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Old 06-18-2021, 04:55 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default F.Port and Redundancy

Hoping to find some clarification.

I am running an R8 Pro Access rx in F.Port mode with an Ikon 2. I was previously running it in Sbus mode with an RS Access for redundancy. In that configuration I had the RS connected with Sbus out to the Sbus in on the R8 Pro. Now with F.port, would I use the S.port as opposed to the Sbus out on the RS. I assume thatís what is needed for telemetry from both primary (R8 Pro) and secondary (RS). I also want to make sure I donít need to use inverted S.port on the RS.
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Old 06-18-2021, 09:28 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Iíve asked similar questions on RCGroups and the answer was that redundancy mode only works in sbus. I would think the primary receiver could still be in fport2 to the FBL. I havenít tried that yet myself though.
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Old 06-18-2021, 09:37 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Pretty sure I read somewhere that the firmware that enables F.Port disables Sbus. I havenít confirmed that but it makes me question if I can even use the Sbus in on the R8 pro if it is connected to the Ikon with F.port. That would be really disappointing if I canít use F.port on the primary and still have a secondary connected for redundancy.
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Old 06-19-2021, 05:52 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Enabling F.Port output disables the S.Bus and S.Port outputs, but not the inputs. It will still accept a S.Bus input just fine.
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Old 06-19-2021, 06:59 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Makes sense. So the secondary needs to still be in sbus mode? If thatís the case then I assume you would loose telemetry if it switched to the secondary rx. I want to avoid that if possible.
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Old 06-19-2021, 07:05 PM   #6 (permalink)
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The secondary Rx is S.Bus out yes.

You can't have telemetry from the secondary receiver. It's only meant to serve as a control link failsafe. Telemetry isn't that important, and unless your main receiver fails catastrophically and stops receiving control signal completely, it will only use the secondary receiver for a very short time, if it ever actually does (for helis, we don't even come close to the maximum range of these receivers). It's a non-issue.
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Old 06-19-2021, 07:57 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Noted. However, I would almost guarantee you mine will switch over at some point. I have had so many failsafes with Frsky itís ridiculous. Iím right at the edge of changing brands at this point because of it. If it wasnít for OpenTx, I would have already. Thatís a whole other thread though. Lol!
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Old 06-19-2021, 08:00 PM   #8 (permalink)
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For what it's worth, I don't think I've ever had a failsafe in the 4+ years I've been flying FrSky. Never even so much as a RSSI low alarm. How are your antennas oriented? Are they the proper 90 degrees apart? Are they being shielded by carbon fiber somewhere?
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Old 06-19-2021, 09:00 PM   #9 (permalink)
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On the Goblin 420 Iím currently working on the rx is mounted on the bottom of the tail servo mount and the antennas are extending down from the boom at a 90 degree angle to each other. I have done everything I can to make sure the antennas are not shielded as well as making sure there is continuity from the motor mount all the way back to the tail case to help reduce possible static issues. I have had many rxís go into failsafe and then after, the rssi will be reduced by 30db or more even while bench testing. Had issues with several x4r-sbís so I switched to an X8r. I thought the problem was solved at that point only to have the same issue occur several months later. After I had the x8r failure, my son had a failsafe on his 420 with an x8r. He probably had 70 trouble free flights or more if I remember correctly. I decided to try the Archer rxís as a last ditch effort, hoping if it was static or vibration induced, they would be more resistant. I have flown many Frsky rxís in planes including edfís with no issue. None of my failsafes showed any indication in my Ikon logs of low or lost bec voltage or anything else that would explain the failsafe condition. Now there is a pretty good thread on RCG about a very similar failure with the R8 Proís as well and seems they concluded the rxís were defective but not all showed issues early on but some did. All my larger more expensive heliís have been grounded until I can gain some confidence in the radio link.
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Old 06-19-2021, 10:50 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Maybe the R8 Pro is problematic. Is that what you run in all of your helis? I do have a R8 Pro in my drawer, though I've yet to use it in anything.

Since I got my X10S Express a couple of months ago, I run the Archer RS in almost all of my helis, including my Protos 800. The ones that I don't, I just haven't made time to change over yet.
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Old 06-20-2021, 01:17 PM   #11 (permalink)
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The R8 Pro is just the latest one I'm trying. Had X4R-Sb and then X8r before. If the R8 Pro is problematic, then it's no different than the other 2 as far as I'm concerned. I'm very open to the idea that I am doing something wrong or that something else on the heli is the cause but it definitely isn't the usual suspects. I have been researching the problem and all related info I can find for more than a year and still no resolution. so far the R8 Pro is fine with very few flights, but I won't fly without redundancy. Can't afford to crash every time I get a failsafe.

To get back on track, I'm still questioning the proper connections required for a secondary rx connected to a R8 Pro running f.port. There is a post on Aloft where someone claims to have connected the secondary using the s.port out pin instead of the sbus out on the RS. He had both rx's running 2.1.7 firmware and f.port and f.port2 checked for both. If that is possible, I assume that would allow for full telemetry with both receivers. I would think someone, especially at Aloft would know but I haven't received any replies over there so far. Another reason Frsky can be a pain. If it was Spektrum, I could just call Horizon and ask. I think I'll just do my own testing today. Make some connections and see what happens. If I ruin a receiver, at least I'll know.
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Old 06-20-2021, 07:35 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Just an update. I connected an RS to my R8 Pro 2 different ways to test. The R8 Pro is running 2.1.7 firmware and is connected to ch3 on the Ikon and I selected F.Port2 in the Ikon setup. F.Port and F.Port2 both selected in RX options. I tried connecting the RS to the R8 Pro sbus in using the sbus out pin on the RS while using 2.1.2 software. I also tried connecting using the S.Port out pin with 2.1.7 firmware and F.Port and F.Port2 both selected. The heli works correctly and I canít tell the difference. I tried binding the R8 Pro to one model and the RS to another and switching back and forth to test the redundancy but it seems that if the R8 Pro is not bound, it will not allow the RS which is connected to it to control the heli. Also, even if the R8 Pro is not bound to the second model, if it shares the receiver number, it will still control the heli which makes it impossible to test the redundant rx while it is connected to the sbus in on the R8 Pro. I just wish Frsky would include the info in the instructions for the rxís so there would be no question, especially since they donít bother to communicate with the end user.
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Old 06-22-2021, 07:53 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Doesn’t Access show RX number in the logs? Wouldn’t that indicate the rx that’s controlling? Or is that an Ethos thing only?
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Old 06-22-2021, 10:51 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Not sure. I havenít had a failure on Access yet. Just now setting them up. I do have one R8 Pro that is showing lower RSSI though.
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Old 06-28-2021, 05:51 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Default Redundancy in Access mode

I’ve been specifically told that when using access protocol we are to bind Rx1 and then Rx2 separately. I haven’t tried this while using Rx1 in Fport mode but it will be my next task on my next heli setup as it will require redundancy.

I believe they can both have telemetry as well and the way you know if it ever switched would be to check your logs and see RX# 0 or 1 as the telemetry source. The beauty of Access! Or maybe Ethos....not sure.

Once I used a R9MX as my redundant receiver so I could easily turn off 2.4Ghz on my x20 and saw the 900mhz controlling as redundant via SBUS.
Definitive test.
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Old 06-28-2021, 07:40 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Yes I believe you have to bind each rx separately. Thatís how I am doing it. You have to register the rx and then bind it to 1, 2, or 3 as you want. So far I canít see that my secondary can control the model. Aloft Hobbies told me to create 2 models with different receiver numbers and bind the primary to one and the secondary to the other and then switch models while powered up. This does not work although I am running the primary in f.port mode and the secondary in sbus mode which may or may not be an issue. They are trying to get some info from Frsky for me so Iím just waiting for that.
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Old 06-30-2021, 02:37 PM   #17 (permalink)
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UPDATE: Disappointing, but this info may be useful for some. After a lot of testing, I can confirm that an R8 pro connected to an Ikon 2 in F.port mode for full telemetry integration will not allow for a 2nd redundancy rx to function. The problem is that the only redundancy input on the R8 Pro is sbus and therefore the redundant rx must be in sbus mode which the Ikon 2 will not recognize as it is in F.port mode for the primary rx. If you put the Ikon 2 in sbus mode, as well as both rxís, it will function properly but you will loose the telemetry integration. I hope there is another way to gain telemetry but I have not tested this yet. Itís a shame we can use F.port for telemetry but canít use an rx for redundancy at the same time, at least with an Ikon 2. At least now I know. I can say that with the exception of one R8 Pro that appears to be faulty out of the package, they are performing well in several helis. The faulty one appears to function ok as well but has much lower RSSI numbers than the others, on the bench and in flight.

Last edited by Xtremespeed; 06-30-2021 at 10:33 PM..
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Old 07-01-2021, 12:54 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xtremespeed View Post
UPDATE: Disappointing, but this info may be useful for some. After a lot of testing, I can confirm that an R8 pro connected to an Ikon 2 in F.port mode for full telemetry integration will not allow for a 2nd redundancy rx to function. The problem is that the only redundancy input on the R8 Pro is sbus and therefore the redundant rx must be in sbus mode which the Ikon 2 will not recognize as it is in F.port mode for the primary rx. If you put the Ikon 2 in sbus mode, as well as both rxís, it will function properly but you will loose the telemetry integration. I hope there is another way to gain telemetry but I have not tested this yet. Itís a shame we can use F.port for telemetry but canít use an rx for redundancy at the same time, at least with an Ikon 2. At least now I know. I can say that with the exception of one R8 Pro that appears to be faulty out of the package, they are performing well in several helis. The faulty one appears to function ok as well but has much lower RSSI numbers than the others, on the bench and in flight.
Canít we use SBUS mode for control in all receivers and then use S.port for telemetry like the ikon PDF states? I believe the advantage of f.port was just to do it on one wire. I havenít tied this yet but seems like Iíll have to.
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Old 07-01-2021, 01:17 PM   #19 (permalink)
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You can. According to MSH we need the adapter cable MSH51645 to connect the sbus out on the rx to the Sat 1 port on the Ikon. It needs an inverted sbus signal and we would use the sport connected to channel 3 in the Ikon for telemetry. Not as convenient but necessary if you want both sbus and full telemetry.
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Old 07-02-2021, 10:15 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xtremespeed View Post
You can. According to MSH we need the adapter cable MSH51645 to connect the sbus out on the rx to the Sat 1 port on the Ikon. It needs an inverted sbus signal and we would use the sport connected to channel 3 in the Ikon for telemetry. Not as convenient but necessary if you want both sbus and full telemetry.
Well I just ordered three of those cables last night for my bigger helis so I can have redundant receivers with telemetry. Maybe one day Frsky will fully finish f.port2 protocol to share control and telemetry so we can go back to single wire as it was intended. Dare to dream.
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