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Old 04-14-2017, 09:44 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Factory crimp tools for servo connectors(formerly Quality vs budget servo crimp pins)

EDIT what was supposed to be a thread about servo crimp terminal quality has drifted into a discussion about factory crimping tools for servo terminals so I changed the title of the thread to reflect this.

Got these off Ebay from microcontrollershop_com, they cost $3.20 for 100 pieces with free shipping.



These are from Hansen Hobbies, they cost $7.14 + shipping for 100 pieces.



Now to be fair the cheap ones work fine with 28 AWG wire, but with heavier gauge wire the insulation crimp wings are too short to fully "hug" wire jacket. In addition the conductor crimp doesn't form the bellmouth on the wire side as it should. Note also that I'm using the official factory hand tool for these pins (DuPont HT-0095), with a "double D" crimper the results with the cheap pins might be much worse.

This is the inexpensive 22AWG wire I got from Aloft Hobbies vs the Hansen Hobbies "deluxe" wire. In this case the difference isn't as extreme. The Hansen Hobbies is $4.25 for 10 feet and the Aloft hobbies wire is 75 cents per yard.



The copper wire on the right is the Hansen Hobbies and the tin plated copper on the left is the Aloft Hobbies. Both are 22AWG. The Aloft Hobbies wire has a slightly smaller conductor core and wire jacket and the insulation seems slightly stiffer. I think it's probably better than the Hansen "budget" wire and imo is perfectly acceptable (especially at the price). That said I still prefer the Hansen deluxe wire.
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Old 04-14-2017, 10:11 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Very nice but I dont think I could switch from hansen hobbies deluxe wire! That wire is great! But it is nice to know there are other decent options out there. Thanks atomic!
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Old 04-15-2017, 02:35 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Ebay terminal (cheap) on the left crimped onto 28AWG wire, works much better than it did with the 22AWG. For comparison on the right (yellow wire) is a commercially crimped terminal. the HT-0095 does a much better job with the conductor crimp than whatever crimp die they used for this. Most of the leads made in china are like this.



There are a few other similar terminals that are made for a double D crimp die but those will have square insulation crimp wings that are folded over to bite into the insulation jacket rather than the triangular ones that wrap around to "hug" the wire. I've been seeing these more on servo leads lately (Futaba leads use them now as do KST and a bunch of others)

99% of the time when you buy "servo plugs" though they will be off brand copies of Mini-PV terminals and housings (they were originally made by DuPont then sold to Berg Electric and finally to FCI Amphenol) Even the Hansen Hobbies ones are copies. They are not designed to be crimped with a double D crimp die, if you look at the HT-0095 you will see that the die is cylindrical.
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Old 04-15-2017, 10:17 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Great information, very helpful, thanks for sharing.
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Old 04-15-2017, 02:11 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Holly hell, $700 to $1,200 on that crimp tool??!??!?

Atomic, any suggestions on a good quality crimp tool that isn't the cost of an airframe?
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Old 04-15-2017, 04:39 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbaum81 View Post
Holly hell, $700 to $1,200 on that crimp tool??!??!?

Atomic, any suggestions on a good quality crimp tool that isn't the cost of an airframe?
I would suggest getting the Maxx Products pins they are actually designed for a double D crimp die, the design is slightly different that the commonly available Mini PV pins but they are fully compatible with 0.1 pin headers.

http://www.maxxprod.com/mpi/mpi-4.html

If you look at their instructional PDF you will see that they have square insulation crimp wings instead of triangular ones.

http://maxxprod.com/pdf/Connector%20...ep-by-Step.pdf

I suspect that these are JST RE terminals, I've never been able to find a source for them in small amounts they can only be purchased in huge lots that cost hundreds of dollars.


Old HT-0095 crimpers often show up on ebay for less than $100, I got mine for $40 last year. You just have to be sure that it works and is actually an HT-0095. The same ratchet handle was apparently used for several different tools and sometimes ebay sellers mislabel a similar looking tool as an HT-0095.

Here are some closeups of mine:









Judging by the fact that it's a DuPont tool and the serial number this one probably dates from the 70's Some will have Berg branding instead. DuPont originally owned this connector type then it was sold to Berg Electric and finally to FCI Amphenol.

This tool will only crimp female pins, until recently the male pin was never part of the official standard though FCI Amphenol finally started making "official" male terminals and a tool for them. Supposedly you can modify the pin loading mechanism with a single pin housing to convert it to crimp male pins though. (the mechanism normally contains a male pin that the female terminal plugs onto which holds it in position in the tool)

I never knew any of this stuff till I found this page, it goes over the several different official tools that exist for this type of pin.

http://tech.mattmillman.com/info/cri...ectors/#minipv
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Old 04-15-2017, 04:43 PM   #7 (permalink)
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I've had okay results with long-nose pliers, but it's a fiddle.

Almost bought a HobbyKing crimp tool a while back but it wasn't in stock. Appeared to have good reviews though.
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Old 04-15-2017, 05:00 PM   #8 (permalink)
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I have yet to see a negative of having the triangle tabs "bite" the wire insulation vs "hug" the insulation.

Has anyone documented a failure (wire pull out) from a double d crimped Hansen connector?
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Old 04-15-2017, 05:37 PM   #9 (permalink)
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There has to be more crimps out there bc my new to me jr sls01 wide voltage have ones similar to the Hansen ones but they have twice the length of contact area though. I believe they are a JST Japan slider less terminal company
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Old 04-16-2017, 12:16 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Atomic Skull View Post
I never knew any of this stuff till I found this page, it goes over the several different official tools that exist for this type of pin.

http://tech.mattmillman.com/info/cri...ectors/#minipv
Thanks for the pics. After your mention of the authentic tool I searched for it and also found Matt's site. One thing that I read there was the proper crimper won't do female double D's properly and male's at all. Glad there's a way for male connectors now but sounds like you can't go authentic without a far bit of work sourcing correct connectors, etc.
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Old 04-16-2017, 01:26 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flint723 View Post
I have yet to see a negative of having the triangle tabs "bite" the wire insulation vs "hug" the insulation.

Has anyone documented a failure (wire pull out) from a double d crimped Hansen connector?
Yes I found I could easily yank the wire out of the terminal with pliers on terminals crimped on a generic double D die including most commercial leads where on terminals crimped with the HT-0095 the wire will break first.
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Old 04-16-2017, 01:34 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JEEPWORLD2002 View Post
There has to be more crimps out there bc my new to me jr sls01 wide voltage have ones similar to the Hansen ones but they have twice the length of contact area though. I believe they are a JST Japan slider less terminal company
Yeah there are some different 0.1 connector families that are used commercially on servo leads that are actually designed to work with a double D crimp die. However none of these are available in small amounts to hobbyists and you have to buy a huge spool of them.

You could use 2.54mm Molex SL for servo leads if you wanted, the terminal would work and they have a three position non latching housing. However you can use these only with the Molex housings because of how the catch on the terminal works (it's like a JST-RCY with a catch on the terminal and a passive housing) Supposedly they crimp well with the PA-09 hand tool.

I think it's simpler to just track down an old used HT-0095 or HT-208 on ebay or wherever though, they show up regularly for under $100. They've been around for decades so there are a lot of old units floating around in surplus out there. Sometimes someone will try to sell them for more but they rarely sell at that price.

Also look for HT-95, HT-100 or HT-0100, they are all the same thing. The HT-208 is a smaller tool designed for 22-26 AWG only but is smaller and less clunky (the HT-213 is the same thing for 28-32AWG wire)


EDIT: I just found out that the "cheap" terminals I got from Ebay are that way by design, FCI Amphenol has "Small insulation PV" terminals with smaller insulation crimps and these are obviously copied from those. The genuine terminals also come in high/medium/low hold strengths.

Last edited by Atomic Skull; 04-16-2017 at 01:51 AM..
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Old 04-16-2017, 01:55 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raptorapture View Post
Thanks for the pics. After your mention of the authentic tool I searched for it and also found Matt's site. One thing that I read there was the proper crimper won't do female double D's properly and male's at all. Glad there's a way for male connectors now but sounds like you can't go authentic without a far bit of work sourcing correct connectors, etc.
Supposedly modding the tool for male pins is relatively simple though I haven't really looked into it because my only interest in crimping is in making female/female jumpers and replacing female plugs on servo leads. If I needed to extend a servo lead I'd just solder it straight onto the existing servo wire or just solder a new longer lead into the servo. It involves replacing the pin that holds the female terminal in the tool with a single position male housing (this part is replaceable, the whole tool is designed to be taken apart and serviced)
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Old 04-16-2017, 03:49 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Harwin makes a version of these terminals they call them M20 connectors.

http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/pcb-co...tacts/6812878/

They have their own crimp tool for them too:

http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/products/7173666/

I wish they'd switch to something like this for RC electronics though, maybe somthing with a 1.5mm terminal and 2.5mm spacing.



[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dsKq_5ZyhWs"]Harwin Datamate - Crimping & Assembly Guide - YouTube[/ame]

Can't happen though because the market is too invested in the DuPont style connectors.
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Old 04-16-2017, 12:10 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Default Quality vs budget servo crimp pins and wire.

i can see trying to save $2000 on a new car purchase but trying to save $4 ?

if it really matters, all it takes is one less case of diabetes causing Coke and problem solved.
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Old 04-17-2017, 06:08 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Just made a discovery today, there is an official factory tool for crimping male terminals, the HT-102. I just bought one off Ebay for $50. In addition there is a tool for crimping 18-20 AWG female terminals, the HT-73, used units seem fairly common on Ebay. If you want to replace connectors on HV servos (which often have 20AWG leads) this would be useful to have around.

Last edited by Atomic Skull; 04-17-2017 at 07:29 AM..
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Old 04-17-2017, 09:38 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Atomic is our crimp master. I agree that the ancient 1980 or so servo pins should be replaced by something like these: "Harwin makes a version of these terminals they call them M20 connectors."

As I have stated previously, hobby crimps from the manufacturers are crap in recent times. Probably jobbing out to sweat shops with the wrong tool.

Barrel crimps as above over tinned wire have the resistance of a soldered connection (even 40 years later) - about 1 milliohm. I have measured Futaba crimps with up to 1 volts drop at 2.5 Amps - about 400 milliohms for two mated pins. Admittedly the worst yet but I threw away a handful that were over 100 milliohms. Voltage telemetry got me started on this testing. Bad crimps are crashing people - brownout.
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Old 04-17-2017, 01:51 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Default Crimpers

I've had these crimpers for a while.


The crimps look OK and make a double D for both the conductor and the insulation.


But upon destructive testing they pull out far too easily and there is no adjustment on the crimpers that I see.

So I guess It is back to the Hansen crimpers for me. I'd like to find some HT 0095 crimpers.
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Old 04-18-2017, 10:00 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Just ordered a used Ht-0095 crimper.


Any tips on how to adjust or calibrate the thing?
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Old 04-18-2017, 06:24 PM   #20 (permalink)
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As stated on Matt's thread, there is an alternative to the HT-0095. The HT-208a tool does the same job, and is designed to work with 22 - 26 AWG wire. It also has a release mechanism for the ratchet, which the HT-0095 does not have.

http://69.16.194.131/prod/MTE0NTk3ND...A-HT-208A-eBay

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