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Mikado Logo 700 Xxtreme Mikado Logo 700 Xxtreme Helicopters Discussion


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Old 12-19-2015, 01:25 PM   #61 (permalink)
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I felt that way until I purchased the 700xx. They lost me on that one, definitely not from the same mind that created the logo 500/600 series. Performance and flight time were, well, terrible. Great tail, great cyclic, but the rotating mass and inefficient drivetrain killed it. A case of confused design goals I'd say.
you are saying you like the 500/600 series, but not the 700, correct?
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Old 12-20-2015, 08:54 AM   #62 (permalink)
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I understand how it must be so different compared to the traditional Logos. But holy smokes...to see it in the hands of Kyle and Marius is mind boggling. I can imagine maybe it's less for those of us who are weekend fliers and more for demos and competition with shorter flight times, and high head speeds. It sure sounds mean when cranked up!
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Old 12-20-2015, 09:19 AM   #63 (permalink)
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I agree the 700/800 are in a class of their own. Neither designed to be a bigger 600 style model.
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Old 12-20-2015, 09:31 AM   #64 (permalink)
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I never liked the 700. It always looked clumsy to me. The new frame will make it right imo.
There are many 700 from other brands in the market that fly as well as. Im not particularly fond of the 700 class, but have many mates that fly them and that is what keep telling me.
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Old 12-21-2015, 10:29 AM   #65 (permalink)
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you are saying you like the 500/600 series, but not the 700, correct?
Yes.
The 500/600 series were well thought out machines that adhered to a design philosophy.
The xx series are like someone started the design, but got lost in the details. Only other rational explanation is that they were counting on a major leap in battery tech (true nanowire) to counter the overbuilt and inefficient drivetrain. The battery tech never happened obviously.
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Old 12-21-2015, 10:31 AM   #66 (permalink)
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I understand how it must be so different compared to the traditional Logos. But holy smokes...to see it in the hands of Kyle and Marius is mind boggling. I can imagine maybe it's less for those of us who are weekend fliers and more for demos and competition with shorter flight times, and high head speeds. It sure sounds mean when cranked up!
It's not that it can't perform at all, it just doesn't perform in comparison to others.
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Old 12-21-2015, 10:33 AM   #67 (permalink)
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Agreed. 500/600 are just great.
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Old 12-21-2015, 01:22 PM   #68 (permalink)
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Yes.
The 500/600 series were well thought out machines that adhered to a design philosophy.
The xx series are like someone started the design, but got lost in the details. Only other rational explanation is that they were counting on a major leap in battery tech (true nanowire) to counter the overbuilt and inefficient drivetrain. The battery tech never happened obviously.
I don't think they relied on some unobtanium battery technology. They just used components from the 800XX to reduce design and manufacturing costs.

On another note, does anyone know why they chose to go with a belt between the main drive and torque tube? Why not belt all the way or another method for connecting the torque tube with the main drive?
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Old 12-21-2015, 03:13 PM   #69 (permalink)
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My guess is to get the drive ratio for the tail where they wanted it.
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Old 12-21-2015, 08:54 PM   #70 (permalink)
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On another note, does anyone know why they chose to go with a belt between the main drive and torque tube? Why not belt all the way or another method for connecting the torque tube with the main drive?
I believe that it is to provide a decoupling/damper between the head and tail drives.
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Old 12-22-2015, 11:23 AM   #71 (permalink)
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What r u talking about the 700 extreme didnt perform well as others best 700 ive ever had and ive had them all. In fact it was even lighter than some and the punch was incredible on mine scary power at times. I wish i still had mine
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Old 12-22-2015, 12:20 PM   #72 (permalink)
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I'm getting ready to sell mine...and hope the new one comes out soon.
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Old 12-23-2015, 05:53 AM   #73 (permalink)
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I believe that it is to provide a decoupling/damper between the head and tail drives.
Thats very correct. They have the best of both worlds with the combination of Belt and torque. The 700XX has one of the best tails out there.

In F3N competition the 700XX is far more precise then the 600. It might be of the heavy size but the mass serves also in heavy wind conditions. Short flighttimes only occur at 2050 rpm, which isn't needed for a lot of 3D set manoeuvres. I fly 5:30 when practising F3N at 1950 rpm

That said... I'm awaiting the new 700...knowing Mikado ... there WILL be improvements.
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Old 12-24-2015, 12:23 AM   #74 (permalink)
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I'm not going to say the 700 is the lightest 700 out there.
It has some weight to it.

Every machine has it's high and low points. What matters to you will help you decide the right machine.

For the first 20-30 flights I didn't like the heavier feel of the 700. When you hit hold is will immediately drop a bit then come in. Large amounts of neg pitch isn't needed.

To help make my landings better I setup for 14 degrees pitch , this way I can give it a good poke at the end of an auto to get a gentle landing.

250 or so flights later I got the landings down pat.

Completely different feel than a logo 600 , being very light , it hardly drops with hold , needs more neg pitch to get it to come down , setdowns at end of auto effortless.

One really nice thing about the 700 is that it tracks so well and seems to co-operate with you masking minor errors so well with gentle smooth inputs.
But with sharper and larger inputs she perks right up and moves.

I won't be selling mine , couldn't imagine not having it.
Sure I'd like it a bit lighter (ideal situation is a good set of 730-40mm blades on 14s) but what it does , it does very well and is a great fit for me.

700XX
4530-450 on 14s4400 65c
14 pitch / 8 cyclic
edge 713 / 105
2050 rpm

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Old 12-24-2015, 12:33 PM   #75 (permalink)
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What r u talking about the 700 extreme didnt perform well as others best 700 ive ever had and ive had them all. In fact it was even lighter than some and the punch was incredible on mine scary power at times. I wish i still had mine
I've owned them all as well. I don't think your experience is as all encompassing as you'd like to think.
You really aren't paying attention if you think it's just as powerful as the rest. The exact same power setup in a goblin 700 gave at least 30% more perceived collective power and 30% more flight time. Of course the goblins tail sucked in comparison, so not all roses there.
I had pulled the xx700 apart several times to make sure I had no binding anywhere, but folks I know with the xx eventually all arrived at the same conclusion of it being a tragically inefficient drivetrain. Most of them fly the 690sx now, and prefer it.

It was a great heli as far as it's flight characteristics go.
The depressing part was the 3 minute flight times due to the massive amounts of rotating mass and drag from the dual stage tail drive. Hell, just look at the head, it's rediculous.
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Old 12-24-2015, 12:41 PM   #76 (permalink)
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Let's hope you're just a little bit happier with the new 700
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Old 12-24-2015, 02:17 PM   #77 (permalink)
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I never flew the 700. What is wrong with the head, please?
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Old 12-24-2015, 03:36 PM   #78 (permalink)
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There is nothing wrong with the Xxtreme 700 head.

Sure it may get 3 minutes flight time, but, I am sure an M1 Abrahams tank does not get great fuel efficiency either.

When I first laid my eyes on the Xxtreme 700, I thought, this is a beast, industrial German engineering.

When I was thinking about getting an Xxtreme 700, I was thinking, I am not buying a Toyota Prius, I am buying an M1 Abrahams tank.

After the very first time I hovered it, if I smoked, I would have needed a cigarette.
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Old 12-24-2015, 08:27 PM   #79 (permalink)
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There's nothing really "wrong" with the head. It's just overbuilt.

Nathan, I, and several others had many conversations even before the 700XX came out.

We were all hoping for a Logo 700 that flew (and felt in the air) very similar to the legendary Logo 600 that's been around for some time. Instead, it was quite different.

The issues were that it (primarily the head & tail) was slightly over-built and as a result, required 14s 5000mAh packs and blades longer than 700mm to have that same Mikado Logo 600 feel. At the time, no one even had a blade length that felt great.

(What blade's were we talking guys... I think it was 715-720ish on 12s 5000's would be perfect. I forget).


The thinking at the time was apparently to build a bulletproof drive-train & tail (which they did) but it came at the expense of weight. A drive-train that would handle the even more powerful motors & batteries that were expected to be available in the next few years.

The other issue was that we all had hoped for a new, traditional plastic/polymer frame similar to the 500/600 series, but alas, it ended up being a CF frame.

Then of course, there were the XXtremely short flights. Sure 3 minutes is ok for some but most want 4-5.

Many of us scrapped the idea of buying a Logo 700 in the hopes that someday they would revise that model. That day has (almost) come... We've been waiting several years now.

For those of you that have (or have flown) a Logo 500 or 600, you know the Logo feeling. For those that haven't, you have no idea what you're in for if you ever do.

Merry Christmas!
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Last edited by 3D Dave; 12-28-2015 at 11:46 PM..
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Old 12-25-2015, 03:46 AM   #80 (permalink)
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Quote:
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I had pulled the xx700 apart several times to make sure I had no binding anywhere, but folks I know with the xx eventually all arrived at the same conclusion of it being a tragically inefficient drivetrain. Most of them fly the 690sx now, and prefer it.

It was a great heli as far as it's flight characteristics go.
The depressing part was the 3 minute flight times due to the massive amounts of rotating mass and drag from the dual stage tail drive. Hell, just look at the head, it's rediculous.
1/ Can you explain how you calculated "inefficiency" of a drivetrain ? Maybe a little more drag but nothing compares to the rock solid tail of the XXtreme...
2/ How did you manage to drain the battery in 3 minutes ? Are you flying top level ( Kyle dahl, Jesse Kavros, ... ) or did you use +2050 rpm ?
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