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Electric Motors Winding and Repair Electric Motors Winding and Repair Discussion


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Old 04-20-2020, 12:29 AM   #21 (permalink)
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mit einer antwort warte ich diesmal besser die eine woche, bis die EDIT-zeit abgelaufen ist......
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Old 04-20-2020, 08:09 PM   #22 (permalink)
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Okon Is that less copper than OEM?
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Old 04-21-2020, 12:28 AM   #23 (permalink)
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siehe oben:


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mit einer antwort warte ich diesmal besser die eine woche, bis die EDIT-zeit abgelaufen ist......
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Old 04-21-2020, 04:34 AM   #24 (permalink)
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mit der erreichten niedrigen spezifischen drehzahl von 130/V kann man einen schönen direktantrieb für einen nicht zu großen heli realisieren.


die rotordrehzahl an 6S könnte bei 2400-2600 rpm liegen.
die bewicklung ist gut genug für >70A peakstrom, wenn der regler den motor bei diesem strom noch drehen mag.



natürlich ist bekannt, dass auch helidirektantriebe schon vor vielen jahren mehrfach realisiert worden sind.


ein paar beispiele:
powercroco DD-Helis
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Old 04-23-2020, 12:27 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Please speak english in english threads.
Thanks
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Old 04-23-2020, 02:11 PM   #26 (permalink)
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I'am not able to discuss in english, it is not my native language.


In the case, german language isn't welcome here anymore,

pls. delete immediately all my posts in this forum and my account too!


kind regards,
Dr. Ralph Okon
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Old 04-23-2020, 03:54 PM   #27 (permalink)
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Hi Rick
its totally fine if he wants to post here I will translate it all for the forum. Be aware it isn't much but speculation on our work but will not offer the same transparency on his. But let him post if he likes. For most of the crazy speculations there is a fairly accurate answer I can always give. I dont mind this at all. Its mostly entertainment during this cabin fever. We dont run our models during COVID19 like the Dr Does.


I tell u what I wouldn't labor for it. Let him remove his own post. That's alot of unnecessary nonsense word life! I had to do it often in the east and they just followed me back stateside. Look at the Y-D blog and see who's visiting on the constant!!! This wind presented to u looks like less copper fill than the OEM. The slots are small and the enamel is fragile this larger mono wire isnt the ticket. U are able to achieve better fill with this motor if u step the diameter down and make more parallel paths to the drive. U see these endplates were needed coz this wire he used will certainly crack enamel and to get it to lay u will need slot wedges while winding. The best thing I found to do that is plastic razor blades.The paper uses space and creates thermal resistance between the stator and copper. Copper will dissipate heat very well but the paper reduces the transfer efficiency between it and the iron and takes up space for copper fo sho!


His nemesis in speed plane motors as I understand is a tuners pyro 1000 with the enamel removed which would be an insulator to the iron and take up space. Removing it in theory shoul create more space an dissipate heat better. You have to wind with great care but it is possible especially if you use a de-burring tool on the stator. Hes a few miles and hour behind this other tuner we know very little about. His name is Thomas as I recall.
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Old 04-24-2020, 08:38 AM   #28 (permalink)
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Let's see what it does Ralph . Where's the glove? Or maxes abacus
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Old 04-25-2020, 09:14 AM   #29 (permalink)
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Default OEM 4638 into the abacus

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Old 04-25-2020, 09:39 AM   #30 (permalink)
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Big wire? been there and done it already no nomex no gfk needed

I LEFT IT COZ ITS LESS FILL THAN FACTORY LIKE YOURS IS!!!!
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Old 04-30-2020, 05:44 AM   #31 (permalink)
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Fake news for sure as the watts per gram here are nearly half and 20 less points in efficiency. What a purposeful input of a marginally performing setup with this motor. You'll never see such a weak selection with an HK in the motor box category

http://www.rc-network.de/forum/showt...-Tipps!/page11

You see the conversation goes back n forth about these outrunners or the rewound align with 2 cents worth more copper than OEM. I post a performance graph with a NEU GM F5D performance prop and then there is no more discussion or questions answered when inquired.

I guess real experience tells people what's really possible with these 24 slot stators and large mono coils. A long report on fill on my motors. We examined it for several days but when its time to examine PC's fill on this NEUMOTOR then "we" cannot speak english anymore..... I want to know was it exceptional in comparison.
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Old 04-30-2020, 06:39 AM   #32 (permalink)
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When I ask about the fill on this wind posted to me in in my thread this is the translated answer.


with an answer I better wait the one week until the EDIT time has expired...…
~powercroco~


A weeks past now. Time has expired so what is the fill report ? We see u left no wire ga so we could run our own calculations on fill. I can pretty much tell you the wire ga but I want to see how transparent these pleasant reports are into the forum.

The ratio of .86 would not be ideal for the elimination of the 2 pole harmonic. My findings tell me that there is a much better turns ratio that fully eliminates that. I posted the optimal ratios but I guess you missed that.
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Old 05-01-2020, 07:47 AM   #33 (permalink)
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Why bother though since PC says the Chair of actuators and controls at the university of Bundeswehr Munich Germany different turn per coil side technique to attenuate space or sub harmonics does not work. This was all determined without a lick of PA or Scope work. Absolutely amazing how a person sees harmonics without real diagnostic equipment not the heavily dependent on prop cal applets. They wont show you a thing about harmonic content. You have to analyze the signal to make THD or S/N ratio determinations.

If it were there its would certainly have been shown to win this inane contest. Do you see it at powerditto? Absolutely not. Maybe its hidden from United States of American eyes?

Whats the argument about? Post the data if you have it. You always arguing so bring some meat to the picnic for once.

Were "having fun with harmonics" so come on and join in if you have some useful data to offer.
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Old 05-07-2020, 10:21 AM   #34 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1BOHO View Post


Fake news for sure as the watts per gram here are nearly half and 20 less points in efficiency. What a purposeful input of a marginally performing setup with this motor. You'll never see such a weak selection with an HK in the motor box category

NEU/LEOMOTION 4635 mit Idealisierungs Tipps! - Seite 11

You see the conversation goes back n forth about these outrunners or the rewound align with 2 cents worth more copper than OEM. I post a performance graph with a NEU GM F5D performance prop and then there is no more discussion or questions answered when inquired.

I guess real experience tells people what's really possible with these 24 slot stators and large mono coils. A long report on fill on my motors. We examined it for several days but when its time to examine PC's fill on this NEUMOTOR then "we" cannot speak english anymore..... I want to know was it exceptional in comparison.

How does the equivalent OEM HK in mass compare with the setup proposed here. Where is that graph Dr.? And of course you are heavier with a YGE 320 BRICK! in here than any APD f3 200 in the world.
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Old 05-07-2020, 10:40 AM   #35 (permalink)
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Come on Dr, Whats the fill on your motor? U thoroughly examined mine already. Whats wrong? Why you don't want to post it for your viewers u sent here from the hi performance rc group section?
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Old 05-07-2020, 10:52 AM   #36 (permalink)
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.......And I am present in your German forum reading "more speed"



Thomas and the hells angel Kasumi are really hilarious. What a good show. Ask them why it isnt the fastest planes powerplant....this "top" quality?


Thanks
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Old 05-14-2020, 10:01 AM   #37 (permalink)
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Amazing when you think about it. You with the suggestion of this as a usable area. When Dekker topped you there it was a "danger zone" where max proximity loss occurs. But we will work with it as I examine your fill.



"crazy winding, very nice work.

but:
if the slots are also filled so "very" outside, pls. consider, that there is the most dangerous zone for eddy cureent losses into the wires generated by the magnetic field.
in the end it can (not must) bring more losses than wins to wind there."
~powercroco~


Well we all knew then the simple way to deal with that is use conductor under 1 mm so it just came off as the same old hater ade from you. We also know out there is where the most torque will be generated but there's no 2nd guessing this vast expertise.
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Old 05-14-2020, 10:22 AM   #38 (permalink)
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Default Are you exceptional?

And so we know your conductor is no more than a mm by the slot depth don't we so let say its 19 AWG. and at that the fill is .33% by your math an inaccurate drawing. Do you see the real motor doesnt have the prominent flat area between the radii at the bottom of the slot like your drawing? Exceptional wind and drawing Dr Okon !!! I excuse you since you have no formal training in engineering or any manufacturing skills like cad,cam,cnc, or manual machining. Since you report customer glee at your wind on the American motor he'd certainly enjoy mine. I guess Holle and I are better


~PC~



Is it even 19 AWG as it get worse from here at 6+5..... 20 AWG is 26.8% fill and how did you make more space with the nomex and u still have a coating in the slots plus it? we can see. Ill show you the NEU stator totally stripped for a visual reality . I did one long ago. After this we will play more with the Magnovol ,Aluminum, and GFK wedges. Copy it like you do for a chance at broadening the efficiency band. Contrary to your assessment of increasing efficiency by 1% coming at great effort some of it can be had without great effort, or expensive cofe plates that dont carry enough mass to really develop more power than the Si-Fe counterpart. Implement a different wind correctly then test it correctly. You cant rely solely on ya data log or silly cal some are so dependent on.



If he is happy with your wind he can be supplied by OEM at the Kv requested since you have actually added no more copper than OEM.


Happy Harmonics,
Hubert
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Old 05-14-2020, 01:12 PM   #39 (permalink)
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All the performance guys you sent here from rc groups to watch this work use Manuels fill cal which never considered more than these 4 sides. But you want to incorporate now by your own words the "danger zones" in the analysis of the Americans wind on the American motor,but I'm fine with it as long as it goes both ways.It only makes your less less. You see when Dekker put more copper than Dr Okon the Dr have a complaint about that very zone he suggest here. Then when he analyzes 1BOHO who put more copper in the NEU stator than the him he post a photo here and capture even the part of the slot he himself discourage the other winders wire to lay in if it fills better than him. Same thing with Modisc STSD winds that filled more. Solder points was the problem then but its all soldered throughout every power system! Lehner Torqstar which is a benchmark use the same individual coil system and a soldered PCB! Every motor connector, every component on the inverter, every cap inline etc. is soldered in every system. You are truly a big hater powercroco....and still haven't learned that copper fill and reduced copper loss isnt the only place performance comes from. The science has shown it is possible to reduce loss nearly by half even though the copper loss increase by a few percent. The proposal also produced 2% more torque. There is not tremendous addition in capital in a wind to series a wye and delta motor. Essentially inline inductors that may even help your struggling drives that cant run stable on delta.


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Old 05-14-2020, 03:08 PM   #40 (permalink)
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Default Recalibrate your measuring stick!





You look Dr Okon you see your dimensions of your "danger zones" are no way physically accurate? Slot bottom radius wrong and well as the hammers.Nothing about these areas measurement is accurate. Ray Charles can see that. Unfortunately falsely opening the slot area to make my wind look inadequate only highlights the true inadequacy of your own. Here's a tip when a radius gauge wont fit. Get you some precision dowel pins. Incrementally through the size progression there will be a very close fit to the radii. That's the measurement number you take, Cad doesnt really measure anything but your drawing which has to be accurate DOCTOR. Depend on it
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