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Electric Motors Winding and Repair Electric Motors Winding and Repair Discussion


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Old 01-12-2020, 12:48 PM   #21 (permalink)
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Default POWER who shot Ghost....?

This is all surely for the pleasure of others using 12 slot 10 pole machines as what I really want to see run in an open world is this asymmetric open end... Maybe Steve can request a SVC firmware from castle for the two water cooled Hydra Ice 2oos. I know APD will.I have also asked Takeo to look at this svc algorithm. He's busy with his many drive projects but say he will in time.I can build the hardware but I need a coder.



You see with this every phase is independent and every lead just goes straight to the drive. Noxzema clean with max current paths to source. This is not for the average enthusiast K.... This is for us.
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Old 01-12-2020, 08:32 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Old 01-13-2020, 04:42 AM   #23 (permalink)
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Both wyes run. The rogowski coil also works great. so now i need to add it the integrator to it.. with a 100 volt generator I could dissipate 1000 watts per phase with this small setup.
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Old 01-14-2020, 10:53 AM   #24 (permalink)
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I want to have variability so I contemplate fets to control this this will will need heat sinks.These are salvage from old car sound amplifiers. That led me back to this. 1 fet dissipating over 1ooo wats by itself in the miller plateau region of the fet. So why not a fet based load bank. It seems elegant.

MOSFET High Power Dissipation Demonstration !! (8 min 2 sec)


It look like the board is from APD so ill send AJ a line.



And here is the DIY clamp from the "hood" in action for raytheons best. Is it good enuf for cyber freaks?....


Now I need to determine how much the cabling and transformer skew the phase shift. For motor to motor comparisons the "off-ness" would apply across the board with no issue but i need to know how skewed its off so that we make more accurate phase shift readings. I think the Rogowski coil suffers less and has a wide bandwidth. I've built both so no issues. About the Rogowski coil. U see i already have 3 versions as I learned while I build that it likes a consistent coil .When your finished it should look like a spring. Id do at least 100 turns if it were me. There's about 100 turns on the ac clamp.

https://www.helifreak.com/attachment...1&d=1579023343
Enjoy life in an open world of electronics and experiment. The new wind should show a better looking quasi sine than this.

YT
Hubert
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Old 01-14-2020, 07:00 PM   #25 (permalink)
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What's really concerning is what I see out at the 149th I hope this is noise from another source because this ultra frequency at that amplitude in my mind creates considerable core eddy currents.I hope its a false reading




Bezug,
Hubert
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Old 01-16-2020, 02:03 PM   #26 (permalink)
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For us that tinker I think this would be a much better op amp to use for the lossy amp or current sensing with a hall and toroid
.

Microchip MCP 6024 it has more than double the bandwidth than an LF147 in the original wiki schematic. The s/n ratio on a LF147 is less than or equal to.023% while this is.000052%. Is it cleaner ? This is also a great op amp for drive current sensing. The ones I have are actually for a FOC drive sporting and DSP based pic mcu. I'm against the crown because we see most hobby drives available today have ST chips now but microchip certainly has MCU's just as fast and certainly just as capable being DSP based.

http://ww1.microchip.com/downloads/e.../20001685E.pdf
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Old 01-20-2020, 11:10 AM   #27 (permalink)
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https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/show...5&postcount=23
"I don't know, how the situation is in uk, but scorpion sells sets for "self builders".
another way is, to byu a normal used one with good base just like kontronik, xnova, neu or plettenberg for small money and rewind / rebuild it.

what you see here is only old style - the "top guy" uses newer winding shemes to improved their results. you can find him and his ideas here:
https://www.helifreak.com/forumdisplay.php?f=291"

btw. we just had 2 british pilots here at our speed meetings. don't know, if they are still activ."
~powercroco~

so you cannot erase it later u bringing me up.

Nice motors! You finally implement axial cooling as Christian directed. Now u think we have a full circle of love

Even if you stated my name 6 independent bridges wont fix us. U've told them none of these harmonic reduction techniques works for years. Modisc pioneered the single coil winding system years ago and you griped about it here. Now you direct high performance US pilots to it while blocking the German ones? Why cant all the pilots find the new winds on the exclusive nationalist site of yours? You've told them all in the past it doesn't work where is the data? or were you just lying to them....

Good luck with these inconsistencies. When real questions the math or scope comes you have the threads there and here locked consistently for years.
Scorpion 5020 HKIII Y-D wind
https://rclineforum.de/forum/board12...pole-machines/
https://rclineforum.de/forum/board12...e-weihnachten/
https://rclineforum.de/forum/board12...och-ein-stern/

What a joke you play with people as I have email direct from Thomas to ChX. You're behind the scenes having my threads pulled. I'm on mars remember?

After all the slanders and insults I'm not going to carry on but we are not good yet. I have nothing but contempt for the nationalist F3S speeder group in Germany as you attacked Christian Lucas my very good friend as well as myself. DBOX and the US pilots that fly him, abuse Nue motors and complain to Steve like spoiled kids. They apparently are not creative open thinkers and got angry at me over silly things like a refusal to do a pilots math for him. All them believing totally in you and acting as if engineers and modelers in the US cannot build fast planes or great motors makes made feel some kinda way. I would have loved to work with them to form a team and supply rewound power but they doubt their own selves and believe there is no chance without you so that's that. They are scared to compete I guess. I'm not but I'm no pilot and a motor needs a vehicle. And u see no one again but Steve talked to me about the possibility of a speed competition. You do have 1 pioneer in the <250 gram class, Mike Rx and the shark team. I will send him emaxx or 22 series neu soon enuf but U see how the APD wasn't impressive when I posted it to that group a year ago. Only one person talked to me about it. Steve Neu . You see cobra and emaxx struck brother hobby in test and your people had that thread totally removed in Germany Ralph what about that? Why do that?



You left these guys hanging on helifreak but you're still at it in some site they aren't allowed. I'll never like that. You see the true modeler in the USA that believes in himself can progress without your exclusive site or follows.How can u say you are their friends If they cant come to your site? It isnt right. You know that.



Axial cooling and APD we already had long ago. This is the prototype direct from APD u see it has no silkscreen. I had this over years now. I have also the latest and greatest and f3 40 it all still sits in a package resting nicely. Ive already pulled 380 amperes from a castle hydra ice HV v2 when my entire 36 inch q sport hydro was running completely underwater like a submarine. The load of pushing a huge boat several pounds completely submerged is huge. The water cooled drive did this and is not at all hurt. So I dont need the APD yet really . I have a specific wind for it and I want to drive it through the betaflight firmware. It doesnt makes alot of sense to ban the information then follow it here. But thats what always happens isnt it"?" You guys are really something....u push me out for a 100 watt cd rom motor then come here but what ever....

Neu builds great motors and APD great controllers. U just learned that.? Lol. Its better if your friends start allowing my brothers new ideas to pass on the forums there in Germany without prejudice than following me here just to see the same thing.



Happy MLK day.
Hubert
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Old 01-21-2020, 02:57 PM   #28 (permalink)
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https://rclineforum.de/forum/board12...rd199-motoren/

U see we have a serious problem with locks there where you are.

See all those locks? that's you doing that

So thank goodness here In the USA we allow other ideas like yours where you can freely share what you've done with your motors. I've no need to have blocked what you do. Like everyone else I find it interesting and impressive at times the time you put into a wind. You do quality work. Unlike your team there I don't have to hate. And you don't have to wait a year to post a photo of your motor.

https://rclineforum.de/forum/board12...pole-machines/


We want to see others work. It looks nice . Excellent work. I love the cans insignia start a thread and begin to share again.

I wont heckle like your clan will. I'm able to observe your work from objective eyes. It takes a special man to be able to do this apparently.

Anyway we carry on now in our free democratic world to look at the Deltas and make some observations about facilitating easy terminations.

Hope you guys figure out this thing of open sharing and minds soon enuf. Thomas and Gerd should know this is why we are truly the leaders

Good Luck.
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Old 01-21-2020, 04:24 PM   #29 (permalink)
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Pilots should follow the next experiment after slotted optimizations. This would be my choice for an airplane.
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Old 01-21-2020, 06:06 PM   #30 (permalink)
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PMKunzke emails reads.

"Back to the YD Motors -
Conversion factor between number of winds for same rpm between D and Y is 1,73
As i did read, you used usually a ratio of winding between the D and Y of 2:1
So, you have a "leading" Y (sorry, dont know better to explain in english)
Did you ever use a Ratio of 3:2 ? In that way you would get a "leading" D - it would be interesting to see if there are differencies in the waveform and Harmonics.

You have already read the papers and know that a turns ratio of 1.5 is probably not ideal. My understanding from the literature tells me 1.15 on the other hand is one such golden ratio and you cant get that with a 3+2 can you? A 8+7 is good because the ratio is 1.14. You can maintain the ratio using less turns if you implement half turns. 4+3.5 for instance. Maybe This is why a Gerling wind with a different number of turns per coils side by 7/8 works so well. That just a deduced hypothesis on that wind. I think it also inter spreads the phases that's why it is not fault tolerant. A 2 to 1 is obviously doable and closer to 1.15 ratios in most cases and short turns means less resistance so if I want to optimize the motor I want the benefit the wind brings but I still want to maintain great fill with low resistance. Doing something else for me doesn't make sense. Since it is a serial connection I dont know if the ratio is more about balance of the magneto motive force than the actual matching of rpms between the two machines. As a whole it only knows its one motor with one speed id think.

You should have recieved this paper.
Three phase tooth-concentrated multiple-layer fractional windings with low space harmonic content
A chart of optimal turns ratios for the 3 layer 12N10P machine was posted there where you are and again Powercroco has had this blocked while simultaneously sending everyone here.Its his group Thomas Radetzki and Gerd Giese continually breaks the international chain to this information. They have censored and denied the work of Dieter Gerling, Dajaku Guraquk , The IEEE, ABB and the 70 universities across the world that make up their corporate research centers across the globe including the University of Bundeswehr Munich by allowing ignoramt members about motor design to take over the threads with folly. Does any of it makes sense ? Of course not.These people are genius, but for some reason they have the need to block it. Why do you block Christian Lucas who hold several patents in motor , fuel cell , and avionics devices, A proven guru with multiple accolades in the field? Why do you have a need to block this father of the external rotor sps machine from all of us in hobby? All I really know is anytime any of us start denying the work done on an Hubertus academic level with our wooden thrust stands, non professional opinions and unilog it hardly seems right. Here is the thread on all this closed by his friends. The turns ratios and their effect is there. Its strange All this harmonic attenuation information was also posted on Rc network,rc groups, and RC-line so its odd ud need to come here to get it especially since its all wrong .


u see it was all there already.
https://www.rclineforum.de/forum/boa...ml#post4030096

Scorpion 5020 HKIII Y-D wind

And u see its all about shenanigans and ad hominem there not real discussion. Just talk wont share a number so we can engage in the math of it all. No one willing to do this. They continually hassle me for graphs and numbers for a proving ground but will not provide any in return. When I provide the parameters and graph that pan out to 95.7 % efficiency on and old motor I wound they lock the thread. Powecroco Why play a joke on the members of rc groups? Why should they come here to follow me but you've censored this there with the speed group? According to the group ABB hasn't a clue because they got powercroco data. And after him their is no more. You may as well be in Jonestown Guyana because the denial of this speed group against academia, IEEE fellows and seniors well established in motor design is scarily fanatical or cult like.

https://www.rclineforum.de/forum/boa...ml#post4029968
https://www.rclineforum.de/forum/boa...ml#post4029990



You see two good ratios here W=2w and W=w(sqrt3) do your home work and read the papers to understand the effect the turns ratio has on the harmonic tune of the machine as it pertains to the periphery coils in a multilayered machine.
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Old 01-22-2020, 02:13 AM   #31 (permalink)
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Hubert Hargett,

Um auch hier den Forenfrieden zu wahren , bin ich Deinem Wunsch gefolgt und habe in den rcgroups alle meine Links und Hinweise zu Deinen Arbeiten entfernt.
Vielleicht gelingt es Dir ja in Zukunft, mich und meine Arbeit genauso zu ignorieren, wie ich es mit Dir und Deinen Experimenten tue.


Ich wünsche Dir und allen anderen weiter viel Spaß mit Deinen Harmonischen!
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Old 01-22-2020, 02:41 AM   #32 (permalink)
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Summer Walker - Playing Games (Lyrics) (2 min 33 sec)

Welcome to the United States of America Powercroco

~the top guys~
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Old 01-23-2020, 01:27 PM   #33 (permalink)
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Lets play with the harmonics then.

My conductors are multistranding composed of this. If u want you can calculate a good twist for a certain fundamental but Christian says a 180 degree turn per stator length would be sufficient So I don't worry about it i just twist to my cosmetic senses are satisfied. Step 1. Fight proximity and skin effect. Use conductors > or = to 1mm. Twist the conductors or use Litz wire.

"In electrical engineering, the power factor of an AC electrical power system is defined as the ratio of the real power absorbed by the load to the apparent power flowing in the circuit, and is a dimensionless number in the closed interval of −1 to 1. A power factor of less than one indicates the voltage and current are not in phase, reducing the average product of the two. Real power is the instantaneous product of voltage and current and represents the capacity of the electricity for performing work. Apparent power is the product of RMS current and voltage. Due to energy stored in the load and returned to the source, or due to a non-linear load that distorts the wave shape of the current drawn from the source, the apparent power may be greater than the real power. A negative power factor occurs when the device (which is normally the load) generates power, which then flows back towards the source.

In an electric power system, a load with a low power factor draws more current than a load with a high power factor for the same amount of useful power transferred. The higher currents increase the energy lost in the distribution system, and require larger wires and other equipment. Because of the costs of larger equipment and wasted energy, electrical utilities will usually charge a higher cost to industrial or commercial customers where there is a low power factor.

In practice, the local effects of distortion current on devices in a three-phase distribution network rely on the magnitude of certain order harmonics rather than the total harmonic distortion.

For example, the triplen, or zero-sequence, harmonics (3rd, 9th, 15th, etc.) have the property of being in-phase when compared line-to-line. In a delta-wye transformer, these harmonics can result in circulating currents in the delta windings and result in greater resistive heating. In a wye-configuration of a transformer, triplen harmonics will not create these currents, but they will result in a non-zero current in the neutral wire. This could overload the neutral wire in some cases and create error in kilowatt-hour metering systems and billing revenue.[11][12] The presence of current harmonics in a transformer also result in larger eddy currents in the magnetic core of the transformer. Eddy current losses generally increase as the square of the frequency, lowering the transformer's efficiency, dissipating additional heat, and reducing its service life.[13]

Negative-sequence harmonics (5th, 11th, 17th, etc.) combine 120 degrees out of phase, similarly to the fundamental harmonic but in a reversed sequence. In generators and motors, these currents produce magnetic fields which oppose the rotation of the shaft and sometimes result in damaging mechanical vibrations."



Hardly mars!
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Old 01-23-2020, 02:13 PM   #34 (permalink)
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Instantaneous and average power calculated from AC voltage and current with a zero power factor (ϕ = 90°, cos(ϕ) = 0). The blue line shows all the power is stored temporarily in the load during the first quarter cycle and returned to the grid during the second quarter cycle, so no real power is consumed.


Instantaneous and average power calculated from AC voltage and current with a lagging power factor (ϕ = 45°, cos(ϕ) ≈ 0.71). The blue line shows some of the power is returned to the grid during the part of the cycle labeled ϕ.


Sinusoidal voltage and non-sinusoidal current give a distortion power factor of 0.75 for this computer power supply load.

http://users.ece.utexas.edu/~grady/POWERFAC.pdf

https://www.nist.gov/news-events/new...ection-devices

http://www.powerfactor.us/calculator.html
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Old 01-23-2020, 02:24 PM   #35 (permalink)
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How could this be "mars" if I can simply look here to see if the voltage and current are in better or worse alignment? So you see It is absolute folly on rc forums. Right now at 1.5kHz the unloaded SL wye generator looks pretty good at this point. Is censorship needed? Strange for sure. Weather or not it has some of the very harmonics before mentioned present is obvious if people have any recollection of what a clean sinus would look like. If they don't that is definitively electrically ignorant. And that is not an insult that is a fact. If the scope at scorpion shows something different for the sl machine id sure love to see it. I have theta @ around 10 degrees for the unloaded generator.Check your SL 12n10p machine. You see clearly what my scope says. Doing just the wye to d should actually reduce power factor a point from the academic research I have seen. It is worth it still because the fundamental should be eliminated and the actual torque output should raise a few points. But an additional shift between the windings should improve PF significantly. Of course when you start with a motor that has optimized windings like a Powercroco your ability to make further improvements in efficiency in large jumps decreases. But the mitigation of additional heat on the pole pieces rotor and core may allow you to generate more power, via increased torque density, or sustain peaks for longer. Its nothing to trip about.

The traditional 12N10P dl motor in a comparison paper this was tested and the lab result reported a power factor of .90 and the y-d a .89. The y-d made more torque and had a boosted working harmonic. It loses the power factor point because the 7th travels upward with the 5th. and of course the y-d wind has a little more winding loss. But that's what cool you take parallel configurations where you can to get those resistance losses back on your side.

This is also better for field weakening techniques which would allow you to run in the overspeed ranges as long as the mechanical integrity is there. Foil or g10 slot wedges could increase your efficiency band in these regions I do believe after the research ive done with the slot wedge materials like Magnovol.

Remember my proprietary blends and slot wedge work I did everyone laughed at?


See what Im saying.....yall BEEN hating for awhile now.

This is not mars this is the pursuit of a better machine.



Look at the lab result from ABB's corporate research center on the different attenuation styles as compared to the traditional DL.

Proposal 4 is simply the y-d see the increase in torque but less core loss and ripple. See it lost a point in power factor? option 9 is the Gerling 24/14 proposal with the intermixed coils and coil sides and 7 slot shift. U see you lose a little torque for the ultimately clean motor. The DEECS ABB is the proposed and you see all the differences here. Choose the one you think bests fits you. You can see they all work. But you see the ABB wind from Dr Islam brings more torque that the traditional machine with the least core losses and lowest THD. The difference in the power factor of all the proposals is here so I dont have to argue with anyone. I trust ABB's lab much more than my own but even it hasnt shown anything that does not agree with the Drs. work.
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Old 01-23-2020, 03:57 PM   #36 (permalink)
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Powercroco,

What you might consider about a 22 pole machine that works at the 11th harmonic is the further away the working harmonic is away from the fundamental less core losses will occur inherently. You may fact check that. The 5th and the 7th are already lower in the machine and the working harmonic factor is higher even wound in the traditional DL top. You have 2 24 slot stators wound you showed them to me on rc line.


So why not try a and implement the Hubertus shift.



These two extremely long machines you post will make less torque than it if you do it correctly. The yge will drive it because the serial connection should raise your inductance. If you are dead set on 10 poles removing the hammers will bring you more torque like Christian told you. The opposite is true for 22 poles I don't think it would like hammer less teeth





This is easy open sharing with anyone and that's nearly a 50% reduction in overall losses. You sure you not interested in this winding scheme even with your great motors? Mine is pretty good and Im still very interested in things like this. Look at the loss reduction in the magnets. You don't need magnet segmentation with this wind Powercroco. So it keeps the manufacturing cost down. You can wind your style and can follow this winding scheme very easily. The reported back winding factor will be lower but the torque production will be there as you've doubled the coils span from you 12 slot machine. You can stay with 10 poles and still do this. Its just the lower synchronous speed the 14 pole motor will give you. U understand the benefit that brings. None of these suggestion or ideas mean you don't already have great machines, but I though it would be interesting especially in competition to see if even they could do more. I dont know what got so off track. I truly believe ChX was only trying to give you even more.

And of course anyone may view or ask about our work. Without open views allowed from Drs. we wouldn't know very much. U should open your site threads and blogs fully. Not for me but for the education value it brings for everyone. What about when we leave earth don't we want to leave the world something not just out friends?This may also expand participation in your sport which means more fun and certainly you can not find a cheaper way to bring more. I know you always want more lets be real. Open sharing has to be in the site of self wound motors.

Wind Happy,
Hubert
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Old 01-23-2020, 07:01 PM   #37 (permalink)
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Default A wye-delta phasor diagram for 15N16P axial flux machine


Fig. 5. Three-phase phasorial diagram for the combined wye-delta connection for the example with 15 slots and 16 magnets. The EMF of one coil is indicated by Ec . The resulting EMFs of the wye- and delta-connected coils are indicated by EY and EΔ , respectively

https://redirect.viglink.com/?format...64407134dbd337
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Old 01-24-2020, 12:19 PM   #38 (permalink)
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I cant remember which motor this was but here an idea of the harmonics under a driven motor. Im sure this is the castle hydra ic HV v2 200 driving the machine.



Look at all the harmonic expertise of the pilots here.

The 5th frequency would have to be over 10kHZ each harmonic order is just a product of the fundamental and the order number. Ex. The 7th here would have to be over 14kHZ. and are not eddy currents more prominent at the increasingly higher frequencies which will rise even more at a higher rpm?

Back to the previous quote
"The presence of current harmonics in a transformer also result in larger eddy currents in the magnetic core of the transformer. Eddy current losses generally increase as the square of the frequency, lowering the transformer's efficiency, dissipating additional heat, and reducing its service life."

You can see here clearly what hemisphere "Mars" is in.

"IIRC then https://www.scorpionsystem.com sold powercroco motors, maybe they still sell and have a good dataset. Dr. Okon has all the data fore sure, but he left public discussion some years ago. So .. sorry, can't help you with that."

~Zwieblum~

Ill ask you insetad of your friends. How could you have data on multilayer work from Dr. Sariful Islam just released in 2019? If you left "discussion" years ago but how could even that be you are talking right here in these places now.

https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/show...Pro-400A/page2


Here's the dellusion powercroco. You see here your friend suggest an academic research center is a manufacturer fudging theoretical numbers and questioning its Hubertus level testing against your stand. That nutz buddy. If they did testing and confirmed the theory proposed It gets no better than that. They believe you have this 2019 information several years ago so they are blinded by the light. When information from the IEEE is publicly published it is for the world to use not to sell you a motor. Without knowing it it is actually your friends here that are fudging things promoting your products with out seeing a bit of what been shown here.

"Sorry to be picky on this topic, but there is no data given (letting aside the mechanical drawings and winding schematics). I do not intend to do the measuring series that the manufacturer should provide. Now there is the unproven claim of a 10% performance gain. Nice, if theory says so (I have not modeled the engine, nor do I intend to do so. Again that's work of the manufacturer). But that's no prove, anyway. You'd need to take 10 cages and 10 stators, make 10 motors out of them with star winding, measure, then unwind and make 10 deltas, measure again. Unwind and make 10 "star + delta" engines. Measure again. Now does the chart show 10% improvement with statistical significance? I honestly doubt. I do not remember if you know http://www.powercroco.de from the times it was active."

~Zwieblum~

You need to silence this nonsense from your friends. The data given comes off a hubertus bench and is verified and accepted through many peers who did the ancestry work that led to it. Did we forget how academic research works in order to be published. Companies like Tesla and Toyota already use many of these principles for the most efficient machines as they wanna travel far on a charge. Billions in R&D and who in their right mind thinks measuring a delta 10 times for redundancy of a wooden bench will receive a Hubertus award. Cmon lets be finally be real.




[1] F. Magnussen, Ch. Sadarangani: “Winding
factors and Joule losses of permanent magnet
machines with concentrated windings”. 2003
IEEE International Electric Machines & Drives
Conference (IEMDC 2003), 01-04.06 Madison
Wisconsin, USA.
[2] M. Nakano, H. Kometani: “A study on eddycurrent
losses in rotors of surface permanent
magnet synchronous machines”. IEEE
Transactions on Industry Application, vol. 42,
No. 2, 2006.
[3] N. Bianchi, E. Fornasiero: “Index of rotor losses
in three-phase fractional slot permanent magnet
machines”. Electric Power Applications, IET,
vol. 3, No. 5, September 2009.
[4] G. Dajaku, D. Gerling: “Magnetic Radial Force
Density of the PM Machine with 12-teeth/10-
poles Winding Topology”. IEEE International
Electric Machines and Drives Conference,
IEMDC2009, Florida USA, May 3-6, 2009,
[5] J. Wang, Zh. P. Xia, D. Howe, S. A. Long:
“Vibration Characteristics of Modular Permanent
Magnet Brushless AC Machines”. IEEE IAS
Annual Meeting, 2006, Tampa, Florida, USA.
[6] K. Ito, K. Naka, M. Nakano, M. Kobayashi:
“Electric machine”, US Patent 7,605,514, Oct. 20,
2009.
[7] G. Dajaku: “Elektrische Maschine”, German
patent, DE 102008 057 349 B3.
[8] G. Dajaku: “Elektrische Maschine”, German
patent application No. DE 102008 054 284 A1.
[9] G. Dajaku: “Elektrische Maschine”, German
patent application No. DE 102011 011 023.2.
[10] Gerling D., Dajaku G., Mühlbauer K.: “Electric
Machine Design Tailored for Powertrain
Optimization”. The 25th World Battery, Hybrid
and Fuel Cell Electric Vehicle Symposium &
Exhibition (EVS), 5.-9. November 2010,
Shenzhen, China.
[11] G. Dajaku: “Elektrische Maschine”, German
patent application No. DE 102008 051 047 A1.

Not one of these people are from mars nor do they need lie to sell a motor. They are academic researchers not CE vendors. The top minds in the field. It is the individuals like your friends here that cannot produce even basic motor parameters of your engines. I on the other hand I provided parameters to an old motor @ 95.7 % and here comes the lock. Besides how does one use a metric to judge my motors that they cannot fulfill themselves. Seems like it would help if they visit their own university libraries in Germany more.


In the paint department alone I serviced 4 abb 7 axis robots until we replaced them with fanuc. They travel on their rail over 10000 km every 3 days. U think they work hard? I'm very familiar with the way they do things when it comes to their devices. Top notch period.


Does powercroco have a test facility for its pilots to examine if the motor sold to them meets the required demand?


"Helsinki, Finland, June 10, 2016 – ABB has inaugurated a new customer drives test laboratory at its factory in Helsinki, Finland. The facility now enables customers to have their own motors tested with ABB’s variable speed drives (VSDs) to verify their impact on performance and energy consumption."

Your pilots wished they had it this good but Im fine with Zwieblum measuring his motor choices several times. Measure it 100 times the harmonics will still be there. Im definitely no seller of ABB we run SEWEURO vfd's
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Old 01-24-2020, 12:41 PM   #39 (permalink)
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Anyway....
For the drive side I wonder would the dc choke still work....Maybe it is of no use since our dc bus is not via rectified dirty 3 phase ac but if it's just an inductor on the input power leads it's certainly easy to test if it would still have any effect. Probably wont because I'm thinking our battery packs are fairly clean sources of power. But we def know the low pass and notch filtering beta flight brings with APD will.
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Old 01-25-2020, 09:58 AM   #40 (permalink)
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Check this post out yall.
Scorpion 5020 HKIII Y-D wind - Seite 2

Firstly manufacturers don't need to follow this motor when they have at better at >95% efficiency. Gerling is in a realm above 97% ! They have the resources for special stators, magnets, etc. Hobbyist don't so we look for a better wind for more as all these other things require research and capital. This is like asking since Lehner is more efficient than a scorpion why doesnt scorpion rewrite its books with Lehner pages..... Secondly how does he know the efficiency is just a result of my wind I never offered any information about bearings etc. That just an efficiency graph from the cals hobbyist like to use. That satisfies his limited metric not mine I measure at a scope and PA level a place he's unfamiliar obviously. Last but not least im not competing with industry Im competing with an antiquated wind and motor you report an efficiency of 80% 15 points away. And then if none of the projects have been completed why are we here currently examining the the wind on my scope and wasn't the align a project???? LOL! Dont hate because I have more project than you have words on the pages and yes it takes time to complete all that while you stare at it till its done.

Whats the oddest STEFAN V is if you are copying and pasting from here to Germany why are you asking questions in a thread you know there will be no reply? You know exactly where Im at. So why you asking Zimmerman there where I'm not. Find courage son. Since industry doesn't use anything from us we better throw hobby as a whole away. Why didnt we all think of this earlier? Its absolutely genius How you push me out with your complaining then make statement that wont be countered and leave that eternally up on your site. Incorrect assumptions You should ask why your friend who's motors you like so much points you here for new winding ideas

"I don't know, how the situation is in uk, but scorpion sells sets for "self builders".
another way is, to byu a normal used one with good base just like kontronik, xnova, neu or plettenberg for small money and rewind / rebuild it.

what you see here is only old style - the "top guy" uses newer winding shemes to improved their results. you can find him and his ideas here:
https://www.helifreak.com/forumdisplay.php?f=291"

btw. we just had 2 british pilots here at our speed meetings. don't know, if they are still activ."
~powercroco~


isnt that equally odd.

Industry applies things like you see here.


And why does a such a smart pilot think were trying to apply industry tech to hobby motors in the first place? DUH! You asked about losses at 80% that's no question because I have no idea what your fundamental is at 80% of no load speed on a mystery motor with no numbers or material specifications. A stock scorpion certainly doesn't run at 95% efficiency. So why they sell it? You were offered all the real math so you could measure and find out the exact answer FOR YOUR MOTOR and you cant do the math so you fill the pages with folly. Remember this math you cannot do. There is no real discussion because you run from every question asked of you in that thread. You have no answer. All you have to do is look at the formulas and you'd realize your purposefully closed lips on materials and lack of mathematical aptitude is why you cannot answer your own question. Why you dont know already? Powercroco has all that data remember?



Why u never ask him what was the difference in efficiency between HK I - IV. There's a reason you wont answer things like this.

Every intelligent person with eyes can see the effect of frequency squared on loss . How could anyone estimate losses with out knowing the frequency at which they work? See you act ignorant to me and I don't have time for it because a real engineer would know better. Here's the math. You do you own work since you know so much about motors. I posted the frequencies at 1.5 kHZ get powercroco's gathered data and material spec you're sure he has and get to work. All the losses at each harmonic are additive, but it's obvious as you continue to post that you know very little about, industry, scientific method,electronics,and zig zag transformer technology. A cooler and more efficient motor has always been capable of delivering more power. Hate on....I know your just really upset nothing you've ever wrapped brings back >95% with its measured parameters. The old align is really on your mind. But that's not a scorpion or wrap by PC that's 1boho's sht you looking at with Christian coils parallel on a motor that cost me 50 dollars usd. If you wanna stay with it enjoy it but I've moved on to better things. Wouldn't I know. You've never successfully wound or tested a motor like mine with +135% ccs @ 1.8... mm or wound a y-d variant so how did you become so knowledgeable about what belongs to me. I can make this old antiquated motor even better if I wanted and increase ccs + 152% with one more turn.

Everyone knows copper losses are the most prominent so when you optimize fill and lower resistance the majority of good things happen there. Powercroco showed you that in '03. But you're crying because industry has found a way to use the winding for even more optimization of loss reduction in the rotor and core and that vexes you in 2020? WHY?

It's Jonestown insanity if you ask me. There's zero logical reason for any of you to be griping. You're def not right about anything you're saying there.
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