Aluminum main blade grips?

[johnsma22]

Anyone else who installed the aluminum main grips not able to use the spacers between the radial bearings and the trust bearings? With the spacers in it's way too tight! Without the spacers there is some play that I don't like. Any thoughts would be appreciated.

[Superholgi]

Originally Posted by johnsma22

Anyone else who installed the aluminum main grips not able to use the spacers between the radial bearings and the trust bearings? With the spacers in it's way too tight! Without the spacers there is some play that I don't like. Any thoughts would be appreciated.

I had to read this twice... You mean the spacers in the spindle, not the plastic shims that came with the blades ?

This one?

[crashcopterman]

If it's the item super highlighted then yes its mandatory to use! Even with spacer a lot of helis still have a tiny amount of blade grip play in and out. Double check that radial bearings in grips are seated properly.

[johnsma22]

Originally Posted by Superholgi

I had to read this twice... You mean the spacers in the spindle, not the plastic shims that came with the blades ?

This one?

Yes, the spacers on the spindle between the radial and thrust bearings. With both, or even just one of the spacers installed, the grips are too tight. With no spacers installed, there is some play.

I read about this issue with the spacer for the tail shaft for the aluminum tail case causing the tail shaft to bind, and also for the aluminum tail grips, but had not seen anything about the main grips.

[Superholgi]

Originally Posted by johnsma22

Yes, the spacers on the spindle between the radial and thrust bearings. With both, or even just one of the spacers installed, the grips are too tight. With no spacers installed, there is some play.

I read about this issue with the spacer for the tail shaft for the aluminum tail case causing the tail shaft to bind, and also for the aluminum tail grips, but had not seen anything about the main grips.

I don't have the heli any more and I don't remember inserting or leaving the spacer out when I upgraded to the alum grips. I think I remember not tightening the screws with bang force (because of spindle tightness), just lightly, instead I used a thorough dab of Loctite (taking care it doesn't come out to ruin the bearings). I had dozens of flights afterwards, now a friend of mine owns the heli and I see him several times a week - no issue.

If yours has too much play without the washers, how about reversing the innermost spacers (the flanged ones next to the rubber dampers) ? That might reduce play.

[BigJay]

My head was fine, but I was one of the people who left them out of the tail because it was too tight. The tail loosened up after a few flights and then developed some flutter because it was too loose. I put the spacers back in and everything was perfect. So, my conclusion was that due to some manufacturing tolerances something wasn't sitting right when it was brand new. After some time at 14,000rpm it sorted itself out.

Perhaps remove all of the bearings from the grips and inspect for burrs? Maybe get in there with a small file if you find something.

I have all of the parts installed now for the last 40-50 flights and it's really really running well.

-J

[Precipitate]

Originally Posted by BigJay

My head was fine, but I was one of the people who left them out of the tail because it was too tight. The tail loosened up after a few flights and then developed some flutter because it was too loose. I put the spacers back in and everything was perfect. So, my conclusion was that due to some manufacturing tolerances something wasn't sitting right when it was brand new. After some time at 14,000rpm it sorted itself out.

Perhaps remove all of the bearings from the grips and inspect for burrs? Maybe get in there with a small file if you find something.

I have all of the parts installed now for the last 40-50 flights and it's really really running well.

-J

My tail grips have loosened now also. I think its time for me to put the spacers in.

[johnsma22]

No mater what combination of things I've tried, including making sure that the radial bearings are completely seated in the grips, the aluminum grips are still way too tight when both spindle bolts are down hard and the spacers are in place. Then I tried again with a set of stock plastic grips and they too are too tight when the spindle bolts are down tight.

When I took the grips apart originally, only one spindle bolt loosened and the other one came out with the spindle. I had to hold the center of the spindle in some vice grips to get the other bolt out! Both bolts had a ton of white thread locker on them.

From the factory, is one of the spindle bolts not tightened all the way to keep the grips from binding, relying on the thread locker?

[crashcopterman]

One will always release easier than the other, weak link in the chain, law of averages etc.

[johnsma22]

Sure, I get that, something's got to give first. My question to you guys who have rebuilt the heads of this heli is, are you able to tighten the spindle bolts all the way down tight and still have your grips move smoothly?

[Precipitate]

Originally Posted by johnsma22

Sure, I get that, something's got to give first. My question to you guys who have rebuilt the heads of this heli is, are you able to tighten the spindle bolts all the way down tight and still have your grips move smoothly?

Mine were not smooth with the metal grips at first. They had a crunchy feeling so to speak. There is a preload/compression going on with the head dampeners.

Just added the washers to my tail, the ones between the radial and thrust bearings. One was now perfect and the other a little tight, I sand it down slowly until it was right. No dampeners in the tail so they should be better a little loose rather then too tight.

[Precipitate]

The head spindle will give up one bolt or the other first. Just pull the spindle out through the head and dampeners by pulling the grip and all out. This had me scratching my head for a bit.

[johnsma22]

Originally Posted by Precipitate

Mine were not smooth with the metal grips at first. They had a crunchy feeling so to speak. There is a preload/compression going on with the head dampeners.

Yes, that's how mine feel right now, but not just "crunchy", also very tight. Did you just leave yours like that and let everything run in?

[Precipitate]

I went with them that way. They still feel a little rough but are looser. Sixty flights and still going. Knock on wood.

I think you are alright but, not being there I would suggest using your best judgment.

[crashcopterman]

Grab grips and pull out very firmly and twist, are they still rough?

[johnsma22]

Just wanted to update. Sanded the spacers and step washers for the main grips until I was able to fully tighten the spindle bolts without any binding whatsoever! Smooth as silk! Did the same for the spacer for the metal tail grips. No slop and silky smooth as well. Was also able to sand the spacer for the tail shaft in the metal tail case to get zero slop and no binding of the tail shaft! Definitely worth the effort to fine tune the tolerances.

[crashcopterman]

These 'hop up' parts should be perfect bolt on items, it pisses me off that several of us have had issues and have deemed modification necessary. I had two aluminum tail kits that had issues too, unusable. Come on Blade!

[johnsma22]

Originally Posted by crashcopterman

These 'hop up' parts should be perfect bolt on items, it pisses me off that several of us have had issues and have deemed modification necessary. I had two aluminum tail kits that had issues too, unusable. Come on Blade!

Honestly, as I've been in this hobby for quite a few years, one thing I've come to learn is that there is virtually no such thing as a perfect, bolt on anything, regardless of manufacturer.

With just a little effort to fine tune the tolerances of these shims and step washers, I was able to get the fit perfect! I used to restore old cars, so I guess I've gotten desensitized to having to modify things to get them to work.

[crashcopterman]

Well I sell car parts for a living and if they fit as bad or gave the problems that my aluminum tail setup gave me I would find new stuff or issue a credit. That is what my local HS owner did, re-ordered tail goodies to try again but same issue so he sent them back to HH. One day I will post the clip of the tail issue. Boiled down to incorrectly made parts for their own heli, disappointing.