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Old 02-20-2016, 07:55 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Spartan and Jeti setup guide

Hi folks,

If anybody here is interested in Jeti radios, I've written up a quick guide to getting started with Jeti and Spartan.

It answers most of the questions I had when I started looking at Jeti, so I hope it'll be useful.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwY...ew?usp=sharing

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Old 02-20-2016, 08:23 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Great job....thanks for your effort! I've had a Jeti DS-16 since 2014 but so far have only used it on fixed wing. It's a very flexible and feature rich radio but at least for me, not very intuitive when it comes to figuring out even some very basic functions. I've contemplated moving my helis over to Jeti but have resisted because of the programming complexity. Your guide makes the transition much easier for those of us not raised on ones and zeros.

Mike
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Old 02-20-2016, 08:47 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MKMAERO View Post
Great job....thanks for your effort! I've had a Jeti DS-16 since 2014 but so far have only used it on fixed wing. It's a very flexible and feature rich radio but at least for me, not very intuitive when it comes to figuring out even some very basic functions. I've contemplated moving my helis over to Jeti but have resisted because of the programming complexity. Your guide makes the transition much easier for those of us not raised on ones and zeros.

Mike
Yeah, I'm the same. In many ways the Jeti is extremely intuitive to use, I'm loving the audio confirmations of flight modes, and on screen details. For flying it's great, you know exactly how everything is set.

But for the programming, it seems you often need to know about two or three different screens, all doing similar things, in order to get it all working together. Even though I wrote the guide, I'm probably going to be referring back to it if I ever need to do setup again lol.

It does work great with the Vortex though, and once you have a single model setup you just copy that for the next. So much of the tuning is in the Vortex it makes that really easy.
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Old 02-20-2016, 09:13 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Nice work!
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Old 02-21-2016, 07:29 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Great work!

Just one question. If I get a DS-16 do I need to download any software or is it all included?
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Old 02-21-2016, 08:00 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Great work!

Just one question. If I get a DS-16 do I need to download any software or is it all included?
You'll likely need to download the Spartan .bin file that is on the support pages at spartan-rc.com. It's very simple, just copy the .bin file and paste in the "devices" folder.
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Old 02-21-2016, 10:27 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Yup, you just need to copy one file to the Jeti and ensure its running v4 firmware. All the Jeti software features like extra flight modes, etc are included as standard with everything bar the DS-14.
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Old 02-23-2016, 07:31 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Myx,

Thanks for taking the time to write up this guide

I know that if or when I go Jeti, I'll be using your guide to get me started before I start to delve deeper into the menus to explore all the functions the Jeti DS transmitters are capable of.

MB
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Old 02-28-2016, 02:27 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Hey everybody. I realised this weekend that I missed a step in this guide. When setting up your timers, don't forget to set the "Report type". If you don't assign a beep here, you won't hear anything when your timer runs out.
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Old 02-28-2016, 08:42 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Just set everything up for the first time using the Spartan Studio in combination with some parts of your guide.

I'm still a little confused about the governor and this Vcurve stuff, but perhaps it will make sense when I try it out at the field. looking forward to the maiden.
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Old 02-29-2016, 01:13 AM   #11 (permalink)
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I don't touch the vcurves on the Vortex, and just set those on my radio. For the maiden flight I disable the governor and set the curves on my radio.

Have you seen my other setup and governor guides?

My setup guide:
https://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=715148

My gov guide:
https://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=723039
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Old 02-29-2016, 07:09 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Yes, I have printed both out, and that's what I used for setup and what I will use for tuning at the field.

Despite the rationale presented there, both my Ikon and Vbar governors were excellent, and all it required as typing in the ratio/polecount/desired rpm. It seems like a big step backwards to setup a v curve, then spend several flights playing with a tachometer, only to turn the governor back on.

Even back when I was flying un-governed, fly-barred helis I used a flat throttle curve.
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Old 02-29-2016, 11:43 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fauropitotto View Post
Even back when I was flying un-governed, fly-barred helis I used a flat throttle curve.
Have you ever wondered why the TX manufacturers gave us a curve when a single value (flat line) would suffice?
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Old 02-29-2016, 12:25 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Sure, but at the time, I didn't like how those "curves" felt. With modern governors on both ESCs and FBLs, most of them no longer require curves, and expect to see a single flat throttle output to control the target RPM of the governor.

I have no way of measuring the RPM at either full positive, or full negative pitch, so it seems a bit arbitrary to simply set it at 90. Mid-stick (or hover), I can understand to set RPM since I can hover over my phone while using the acoustic headspeed app to set this.

I'm sure it works fine, and I get that adjusting a pre-existing curve probably makes it easier for the software to stick to the set RPM. Just an odd way of doing things. Would have preferred to just type in a number and just expect the unit modulate throttle to match.

I'll give it a go this weekend. The plan is to follow myxiplx's guide to set the v-curve, then tune the tail (if needed), then turn governors on and see what happens.
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Old 02-29-2016, 03:17 PM   #15 (permalink)
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To be honest, the governor will probably work as well as most others without a V curve. There are a lot of people out there who love the Vortex gov and haven't spent any time at all tuning it.

In fact I don't even have a way myself to tach it at full pitch. I just guess by ear :-)

It doesn't need to be anywhere near perfect, the governor is plenty good enough. But when you have the ability to help smooth out the governor response (and hence help the tail), I figure it's well worth those few extra minutes of fiddling to setup some kind of v-curve :-)
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Old 03-01-2016, 06:55 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fauropitotto View Post
Sure, but at the time, I didn't like how those "curves" felt. With modern governors on both ESCs and FBLs, most of them no longer require curves, and expect to see a single flat throttle output to control the target RPM of the governor.

I have no way of measuring the RPM at either full positive, or full negative pitch, so it seems a bit arbitrary to simply set it at 90. Mid-stick (or hover), I can understand to set RPM since I can hover over my phone while using the acoustic headspeed app to set this.

I'm sure it works fine, and I get that adjusting a pre-existing curve probably makes it easier for the software to stick to the set RPM. Just an odd way of doing things. Would have preferred to just type in a number and just expect the unit modulate throttle to match.

I'll give it a go this weekend. The plan is to follow myxiplx's guide to set the v-curve, then tune the tail (if needed), then turn governors on and see what happens.
The flat line is just an ugly botch to set RPM from the transmitter. It started with ESC manufacturers when they introduced heli governor and didn't have spare input to select RPM and continued on to some FBL systems.

It will probably take you a while to digest the mechanism used in the Vortex. Not just how information flows but what it can do for you on day to day basis. Just an example... if you wanted investigate a problem with the tail turning the gov off is just parameter and you are ready to fly without governor.

The curves don't need to be accurate, this is mentioned in the user guide. Most helis follow a similar "recipe" for the power system design and a rough 100-60-100% or 90-50-90% for overpowered setups will suffice.

BTW, live RPM is displayed in the Home menu of the Vortex-Jeti integration.
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Old 03-02-2016, 05:54 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Alright, I couldn't hold back any longer. Finished work early, then hit the field for my first maiden with the vortex.

Words cannot describe how awesome it was to be able to tune directly on the radio! It was great!

Of course, this will be something to get used to, trying to get it to feel the way I want is always a challenge for me.

The governor seems to handle what I've been throwing at it just fine.

One question though, I tried the normal speed run stuff that I typically do, and I had the most violent and immediate RBS/pitch up event I've ever seen. Damn near shat my pants. Same collective/cyclic pitch/CG as the ikon. Head gain around 30, head speed 2150, 690mm blades. Pitch up compensation 100%. What should I change to help with this?
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Old 03-03-2016, 12:53 AM   #18 (permalink)
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There are a few things that are worth a try. For speed runs on any FBL you would typically want to drop the main rotor gain down a bit, so it's possible your gain is just a little too high.

If you regularly try speed runs also look at increasing the style setting which will keep the helicopter locked into its orientation more strongly, in fact setting the style to 100 with v4 firmware activates "speed mode" where the vortex will do its best to totally lock in a position.

The speed mode shouldn't be used for takeoff & landing though as the changes mean an increased risk of tipovers on the ground.

I've also seen a few people mention that after completing setup, if they check their pitch on the bench they see maximum pitch the Vortex will use is actually a little higher than it was in setup. So it's possible the Vortex is running a little more pitch in flight than your Ikon was, and that could be running into RBS. If the style and gain settings don't fix this, I would try lowering your collective pitch a little.
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Old 03-03-2016, 05:34 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by myxiplx View Post
There are a few things that are worth a try. For speed runs on any FBL you would typically want to drop the main rotor gain down a bit, so it's possible your gain is just a little too high.
Actually for speed runs you need the highest gain you can get away with. This allows the system to track better. However as the speed increases you may see oscillations if the gain is too high for such conditions. Most FBL systems will need the rotor gain to be lowered but the Vortex seems to cope well with the default gain and possibly higher depending on the heli.

If someone is serious about speed runs they need to tune the heli to perfection. Probably do a series of incremental speed runs and if you see oscillations appearing tune the gain down a click.
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Old 03-04-2016, 11:28 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Updated the doc with a few little tweaks based on feedback, and added some change notes on the last page.

Version 1.2 is uploading now, should be available in the next hour or so (I have very bad internet access here lol).
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At the field: Protos 380 (Brain) | Gaui X3 (360mm + 380mm) - VX1e | Trex 600N VX1e
TX + Sims: Jeti DS14 and Realflight (Wireless)
And now a Lynx Team Pilot :-D
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