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nano CP X Brushless Mods Blade nano CP X Brushless Mods Information and Help


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Old 04-21-2017, 12:27 PM   #81 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by CraigHB View Post
Really I should have rewound that HP05S motor to 16500kV
If you rewound the motor, how would you have done. turns, wire & delta? I have HP05 and want to change the shaft and rewind it. It was having hard time to start, but I found out one of wires was cut. I soldered it and seems ok now. But I want to rewind it to higher kv. Any suggestion?

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On my 2S mCPX I had to rewind both motors, the main for 8000Kv and the tail for 6000Kv.
What was the tail motor for this setup?

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Not sure if you're aware, but there's an easy check you can do to measure resulting Kv on your winds. Just spin the motor with a Dremel tool using a known RPM. Then measure AC voltage on one of the phases. There's a chart here to plug in the numbers; http://www.bavaria-direct.co.za/constants/
I have heard that. But haven't tried it. I will get tacho soon. I am quite new to rewinding and spin 13500kv motor was second motor I rewound. I contacted to oversky and they confirmed turns and wire thickness. So I am pretty sure it would work. Now more I rewind I need measuring tool to compare each rewinding.
I bought small brushless motor with 4000kv for $5. size is similar to trex 150 motor. I want to rewind it to higher kv and build another mcpx bl for just fun.
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Old 04-21-2017, 12:36 PM   #82 (permalink)
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That is awesome!
Yeah I'm pretty happy with it. Works really well with BLHeli. The trick was to use the SiLabs MCU version instead of the AVR MCU version. The Silabs MCUs are faster and work the best with BLheli. The 2S version uses the same switches and also runs the XP-3A firmware version. Though it has more components because it's 2S, need things like voltage dividers on sensing and regulators for the MCUs.

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What was weight of esc for 2s mcpx? Also what was weight of esc for 1s setup?
I never actually measured, but based on size my 1S version is somewhat heavier than two XP-3A ESCs and lighter than an XP-3A plus an XP-7A. On my 2S version it's lighter than the two ESCs required to handle 2S voltage. I've actually done a couple different 2S versions, one with an on-board sBEC and another with a separate sBEC. I went from the Blade 3-in-1 board to a uBrain and redid the ESC configuration to use a separate BEC for the uBrain.

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How was your the 2s mcpx's tail with homebrew esc?
Initially I tried the tail motor on the mCPX at 4000Kv and it was not powerful enough. Now I'm running 6000Kv on the tail and it has plenty of power. That heli runs 125mm blades at 5600 rpm head speed. It has an HP08S main and HP03T tail motor. It really moves out and the tail is solid.

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Can you write the tutorial how to make it?
Don't know if I can take the time to do that, but the main thing is having the skill to solder small surface mount components. I've been an electronics hobbyist since I was a kid so that kind of assembly is routine for me, but it does take some practice and skill to get there. It's more about the equipment you use than actual soldering skill. If you're interested PM me and I'll provide a schematic and board layout.
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Old 04-21-2017, 01:00 PM   #83 (permalink)
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If you rewound the motor, how would you have done. turns, wire & delta? Any suggestion?
There's no performance difference between delta and wye winding configurations. It's just a physical difference assuming copper fill is equivalent. Wye can get you lower Kv with less turns by a factor of about 1.8. It's actually root three on paper, but in reality it works out to about 1.8. So depending on motor layout wye can be better for small motors since it can be hard to get enough turns with Delta to get the Kv you want. I've done all of my small motors in a wye configuration because of the lower number of turns required. On the bigger motors I tend toward delta since it's easier to get a good copper fill. Most of the bigger motors you buy off the shelf are wound delta. The small Oversky motors can be delta or wye out of the box. The Oversky tail motors are all wound wye. The smaller main Oversky motors tend to be wye and the bigger ones delta.
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Old 04-22-2017, 08:07 AM   #84 (permalink)
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Yeah I'm pretty happy with it. Works really well with BLHeli. The trick was to use the SiLabs MCU version instead of the AVR MCU version. The Silabs MCUs are faster and work the best with BLheli. The 2S version uses the same switches and also runs the XP-3A firmware version. Though it has more components because it's 2S, need things like voltage dividers on sensing and regulators for the MCUs.
You are brilliant!

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... another with a separate sBEC. I went from the Blade 3-in-1 board to a uBrain and redid the ESC configuration to use a separate BEC for the uBrain...
Can you make very light separate sBEC that supplies 4.2v? uBrain for mCPX? how did you mount it? isn't it too heavy? how do you like uBrain? I have heard uBrain on 130x, but not on mcpx. what is input voltage for uBrain? sorry, so many questions.

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...It has an HP08S main and HP03T tail motor. It really moves out and the tail is solid.
this build must have tremendous power with hp08S.

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Don't know if I can take the time to do that, but the main thing is having the skill to solder small surface mount components. I've been an electronics hobbyist since I was a kid so that kind of assembly is routine for me, but it does take some practice and skill to get there. It's more about the equipment you use than actual soldering skill. If you're interested PM me and I'll provide a schematic and board layout.
I have done many tricky soldering on small boards. But I think my skill and equipment is also not good enough to make an esc. Thank you! If I ever decide to do it, I will reach out to you.
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Old 04-23-2017, 07:45 AM   #85 (permalink)
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Can you make very light separate sBEC that supplies 4.2v? uBrain for mCPX?
When I was using the mCPX V2 board, the BEC was layed out on the ESC board. It put out 4V for the V2 controller board. When I switched to the uBrain, I moved the BEC off the ESC and changed the output voltage to 5V, otherwise it uses the same components. It's always better when the BEC does not live on the same board as the ESC since it mitigates electrical noise. I was more concerned with clean power for the uBrain.

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isn't it too heavy?
The BEC did gain a slight bit of weight being on it's own board, but it's quite small and weighs barely a gram. It has a 3A capacity, but the components are small and fit on a tiny board. The mCPX I put together is not as sensitive to weight since it's running 125mm blades.

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How did you mount it?
Picture worth a thousand words, I'll attach a shot of it. It's under the battery tray mounted with 30lb tape.

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How do you like uBrain? I have heard uBrain on 130x, but not on mcpx.
Happy with it, flies great and is easy to set up. The thing flew perfect on the maiden without touching a thing. The only thing I did was increase the tail pre-comp to reduce tail kick with the motored tail. I guessed on the tail gain and it just happened to be right. The default cyclic gains were perfect once blade configuration and size is set in the configuration. I was almost shocked with how well it flew right out of the gate.

There was the issue of driving the tail ESC with an output designed for a tail servo, but I shifted the signal range in the BLHeli software to make the tail ESC act like a servo and it works perfect. That was a guess and it payed out.

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what is input voltage for uBrain?
4.7 to 8.4 Volts. I wasn't sure on the linear servos, but after inspection they do have regulators on-board so no problem. My guess based on the regulators on-board would be 5.5V absolute maximum for the servos.

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this build must have tremendous power with hp08S.
Yes it does. 82g all up, 5600 rpm head speed governed, 125mm blades, no bog. It has some serious punch.

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sorry, so many questions.
Hehe, no problem. It's always fun to talk about this stuff.
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Old 04-23-2017, 07:49 AM   #86 (permalink)
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Oxy 2 FE x 2, 180cfx full Rakon uBrain v2 BA-8-1 cyclic H0988UHS tail, 180cfx spartan lynx pro tail, 130 full rotary bx, 130 Xtreme build, 130x stock, nano cpx dbl bl, nano cpx wild bl, DX8, Phoenix sim for practice. For fpv Phantom 3 pro.
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Old 04-23-2017, 01:52 PM   #87 (permalink)
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Picture worth a thousand words, I'll attach a shot of it. It's under the battery tray mounted with 30lb tape.
This is insane! Looks awesome. Great work! The picture told me that hey! uBrain will work on trex 150 too.
Now I want to build trex 150 with uBrain. I have almost everything to build trex 150. I may need one more servo & custom tail motor mount and rewind lynx 130x motor for trex 150. Even I Have a board. But i will build it with uBrain. By the way, why does this board have 2 names, uBrain & iKon?

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There was the issue of driving the tail ESC with an output designed for a tail servo, but I shifted the signal range in the BLHeli software to make the tail ESC act like a servo and it works perfect. That was a guess and it payed out.
I will need your help here to setup tail motor for the controller. Did you update blheli file for youe esc? How did you shift the signal range in the blheli? Is it hard to do it? Can you help me on the xp7a tail blheli file? Because I want to use trex 150 dual brushless esc for the project. Here is again so many questions . Was your bird's tail holding well with uBrain?

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Originally Posted by CraigHB View Post
Hehe, no problem. It's always fun to talk about this stuff.
Thank you very much for your input here. Inputs are diverted from main topic now, but it shifted to very interesting topic. Hope someone else find this thread helpful for their journey in this wonderful hobby.
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Old 04-24-2017, 11:28 AM   #88 (permalink)
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By the way, why does this board have 2 names, uBrain & iKon?
For whatever reason the board sells under two different names, Brain2 is from MSH who is the originator and Ikon2 from an authorized reseller, forget who. In any case it's the exact same controller, just a different badge.

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How did you shift the signal range in the blheli? Is it hard to do it?
It's pretty trivial really. You just need to make tail neutral look somewhere around center signal (typically 1520uS), same as a servo. With a motor, signal center would typically be quite a bit of thrust (1/2 throttle) where it would be much less thrust with a servo. So I shifted signal center in the ESC to make it line up right with the controller.

BLHeli in all its handiness allows setting signal endpoints for the ESC in software. In my case I set endpoints for the ESC to 1420uS,1940uS where it's set to 1060uS,1980uS in the controller. That way at signal center of 1520uS, there's the correct thrust coming out of the motor (1/5 throttle) to put the tail at neutral. Same thing you would normally do with a servo, that is set it so center signal is tail neutral.

You might ask about the dead zone between 1060uS and 1420uS, but the motor can't reverse so that has to be a dead zone. In that range only the torque of the rotor can provide a negative tail rate. That was what I was concerned about, but it doesn't seem to bother the controller and it works fine. The controller also offers a setting to compensate for tail assymmetry. I guessed on that setting and it seems to be close enough, the tail rates seem to be fairly even in both directions.

Quote:
Did you update blheli file for youe esc?
I just used the normal Tail firmware version for the XP-3A with BLHeli so no customizing was required other than setting endpoints in the normal BLHeli configuration software. I designed the ESC around the firmware rather than hacking the firmware to conform to the ESC.

Oh, one other thing I just thought of, it might be possible to use the multi-rotor firmware version of BLHeli which can reverse the motor. It would eliminate the dead zone, but still need tail neutral at signal center like a servo. It would provide the ability to put negative thrust on the tail same as a servo. Might work better, but what I've done works well enough and I'm probably not going mess with it.

Last edited by Krager; 04-24-2017 at 12:43 PM..
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Old 04-24-2017, 11:00 PM   #89 (permalink)
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Thank you for the info. I will give it try. I have never changed esc signal range in blheli software. I will play with it to see how it will affect performance.

To turn tail to counter clockwise tail motor speed needs to slow down. If motor stops or turn opposite direction, tail will spin quickly. So i think reversing motor with blheli may not be necessary. I may be wrong.

What did you notice in flight with ubrain compared to stock board? More stable? Pretty sure it has piro compensation, when mcpx doesn't. How you feel it?

How well does rescue function work on ubrain? Have you tried it? Does the controller have baro?


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Old 04-26-2017, 03:18 PM   #90 (permalink)
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What did you notice in flight with ubrain compared to stock board? More stable? Pretty sure it has piro compensation, when mcpx doesn't. How you feel it?
Pretty much night and day. Blade is not known for excellence in flight controllers. The cyclic is more stable and locked in. Feels more in control and tracks better.

The tail is hugely better with much less kick and no drift. Had a lot of trouble with that before. The tail would kick to a new position on a heavy pitch input and then stay there. It could also drift a little staying on one heading for any length of time. Can't get rid of tail kick a hundred percent due to the lag of a motor, but the tail quickly returns to the heading it was on. Now tail kick is just a little blip, nothing to get dismayed about. Of course it's always nice to have piro-comp. Nice it stays flat in a piro now.
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Old 05-06-2017, 10:03 PM   #91 (permalink)
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Installed trex 150 board on my nano cpx. Made my nano double brushless 2s nano with trex 150 board. used AEO 3.2 gr motor for tail. I think motor is too fast for the tail. May need to rewind to lower the kv. Make it aroung 7000-8000kv. It is more than 10k now.

It flies really well. It is around 47gr now. Need to make ligher board mount. One i made is 1.4gr. Thinking to use balsa to make ultra light mount. It may not be strong enough. But if I don't crash, it should work.
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