Stretch : Logo 600
www.soxosaustralia.com.au & VTX blades
Thunder Fighter is online now        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-24-2012, 02:04 PM   #11 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
Posts: 2,928
 

Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Bristow, VA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Thunder Fighter View Post
I think it is luck of the draw. There have been a few people post up crash videos and pictures of their Goblins where the impact was large but the damage was relatively light. Remember that each time you step up a size the energy in the drive system and blades along with the weight of the model means the crashes are going to damage more of the model.

When you step up to a 600 or bigger the cost of blades plus canopy is often $200 so even a minor crash will add up very quickly.

//Dennis.
+1 Yep!
aviator493 is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-24-2012, 02:18 PM   #12 (permalink)
The Capi
 
Posts: 25,125
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Toronto
Default

If you hit the ground with power to the blades you are asking for a big repair bill, doesn't matter what brand heli. When you are on the sim actually practice hitting TH, when you crash on the sim hit TH. Eventually hitting TH will be automatic from practice.
__________________
Spreading capibara awareness since 2006
DominicD is online now        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-24-2012, 05:14 PM   #13 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
Posts: 1,682
Thread Starter Thread Starter
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: California USA
Default

I know how to auto, but when i leveled the heli it seemed to be ok it was under my control. So then i thought i need to get this on the ground, but when i got close to the ground it pitched up again and that was it. too close to the ground for it to pitch up like that.

as for the cost we all know a 700 size is expensive and the most costly to repair, short of a scale 700 or a real heli, but SAB was putting out that the breakaway bolts holding the tail on gives you a chance to save the tail. Give me a break if your tail hits the ground, Game over.

I think next time i will hit throttle hold, at least the power will be reduced if it hits the ground. I dont think hitting throttle hold would have stopped it from pitching up. that was more my point.

Thanks
__________________
JT
Trex 500, 550 & 600
Gob 700 & 700 KSE
JTAnimal is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-24-2012, 08:56 PM   #14 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
Posts: 5,353
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Houston Texas
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JTAnimal View Post
I know how to auto, but when i leveled the heli it seemed to be ok it was under my control. So then i thought i need to get this on the ground, but when i got close to the ground it pitched up again and that was it. too close to the ground for it to pitch up like that.

as for the cost we all know a 700 size is expensive and the most costly to repair, short of a scale 700 or a real heli, but SAB was putting out that the breakaway bolts holding the tail on gives you a chance to save the tail. Give me a break if your tail hits the ground, Game over.

I think next time i will hit throttle hold, at least the power will be reduced if it hits the ground. I dont think hitting throttle hold would have stopped it from pitching up. that was more my point.

Thanks
If you read MANY of the other Goblin crash reports those bolts sheer and add a CHANCE to save the boom.

Justin had a MUCH worse crash than you but not much damage..he hit hold and the boom broke away just as it should..
Bert demolished one earlier this year and the boom broke away and was fine..

if this crash damage is shocking to you I'm sorry but you are not financially ready for a 700 at all. and bashing SAB's design for not crashing well is kinda absurd when it has already proven in several cases due to the power plant pod being separate from the main frames and the break away boom are saving crash costs.. not to mention that these helis for the most part are not designed to crash.. but to fly.

I had a 1000 dollar crash on a 12S Fusion.. and wasnt even a rekit since it wasnt the airframe that had all the damage.. it was the electronics..

700s you have to be ready to spend an easy 500 bucks or MORE per crash.. especially on a premium kit like the Goblin or the TDR or anything MA for that matter..

If this amount of cash for a crash is uncomfortable then a 700 of most brands isn't going to be for you. especially an E 700 since there is potentially 4x the force than even a N700
that's a lot of energy in a crash.. and it has to go somewhere..

I am sorry for your issue it does sound like an FBL issue maybe vibe level.. or a loose wire.. or even a transmitter/RX glitch.
next time auto it down at the first sign of trouble.. will help minimize damages.
__________________
SAB USA Field Rep, Skookum Field Rep,
Team Lynx
.
Goblin 700, Goblin 630, Goblin 500
CeeveeSiN is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-24-2012, 10:30 PM   #15 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
Posts: 1,682
Thread Starter Thread Starter
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: California USA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CeeveeSiN View Post
If you read MANY of the other Goblin crash reports those bolts sheer and add a CHANCE to save the boom.

Justin had a MUCH worse crash than you but not much damage..he hit hold and the boom broke away just as it should..
Bert demolished one earlier this year and the boom broke away and was fine..

if this crash damage is shocking to you I'm sorry but you are not financially ready for a 700 at all. and bashing SAB's design for not crashing well is kinda absurd when it has already proven in several cases due to the power plant pod being separate from the main frames and the break away boom are saving crash costs.. not to mention that these helis for the most part are not designed to crash.. but to fly.

I had a 1000 dollar crash on a 12S Fusion.. and wasnt even a rekit since it wasnt the airframe that had all the damage.. it was the electronics..

700s you have to be ready to spend an easy 500 bucks or MORE per crash.. especially on a premium kit like the Goblin or the TDR or anything MA for that matter..

If this amount of cash for a crash is uncomfortable then a 700 of most brands isn't going to be for you. especially an E 700 since there is potentially 4x the force than even a N700
that's a lot of energy in a crash.. and it has to go somewhere..

I am sorry for your issue it does sound like an FBL issue maybe vibe level.. or a loose wire.. or even a transmitter/RX glitch.
next time auto it down at the first sign of trouble.. will help minimize damages.
Who are you? you don't know me or what i can afford. im giving my opinion on this heli. keep your post about the heli not me.
__________________
JT
Trex 500, 550 & 600
Gob 700 & 700 KSE
JTAnimal is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-24-2012, 11:22 PM   #16 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
Posts: 5,353
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Houston Texas
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JTAnimal View Post
Who are you? you don't know me or what i can afford. im giving my opinion on this heli. keep your post about the heli not me.
You're the one that posted it not me..

you gave the impression of flat shock at the cost..

welcome to 700s.. keep the credit card handy.
__________________
SAB USA Field Rep, Skookum Field Rep,
Team Lynx
.
Goblin 700, Goblin 630, Goblin 500
CeeveeSiN is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-24-2012, 11:29 PM   #17 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
Posts: 18,340
 

Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Santa Clara, Ca
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JTAnimal View Post
I know how to auto, but when i leveled the heli it seemed to be ok it was under my control. So then i thought i need to get this on the ground, but when i got close to the ground it pitched up again and that was it. too close to the ground for it to pitch up like that.

as for the cost we all know a 700 size is expensive and the most costly to repair, short of a scale 700 or a real heli, but SAB was putting out that the breakaway bolts holding the tail on gives you a chance to save the tail. Give me a break if your tail hits the ground, Game over.

I think next time i will hit throttle hold, at least the power will be reduced if it hits the ground. I dont think hitting throttle hold would have stopped it from pitching up. that was more my point.

Thanks
Sounds like you did everything right. Sometimes there is nothing you can do and the Heli goes in. My save percentage for tail failures is roughly 40%. All depends on the situation and how you react in that 500ms.
__________________
MSH USA
Xnova
Xpert
OnTheSnap is online now        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-24-2012, 11:44 PM   #18 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
Posts: 18,340
 

Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Santa Clara, Ca
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CeeveeSiN View Post
If you read MANY of the other Goblin crash reports those bolts sheer and add a CHANCE to save the boom.

Justin had a MUCH worse crash than you but not much damage..he hit hold and the boom broke away just as it should..
Bert demolished one earlier this year and the boom broke away and was fine..

if this crash damage is shocking to you I'm sorry but you are not financially ready for a 700 at all. and bashing SAB's design for not crashing well is kinda absurd when it has already proven in several cases due to the power plant pod being separate from the main frames and the break away boom are saving crash costs.. not to mention that these helis for the most part are not designed to crash.. but to fly.

I had a 1000 dollar crash on a 12S Fusion.. and wasnt even a rekit since it wasnt the airframe that had all the damage.. it was the electronics..

700s you have to be ready to spend an easy 500 bucks or MORE per crash.. especially on a premium kit like the Goblin or the TDR or anything MA for that matter..

If this amount of cash for a crash is uncomfortable then a 700 of most brands isn't going to be for you. especially an E 700 since there is potentially 4x the force than even a N700
that's a lot of energy in a crash.. and it has to go somewhere..

I am sorry for your issue it does sound like an FBL issue maybe vibe level.. or a loose wire.. or even a transmitter/RX glitch.
next time auto it down at the first sign of trouble.. will help minimize damages.
LOL, it's like you're pep talking yourself. Isn't this your first 700 Heli? Trust me, you will cry like a baby when you plant your Goblin. And if it's caused by a mechanical or electrical failure it will eat at you. And I bet we see an emotionally charged thread as a result.

Crashing never gets easy. If the money is not an issue, the time needed to fix it always is. But there comes a day when we stop feeling compelled to post about crashes, and we get less emotional about it.

As far as Goblin crash worthiness goes, IMO it's not proven at all yet. A few crashes by Bert and a few forum posts is nothing. We need way more data before we can collectively claim it crashes "well". And fact is the bigger the model the greater the crash damage. Also I think our Lipos don't have the best protection in the world. I expect a goblin crash to take out Lipos often.
__________________
MSH USA
Xnova
Xpert
OnTheSnap is online now        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-24-2012, 11:53 PM   #19 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
Posts: 5,353
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Houston Texas
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by OnTheSnap View Post
LOL, it's like you're pep talking yourself. Isn't this your first 700 Heli? Trust me, you will cry like a baby when you plant your Goblin. And if it's caused by a mechanical or electrical failure it will eat at you. And I bet we see an emotionally charged thread as a result.

Crashing never gets easy. If the money is not an issue, the time needed to fix it always is. But there comes a day when we stop feeling compelled to post about crashes, and we get less emotional about it.

As far as Goblin crash worthiness goes, IMO it's not proven at all yet. A few crashes by Bert and a few forum posts is nothing. We need way more data before we can collectively claim it crashes "well". And fact is the bigger the model the greater the crash damage. Also I think our Lipos don't have the best protection in the world. I expect a goblin crash to take out Lipos often.
my first 700? um no.. I've had 4 Nitro 700s

3 T700Ns ( including 1 right now.you dont read sigs much )
1 Synergy N9
And I have as early as 2 weeks ago crashed a 700N..

crashing sucks only to the fact that I have to waste time fixing the heli.
the money really doesn't phase me.. it hurts but I hate the repair even more than the cash.

being divorced with no bills and no kids does have it's advantages.. specially for those of us having a mid life crisis
__________________
SAB USA Field Rep, Skookum Field Rep,
Team Lynx
.
Goblin 700, Goblin 630, Goblin 500

Last edited by CeeveeSiN; 04-25-2012 at 09:21 AM..
CeeveeSiN is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 04-25-2012, 10:52 AM   #20 (permalink)
Registered Users
 
Posts: 1,682
Thread Starter Thread Starter
 
My HF Map location
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: California USA
Default

Look i posted this for others so they know up front the damage this heli will take in a miner crash, not the cost. if you do not know the costs are high for a 700 parts, that goes without saying "it's the damage I'm talking about". Let me clear up 2 things, I did hit throttle hold when the tail hit the ground but i think i should have done it earlier, the question that you have to think about is if the heli is doing uncommanded moves do you want to shut the power off? there are other things to consider, like people standing near by.

For myself, the parts have been so hard to get i went ahead and ordered a new kit that i will build as a backup. so the idea that its too expensive for me is incorrect. like i said it about the amount of damage to the heli from what i thought was a minor crash. Not the expense

For those looking to buy use the info anyway you like. Maybe they are right a 700 is a big heli maybe they all will blow apart in a crash. this is the only one i have or have ever seen crash. and for you defensive Goblin owners don't get me wrong i love this heli so don't be so defensive
__________________
JT
Trex 500, 550 & 600
Gob 700 & 700 KSE
JTAnimal is offline        Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Reply




Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the HeliFreak forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your REAL and WORKING email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself. Use a real email address or you will not be granted access to the site. Thank you.
Email Address:
Location
Where do you live? ie: Country, State, City or General Geographic Location please.
Name and Lastname
Enter name and last name here. (This information is not shown to the general public. Optional)
Helicopter #1
Enter Helicopter #1 type and equipment.
Insurance
Please select your insurance company (Optional)
Helicopter #2
Enter Helicopter #2 type and equipment.
Helicopter #3
Enter Helicopter #3 type and equipment.
Helicopter #4
Enter Helicopter #4 type and equipment.

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On




Copyright © Website Acquisitions Inc. All rights reserved.
 

SEO by vBSEO 3.6.1