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Old 04-21-2018, 12:25 AM   #21 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Corvette & Copter Guy View Post
Since Gunny brought it up....we have a very large population of bald eagles in my area. Almost take them for granted as I see them daily. Wonder what Amazon would say about killing one....hmmm.
I don't know, but I know it'd be the end of their access to the airspace.

Here's a thought... someone start a rumor that the saw a test unit delivery drone nearly clip (insert endangered bird species here) and email that to P.I.T.A.

Start phoning pita raising that concern. Say you "think they were testing that delivery drone thingy... looked like it had an Amazon logo on it. You guys at PITA should really make em prove they can't hurt endangered wildlife."

I bet about 5 phone calls to pita from a nice diverse lot, an they'd be approaching the AMA hat in hand wanting to please share 336.
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Old 04-21-2018, 12:32 AM   #22 (permalink)
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I am down to one Spektrum radio; the DX8 G2. I mainly use it to buddy box with newbies at my field. Although I mainly fly with other radios, I still consider Horizon Hobbies offers the very best customer service in the industry. So if Spektrum ever releases a radio that rivals Jeti or VControl, I would go back to Spektrum due to its superior customer service.
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Old 04-21-2018, 01:16 AM   #23 (permalink)
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All,

I know that in the past I had been very critical of Spektrum. In particular their TX's... This changes now.

The iX12 is a masterpiece. They out did themselves and IMHO made up for the DX20.

They listened! (So now many of the main capabilities of integrated TX and FBL setups can be done right on a Spektrum TX.)

Still missing the "telemetry as a control" portion, so technically I would never buy one for me... but really this is an unbeatable offering from Spektrum.

(And I am now eating my words from a couple years back.)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_c...&v=iCIvvOL3tYw


LOL!

Seriously, I donít think spekky/HH are that bad, in general. I still use my DX8.

That ix12 though is a bit special. I mean, how long to boot?
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Old 04-21-2018, 02:08 AM   #24 (permalink)
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I would not touch any radio system that uses a CYRF6936 for it's radio chip with a ten foot pole.
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Old 04-21-2018, 08:54 AM   #25 (permalink)
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I would not touch any radio system that uses a CYRF6936 for it's radio chip with a ten foot pole.
Most of us don't know anything about that...
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Old 04-21-2018, 09:04 AM   #26 (permalink)
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I would not touch any radio system that uses a CYRF6936 for it's radio chip with a ten foot pole.
Why specifically? I really do want to know, not for arguments sake.
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Old 04-21-2018, 10:03 AM   #27 (permalink)
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Most of us don't know anything about that...
I did a little searching and found this on RCG.

Maybe he's referring to this.

https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/show...6-discontinued
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Old 04-21-2018, 11:00 AM   #28 (permalink)
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I was pretty amazed to see an iX12 runniung the Brain configuration app. The iX12 makes my OpenTX stuff seem dated. Though it sounds like they need a much more powerful processor with a startup time of two minutes. That's a deal breaker for me.

I hope they can work something out for OpenTX integration. I really would like that, but evidently there is some problem with the FrSky protocol. Maybe that Fport will provide a solution for MSH.
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Last edited by Krager; 04-21-2018 at 11:13 AM..
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Old 04-21-2018, 01:29 PM   #29 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Atomic Skull View Post
I would not touch any radio system that uses a CYRF6936 for it's radio chip with a ten foot pole.
Great job confusing everyone. Next time, why not take the time and explain why you wouldn't touch it with a 10 ft pole.
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Old 04-21-2018, 01:37 PM   #30 (permalink)
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I was pretty amazed to see an iX12 runniung the Brain configuration app. The iX12 makes my OpenTX stuff seem dated. Though it sounds like they need a much more powerful processor with a startup time of two minutes. That's a deal breaker for me.

I hope they can work something out for OpenTX integration. I really would like that, but evidently there is some problem with the FrSky protocol. Maybe that Fport will provide a solution for MSH.
Fport is nothing new. It's just Sbus and Smart Port on one connection and with the inversion removed. Unless that's somehow advantageous to MSH due to connection limitations on the Brain unit?
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Old 04-21-2018, 02:01 PM   #31 (permalink)
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The iX12 is a great concept, but the hardware is too low spec, and they haven't yet achieved the full potential of the design.

If they release a high end v2 it could get interesting.
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Old 04-21-2018, 03:48 PM   #32 (permalink)
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I was thinking of the DXE as being the most attractive Spektrum option before this one...

The rest were re-hashes of past glories. And I'll stop there.

The DXE at the time was a real innovation that was extremely poorly executed... but of course, an innovation none the less.

Once I had said that if I made a transmitter, I'd start with a linux single board PC... and build up from there much the way Weatronic did. It becomes a hobby hub.

What they tried to do is pretty dang admirable, even if failed, but guess what.

It's a normal android tablet / TX... so they're an upgrade away from getting it right. And best of all?

They successfully pop head from arse, it's retroactive and fixes ALL of those TXs.

So now the other "pie in the sky" stuff is no longer out of reach, but is instead just an upgrade away.

That's smart. That's innovative. And as a result, I have done forgiven Spektrum.

Would I go from Jeti back? No. Of course not. I can still fly Spektrum (and frisky for that matter) stuff directly from my Jeti, and I can do everything under the sun, up to adjusting my brain2 FBL right from the TX.

I just think it is a noteworthy accomplishment that they created a >$500 TX that, even based on my present RC knowledge, and experiences in the past, I would likely buy or recommend to a more serious RC guy. I always recommended them to beginners, but never to someone more "serious" about RC.

Good job Spectrum! At least, your efforts impressed one of your most brutal critics from the past!
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Old 04-21-2018, 04:20 PM   #33 (permalink)
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so why didn't they put better gimbals and switches in it? I mean if their gonna re hash a tx, why not.. a x9d has better gimbals.
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Old 04-21-2018, 04:39 PM   #34 (permalink)
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Even more off topic, My Avant Mostro is still flying!
Mine too! LOL!!

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Old 04-21-2018, 05:20 PM   #35 (permalink)
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I did a little searching and found this on RCG.

Maybe he's referring to this.

https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/show...6-discontinued
Discontinued so if they are still using it it must be unauthorized chinese knockoffs as the originals are no longer available.

My understanding is that later Cypress radio chips are not compatible with the CYRF6936, unlike the situation with the Texas Instruments cc25xx series (used by Hitec, FrSky, Futaba) where later revisions in the series are backwards compatible with the older chips.

I might be wrong though and Cypress may make a successor to the 6936 that is backwards compatible that I am not aware of. I haven't been able to get a look inside any late model Spektrum receivers.
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Old 04-21-2018, 06:02 PM   #36 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Atomic Skull View Post
I might be wrong though and Cypress may make a successor to the 6936 that is backwards compatible that I am not aware of.
Typically chip makers do not replace an older product line with a new one that's backward compatible. Sometimes new product lines are drop-in replacements, but more often they're not. Usually means a board redesign which is actually not that much of a problem for any electronics maker. Though it does cost them money and can give them some grief in supporting the product.

Any maker does have to ensure they're using OEM chips and not clones or fakes. Though the suppliers they normally use are trusted to make purchases from OEMs. In some cases makers order direct from the chip manufacturer. It does happen once in a while where a production run gets contaminated by fake or clone chips so it can be a concern as a consumer.

In any case I probably would not make an issue of a chip being discontinued as grounds to avoid a product. Happens a lot and makers are used to dealing with it.
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Old 04-21-2018, 08:09 PM   #37 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by CraigHB View Post
Typically chip makers do not replace an older product line with a new one that's backward compatible. Sometimes new product lines are drop-in replacements, but more often they're not. Usually means a board redesign which is actually not that much of a problem for any electronics maker. Though it does cost them money and can give them some grief in supporting the product.

Any maker does have to ensure they're using OEM chips and not clones or fakes. Though the suppliers they normally use are trusted to make purchases from OEMs. In some cases makers order direct from the chip manufacturer. It does happen once in a while where a production run gets contaminated by fake or clone chips so it can be a concern as a consumer.

In any case I probably would not make an issue of a chip being discontinued as grounds to avoid a product. Happens a lot and makers are used to dealing with it.
That's a major problem with radio chips used in proportional radio systems because when you design a system based around a particular radio chip you will eventually run into the problem of the chip being discontinued and when that happens you are stuck. Once the supply dries up you will have to pick a different chip and abandon your current customers. Normally this isn't a problem with things like wireless routers but it's a big problem with hobby radio systems if the newer equipment cannot communicate with older equipment.

That's probably why the TI CC25xx series has been so popular in proportional hobby radios. The later series chips can communicate with the older chips so they can just switch to the latest iteration of the series in new equipment with no compatibility problems between newer and older radios and receivers.

EDIT: Ok I think that perhaps you may have misunderstood what I meant by "compatibility" I don't mean electronic compatibility of the chip I mean compatibility of the carrier signal. Different radio chips are only able to communicate with members of their own family e.g. a CC2500 based radio could not be made to communicate with a CYRF6936 based receiver with software changes. With some exceptions single chip radios aren't very programmable and are designed as a "canned solution" that you drop into your design and not much about the low level signalling is programmable.

One of the exceptions is the Micro Linear ML2724 that Futaba uses in FASST which is very programmable in regards to the low level signalling. However it's not enough to communicate with a C2500 because FASST/S-FHSS compatible radios include both chips.

It is totally possible to get different brand radios that use the same radio chips talking to each other merely though software changes though. That's what FrSky did with the Delta-9 multi protocol receiver, they just updated the firmware in their V8FR-II receiver with new firmware that understands Futaba S-FHSS and Hitec protocols as well as their own ACSST protocol. Their Hitec compatible receivers are the same thing, just stock FrSky receivers with the firmware replaced.

Last edited by Atomic Skull; 04-21-2018 at 08:30 PM..
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Old 04-21-2018, 09:50 PM   #38 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Atomic Skull View Post
That's a major problem with radio chips used in proportional radio systems because when you design a system based around a particular radio chip you will eventually run into the problem of the chip being discontinued and when that happens you are stuck. Once the supply dries up you will have to pick a different chip and abandon your current customers. Normally this isn't a problem with things like wireless routers but it's a big problem with hobby radio systems if the newer equipment cannot communicate with older equipment.

That's probably why the TI CC25xx series has been so popular in proportional hobby radios. The later series chips can communicate with the older chips so they can just switch to the latest iteration of the series in new equipment with no compatibility problems between newer and older radios and receivers.

EDIT: Ok I think that perhaps you may have misunderstood what I meant by "compatibility" I don't mean electronic compatibility of the chip I mean compatibility of the carrier signal. Different radio chips are only able to communicate with members of their own family e.g. a CC2500 based radio could not be made to communicate with a CYRF6936 based receiver with software changes. With some exceptions single chip radios aren't very programmable and are designed as a "canned solution" that you drop into your design and not much about the low level signalling is programmable.

One of the exceptions is the Micro Linear ML2724 that Futaba uses in FASST which is very programmable in regards to the low level signalling. However it's not enough to communicate with a C2500 because FASST/S-FHSS compatible radios include both chips.

It is totally possible to get different brand radios that use the same radio chips talking to each other merely though software changes though. That's what FrSky did with the Delta-9 multi protocol receiver, they just updated the firmware in their V8FR-II receiver with new firmware that understands Futaba S-FHSS and Hitec protocols as well as their own ACSST protocol. Their Hitec compatible receivers are the same thing, just stock FrSky receivers with the firmware replaced.
Probably also why the DEVO 7e can run several other types of radio systems
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Old 04-22-2018, 08:52 AM   #39 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Atomic Skull View Post
That's a major problem with radio chips used in proportional radio systems because when you design a system based around a particular radio chip you will eventually run into the problem of the chip being discontinued and when that happens you are stuck. Once the supply dries up you will have to pick a different chip and abandon your current customers. Normally this isn't a problem with things like wireless routers but it's a big problem with hobby radio systems if the newer equipment cannot communicate with older equipment.
Yes I see the problem. That's really lame of Cypress to just drop a communication protocol like that. Would put the maker in sorry shape. Even so chip manufacturers tend to be pretty flexible for big customers. In most cases they'll make a chip based on whatever specs a volume customer asks for. It's the smaller customers that get screwed.

In any case I'm happy the radio I use is CC2500 based. In general TI makes great stuff. I've used their chips in non-RC stuff I've done and they're consistently high quality and well designed.
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Last edited by Krager; 04-22-2018 at 09:05 AM..
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Old 04-22-2018, 09:43 AM   #40 (permalink)
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Frsky x9d and my Android phone in my pocket is more convenient then the ix12.

If frsky had a phone app version of companion tx, and you Bluetooth to your radio, it'd be the same thing ,yet less complicated.
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