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Old 07-30-2013, 09:08 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Introducing the NEW Cellpro Dual PowerLab 8x2 from Revolectrix





Introducing the NEW Cellpro Dual PowerLab 8x2 from Revolectrix


The next step in the PowerLab progression! Built on a proven field tested platform.


[LEFT]INTRODUCTION:
Welcome to the new thread dedicated entirely to an open discussion about the new FMA/REVOLECTRIX Cellpro Dual PowerLab 8x2 Battery Workstation (DPL). The DPL is a dual independent channel work station. You are invited to ask technical questions or inquire about available features to your heart’s content. Answers will be supplied by FMA staff members who performed in-house alpha testing or beta test team members who have logged hours with prototypes of the DPL. Before you start asking questions, take a quick look at the specifications and the feature set of the DPL:

Dual PowerLab Specifications:

Specification per channel

For Battery types: Lithium Polymer (1s to 8s balanced, 1s to 2s unbalanced), Lithium Ion (1s to 8s balanced, 1s to 2s unbalanced), Lithium Manganese (1s to 8s balanced, 1s to 2s unbalanced), A123 (LiFePO4) (1s to 8s balanced, 1s to 9s unbalanced), NiCd (1s to 21s), NiMH (1s to 21s), 6v, 12v, 24v Lead Acid batteries (Flooded, Gel, AGM, SLA)

Pack capacity: 20 mAh to 360Ah.

Input voltage: 10-48VDC, reverse polarity protected. Each channel may be operated on separate power supplies using 110V/15A isolated circuits for best results. Additionally both channels may be operated on one power supply provided packs on each channel are isolated.

Input current: 1A to 40A, software limited

Power conversion: Synchronous DC/DC converter, supports multiple switcher frequencies of 31.25 kHz, 62.5 kHz, 125 kHz; user selectable by preset, 85% to 93% efficiency depending on output current

Output battery charge current: Adjustable range 10mA to 40A, limited by 40A input current*

Output battery discharge current: Internal discharge 10mA to 10A, 95W max

Regenerative discharge 10mA to 40A, 1344W max**

Continuous max output power: 408W @ +12VDC input, 1344W @ +39.53VDC

Cell balancing: Resolution 78uV (16 bit) for 1s-8s Li or A123 (LiFePO4) balanced charging

Voltage calibration: Cell voltage measurements are factory calibrated to a standard traceable to NIST; calibration is to +/- 6 mV

Current calibration: Charge current is factory calibrated on a 4A standard; calibration is to +/- 1mA

Measurement accuracy:
Voltage resolution: 78uV (16 bit)
Voltage tolerance: +/- 6mV
Charge current: +/- 1%
Capacity added to pack: +/- 1%
Percent capacity (“Fuel”): +/- 5% (with accurate fuel table defined for battery being charged)

Serial data output: 19.2kbps, 8 bits, 1 start bit, 1 stop bit, no parity

Data integrity: Checksum, CRC checking

Size: 10.24 in. (260mm) L x 5.55 in. (141 mm) W x 3.03 in. (77 mm) H

Cooling fans: 13 CFM, 50mm diameter

Heat sink: Internal 120W aluminum, thin finned

Output battery connector: “Cellpro” compatible, JST PA series, 9 position

LCD: 2 line, 16 character, light grey/blue backlit

Footnotes:
* Please note, for safety reasons, available charger current may be limited for certain battery types and/or charging modes, e.g., non-balanced charge of Li
** Please check bullet number 8 in the section titled “Major Features” below for a detailed description of Regenerative Discharge

Dual PowerLab Feature Set:

Major Features:
• Selectable charge rates range 10mA to 40A per channel
• Continuous maximum output power rating, 1344W @ +39.53VDC input voltage, 408W @ +12VDC input voltage
• Using +40VDC to +48VDC input, 1344W output will deliver full current rating (40A) over the full range of output voltage up to 33.6V
• Smart power management allows customer to select between programmable input power sources. Using the Charge Control Software (CCS), choose from several templates to get you in the ballpark, then fine tune the settings. Available settings include power supply input current limit, input low voltage limit, regenerative discharge rate and voltage limit. Dual PowerLab stores 1 set-up for Power Supply per channel and 1 set-up for Battery per channel and asks for verification one time on start-up
• Dual PowerLab does not support charging through node wires only
• Initiate charge, discharge, monitor, and multiple cycles at the DPL or via remote control from the CCS. Graph all major operations when using CCS
• Open Architecture presets allow for customization of any User Preset including show/hide presets on unit, preset name editing, up to 100 parameters control how presets are displayed and charging/discharge/cycling parameter associated with particular batteries and/or charging strategies. Unit includes 25 user preset banks pre-loaded for most major battery type/chemistries, plus 50 library presets
• 0.1mohm voltage resolution allows accurate four point internal resistance measurement of each cell
• Environmentally friendly, regenerative discharge capability of up to 1344W. Unlike traditional methods of discharge, which deplete the output battery’s energy in the form of heat across a transistor, regenerative discharge takes most of that energy and puts it back into the input battery. In other words, when you discharge your LiPo for storage, you will be re-charging your Lead Acid input battery. The total amount of power that you can achieve is limited only by the amount of current that your input battery can accept, or 1344W, whichever is lower
• DPL is also equipped with a traditional, 95W internal discharge capability which is non-regenerative
• Over-sized internal heat sink
• Twin (per channel) 12AWG silicon input power cable with EC5 connector
• Sendust core toroid capable of 40A continuous input current requirement for maximum output specifications

Other Features:
• Supports Cellpro (FMA) and JST-XH wiring modes
• Adapters available for all popular R/C battery brands
• 2 line, 16 character backlit LCD per channel
• Available opto-isolated PC interface and free Charge Control Software (CCS)
• Intuitive 4 button user interface per channel
• Sleek and attractive high-impact ABS enclosure for maximum airflow efficiency
• Sturdy Aluminum top panel with reliable, recessed tactile buttons
• Quick “preset over-ride access” to common charging parameters like setting charge and discharge current and operational modes of charge/discharge/monitor/cycle(s)
• Additional advanced options menu for adjusting in-depth charging parameters and global options at the unit
• GUI PC software (CCS) allows access to 25 User Presets and 50 Library Presets per channel stored in the unit or available in unlimited number on the P.C. When using both channels, launch two independent instances of the CCS
• Free and reliable firmware updates for the life of the product using the CCS. Firmware updates accomplished on each channel independently
• Automatic Low voltage restore for recovering damaged or over-discharged packs
• Programmable options allow speaker ON/OFF or volume, LCD contrast, customized welcome screen, and much more
• Cold weather mode reduces end-charge voltage; parameters adjustable by customer including ON/OFF, end-charge voltage offset reduction, and temperature
• Expansion Channel mode whereby one DPL primary (master channel 1) can control the expansion channel 2, send over preset information, control all aspects of charging and balancing. This feature is perfect for charging multiple packs of same chemistry and capacity using multiple devices such as split packs connected in series during operation all at unbelievable rates
• Auto charge mode available utilizing advanced fuel gauging technology
• Customizable fuel table lookup values based on presets. Fuel tables can be created using a Fuel Table Wizard in the CCS and applied to individual battery brands by presets for improved accuracy
• Industry’s first Safe Parallel adapters available to maximize available power potential. P.C. software supports up to 9 packs in parallel per channel depending on adapters used. The DPL supports parallel, charge, discharge, cycle, or monitor on each channel. Adapters are peripheral products, available separately, or included as a part of DPL combos

Please note: all specifications and features listed above subject to change prior to delivery.

Retail price for the basic unit currently $369.95 on the REVO USA webstore:

http://www.usastore.revolectrix.com/...ual-PowerLab_4

and $359.95 on the REVO Singapore webstore:

http://www.store.revolectrix.com/Pro...ual-PowerLab_3

The Cellpro PowerLab 8x2 will be available for pre-orders in mid August, 2013 (watch for future announcements) with first production run units available late September, 2013.
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Last edited by Howard Matos; 08-02-2013 at 09:21 AM..
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Old 07-30-2013, 11:33 AM   #2 (permalink)
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And why did I have to be the last to know about this???????
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Old 07-30-2013, 03:54 PM   #3 (permalink)
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The differences I see between this and two PL8s (ignoring the most obvious cost and size)
  • Max input voltage increased from 32V to 48V resulting in the max current decreasing from 60A to 40A
  • Minimum voltage needed to attain max charging capability (1344W) increased to from 26.35 to 39.53.
  • Watts output at 12V decreases from 612W to 408W.
  • Regular discharge capability decreased from 100W to 95W

Presumably most of these are due to the requirements of packing two very powerful chargers into one small case, have I missed any others?

What is the recommendation for charging from lead acid batteries? It seems three in series would be just shy of the 39.53V required for maximum wattage and four would be just over.
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Old 07-30-2013, 04:06 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Power source requirements will vary depending on the charge scenario. For most scenarios three deep cycle batteries would cover you. For example, you'd only need about 29v to max out each charger, charging 6s packs.
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Old 07-30-2013, 08:12 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Wow, that is quite the charger I'm glad Revolectrix is entering the multi-channel market.

This seems to take the crown for Biggest Baddest Charger back from the 4010 Duo. At least in terms of total watts, etc.

The 95 internal discharge, is that 95W per channel, 190W total, or 95W split between the two channels?

I'm glad the max input voltage has been raised from 32V. 48V should add quite a bit of flexibility for choice of high-power supplies, vs the current PL6/PL8.

I don't mean to take anything away from this charger, which is very impressive. And I assume the top of the high-end market is where Revolectrix & competitors want to start, for their new top-of-the-line (multi-channel) chargers.

But, just personally, I'd rather see something more like a Dual PowerLab 6, for somewhere around $250. This new charger is, sadly, overkill for someone like myself But a dual-channel PowerLab, based on the PL6, at a lower price point, could provide a lot more flexibility for field charging (fly-and-charge pack 1, then start pack 2, while flying #3), or for people with different cell counts. While still providing plenty of power for people with more moderate requirements. If that could be done at a more manageable price point, you'd have my money.
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Old 07-30-2013, 09:39 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Its 95 watts of internal discharge per side. 190 total. Regarding a Dual Powerlab6 thanks for the comments. Input is appreciated and passed on.

I am also quite glad about the 48v input. Totally addresses the buck/boost transition issues without needing to adjust the supply voltage. I did most of my testing with a 48v supply and it worked great. Input cables are cooler and power delivery is smoother.
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Old 07-30-2013, 10:34 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Default Introducing the NEW Cellpro Dual PowerLab 8x2 from Revolectrix

my vote also for the dual power lab 6.
The 8X2 is also over kill for my needs and the 6X2 would be perfect. It would also be the competitor to the dual channel red Thunder Power unit, which I was going to purchase, but now will wait for the 6X2, which I feel has to happen at some point. Please get on it !
Thanks
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Old 07-30-2013, 10:36 PM   #8 (permalink)
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It all looks great (and is IMHO), just like having 2 PL6's but with a higher V input.

One drawback of the DPL compared to having 2 PL8's however is there's no support for charging through node wires only (balance board) output. I like having that in the winter when charging small 1s-3s packs for micros.

Kudos to FMA for finally making a duo charger.
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Old 07-30-2013, 10:39 PM   #9 (permalink)
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I love my PL8 and my only grip with it is there doesn't seem much consideration about how to mount it to a case. A flat bottom or some consideration for mounting it inside a field charging case would have been nice.
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Old 08-05-2013, 05:50 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DominicD View Post
I love my PL8 and my only grip with it is there doesn't seem much consideration about how to mount it to a case. A flat bottom or some consideration for mounting it inside a field charging case would have been nice.
Can befitted fairly easily in to a Pelican cases......

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Old 08-05-2013, 06:42 AM   #11 (permalink)
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How did you secure them to the case ?
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Old 08-05-2013, 09:32 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Screw through the power supply cover plate into the base feet of the chargers.
I have also seen where the chargers have been glued in place, or velcro was used.

And I just saw this assembly..




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Old 08-05-2013, 09:52 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Earlier I'd commented that I'd prefer to see something like a Dual PL6.

Even that may be over-stating my own personal requirements a bit. I'm more interested in having 2 channels, rather than astronomical power. If a Dual PL6 was going to be $300, vs $350 for Dual PL8, that's better, but it's still more power than I need, and would be tough to justify the cost for me.

Speaking only for myself, I'd be happy with the power of "just" a single PL8 (or PL6, assuming you don't require an oddball 30V PS voltage for full output), split across two channels, or able to deliver the full 40A with the two channels working together.

I'm more interested in the flexibility of multiple channels, and the quality of a PowerLab, than in 1500W+ of power. The Hyperion 0720i Super Duo dual-channel is 500W+500W, for $280. Bring that kind of power, around $250, and that would seem like a more broad-market product, to me.

Given how many people get by with "just" a PL6 or PL8, I'd expect that I'm not alone in this. Dual PL8 is a very impressive "halo" or flagship product, and I'm sure there are folks who have been eagerly waiting for it, but I'd guess that's a small % of the market. It's cheaper than a pair of PL8's, but still quite a bit more expensive than the other chargers on the market.
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Old 08-05-2013, 03:05 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Yeah so you had to mod them to get them to secure, I did something similar. It would have been nice for this consideration to be build in out of the box thats all.
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Old 08-05-2013, 06:38 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Something to keep in mind..these are chargers..and designed as such..
When hobbyists decide they want to enclose them into a "portable" station, you work with the given design and work around any short comings that might inhibit the hobbyist design.

Tough to fit a V8 into a Opel GT... but it has been done with a little ingenuity .

Besides....if it were that easy where's the fun and challenge.
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Old 08-05-2013, 06:48 PM   #16 (permalink)
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The DPL case is a little easier to work with. The "feet" are all the way at the back and the rest of the case is flat. But there is still an air intake on the bottom of the case, so you have to accommodate the charger's airflow needs. I'm currently working on compact charger case with my beta unit and will post pictures when I have permission.
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Old 08-08-2013, 11:02 PM   #17 (permalink)
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I know that the listed maximum input voltage for this unit is 48V, but would a power supply putting out 50.63 v be within acceptable limits for using this unit without damaging the charger? Unfortunately the power supply I'd like to use doesn't have an adjustment pot to get the voltage down to 48V. Thanks in advance for any information.
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Old 08-09-2013, 10:38 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GRR45 View Post
I know that the listed maximum input voltage for this unit is 48V, but would a power supply putting out 50.63 v be within acceptable limits for using this unit without damaging the charger? Unfortunately the power supply I'd like to use doesn't have an adjustment pot to get the voltage down to 48V. Thanks in advance for any information.
In the RCG thread, Howard from FMA writes

Quote:
Originally Posted by Howard Matos View Post
Hi,
You are good to go with 4 x 12.2 = 48.8 volts. We will update the maximum input voltage after we complete further testing.
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Old 08-11-2013, 05:54 PM   #19 (permalink)
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My HF case for my beta DPL is done. Note that the unit in these pictures is prototype used in the beta program. Production units will have a fit and finish more like the Powerlab6 and Powerlab8.

More pictures in my gallery. https://www.helifreak.com/album.php?albumid=10952

The charger is attached to the case with two strips of 3M Dual lock. The "foot" of the charger is hanging off the back in the area created by the bottom support piece.


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Old 08-11-2013, 07:02 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Greg, great job on the charging case, what brand/size case is that and what power supplies did you use?
Thanks
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