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Electric Motors Winding and Repair Electric Motors Winding and Repair Discussion


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Old 04-10-2020, 06:25 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Default contrarotating prop project

built from 2 pcs. HK 4020 III (12N10P) and "Ramoser" adjustable props following Rene's traces:

powercroco - kuni-cr

thisone works with 6S and possibly about 60-80A each motor.
winded old style YY.
mechanically it has some little improvements.
thought for an improved for more speed water plane model.







happy easter to everyone!
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Old 04-14-2020, 12:19 PM   #2 (permalink)
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HAPPY EASTER....
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Old 04-15-2020, 05:53 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Kunipatz uses this? Wow. He told Christian that contraprops weren't ideal for speed esp spaced that close together after we showed the NEU contradrive. Was he hating on ChX or NEU? Im sure this double motor replica of a Schneider Trophy speedplane has no issue going faster than the OEM 4638 neumotor proposed in the calculator Right? Will vg share another one of his wonderful calculated graphs in Germany on this particular power system? Would love to see it, then maybe it will be worth the time to bring forth the 46 series NEU "contra-diction"
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Old 04-15-2020, 12:23 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1BOHO View Post
Kunipatz uses this? Wow.
Nein. Wie kommst Du denn auf sowas?
Ich habe einem guten Freund seinen Wunsch erfüllt und ihm aus den von ihm zur Verfügung gestellten Teilen den Motor zusammengebaut.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1BOHO View Post
He told Christian that contraprops weren't ideal for speed esp spaced that close together .....
Soweit mir bekannt ist, ist genau das das Ergebnis diverser Experimente, die Rene mit seinen Kontraprops gemacht hat.
Für dieses Semiscaleprojekt spielt das aber überhaupt keine Rolle.
Das (Baukasten)modell meines Freundes soll nur ein bissel schneller werden als Rene's. Das wird mit den leistungsfähigeren Motoren (4020 statt 4015) und der höheren Betriebsspannung (6S statt 5S) schon irgendwie klappen. Schließlich ist ca. 40% mehr Leistung möglich.
Ich bin mir sicher, er wird den gewünschten Spaß damit haben.


Quote:
Originally Posted by 1BOHO View Post
.......after we showed the NEU contradrive.
Wo habt ihr einen Gegenläuferantrieb gezeigt? Oder sprichst Du hier mal wieder von einer Skizze eines eurer vielen, vielen unvollendeten Projekte?

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Originally Posted by 1BOHO View Post
Was he hating on ChX or NEU?
Woher soll ich das wissen?
Frag ihn einfach selber - in rcline und rc-network scheint er immermal aktiv zu sein!



Quote:
Originally Posted by 1BOHO View Post
Im sure this double motor replica of a Schneider Trophy speedplane has no issue going faster than the OEM 4638 neumotor proposed in the calculator Right?
Könnte sein.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1BOHO View Post
Will vg share another one of his wonderful calculated graphs in Germany on this particular power system?
Frag Ihn, nicht mich. Woher soll ich das denn wissen?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1BOHO View Post
Would love to see it, then maybe it will be worth the time to bring forth the 46 series NEU "contra-diction"
Ich glaube es janicht..... Du willst wirklich mal ein Projekt bis zur Funktionsfähigkeit durchziehen?
Wäre ja mal ganz was neues!

Wüsste nicht, warum sowas nicht auch mit OEM-Neumotoren funktionieren sollte.
Geht doch sogar mit Ditto-Streamermotoren oder auch mit Billigmotoren vom Hobbyking!
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Old 04-15-2020, 02:00 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Unfinished projects start at 4 months to wind a tooth....the rc network way..… wye to d in Germany is certainly unfinished. Im just waiting for more speculation about what's finished when nothing at all happens there but the same old antiquated HK projects to inject the sock. Let me find the post and his rant about the poor performance of unoptimized contra drives. That should be easy enough. I ask you cause is always in your name in which he does it. Of course you know anytime anyone else does anything interesting with a motor he always injects himself or you the same way as you.


LOL

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Old 04-15-2020, 10:38 PM   #6 (permalink)
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https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/show...5&postcount=11

Enjoy it Ralph: lol: the kuni editorial on contra performance is further explained on rc networks in ChX thread. Do you need a copy of that as well? Containing that virus is difficult Doc. You started it is there a cure....because as u see it has breeched international borders.
Keep it real poppa counter rotating setups have always been available in any of the sizes at place we all know in San Diego . Do u think the simple machine operations to make this work isn't accomplishable by a certified cnc and manual machinist programmer and operator? It all sounds good but there's no real meat. I won't worry about it till you learn the simple machining to accomplish liquid cooling. From the other editorial In sebastians thread ud think a simple internal cooling sleeve a nobel moment in the 3ast.

There is also the 24 pole in the small sizes now.






Thanks
Hughski...
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Old 04-15-2020, 11:07 PM   #7 (permalink)
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U see he says its less efficient and slower but he does it coz its cool . U say he did it for more speed. Whats what?

Next comes kunipatz with a stimulus bailout

Watch.......
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Old 04-15-2020, 11:36 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 1BOHO View Post
.
U see he says its less efficient and slower but he does it coz its cool . U say he did it for more speed. Whats what?
Such Dir bitte mal ein besseres Übersetzungsprogramm!
Wie ich oben schon geschrieben habe; das Modell ist SEMISCALE!
Wenn das original einen Kontraprop hat, kiregt das Modell auch einen.

Und schneller werden wird es nur, weil da 40% mehr Leistung als bei Kuni im Spiel sind.

Aus welchen Motoren man den Antrieb baut oder lieber einen fertig kauft, das ist in diesem Zusammenhang völlig egal.

Jetzt klar genug?
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Old 04-16-2020, 02:51 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Hi Ralph,
so ist es halt ein ganz normaler Gegenläufer Antrieb der nichts Inovatives hat. Gibt es auch zu Kaufen.
Ich baue gerade auch einen Gegenläufer Antrieb für einen Freund . Dabei braucht es nur einen Motor , da der beide Propeller per Reaktion versorgt.
Heist 1. Propeller an der Glocke und 2. Propeller am Statorhalter. Regler im Motor integriert. Alles Drehbar mit zwei Schleifkontakten , einer im Drehzentrum mit quasi null Moment , der zweite mit kleinem Radius drum herum. Reglersignel per miniempfänger neben dem Motorsteller , heben aber auch eine micro Bluetooth Koppelung in Arbeit oder ganz einfach ein dritter dünner Schleifring nur für das Signal. Der Zweite Motor entfällt völlig , die Leistung bleibt gleich da durch den Gegenlauf doppelte Drehzahl anliegt , halbe Windungsanzahlt doppelte Drahtstärke und erheblich Leichter.
Und für den Kuni. Jeder Gegenläufer Antrieb hat immer einen höheren Wirkungsgrad da Sturz und Zug entfallen was allein schon den Wirkungsgrad erhöht.

Happy Amps Christian
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Old 04-16-2020, 03:27 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Hi Ralph,
so ist es halt ein ganz normaler Gegenläufer Antrieb der nichts Inovatives hat. Gibt es auch zu Kaufen.
Ganz genau das habe ich doch geschrieben!
Lies einfach mal....
Mir geht es nicht um Innovation sondern um Zeitvertreib und Spaß auf dem extem niedrigen Niveau der Küchentischbastelei. Aber immerhin kommt das Ding zeitnah in die Luft.


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Originally Posted by CHX2 View Post
Ich baue gerade auch einen Gegenläufer Antrieb für einen Freund . Dabei braucht es nur einen Motor , da der beide Propeller per Reaktion versorgt.
Heist 1. Propeller an der Glocke und 2. Propeller am Statorhalter. Regler im Motor integriert. Alles Drehbar mit zwei Schleifkontakten , einer im Drehzentrum mit quasi null Moment , der zweite mit kleinem Radius drum herum. Reglersignel per miniempfänger neben dem Motorsteller , heben aber auch eine micro Bluetooth Koppelung in Arbeit oder ganz einfach ein dritter dünner Schleifring nur für das Signal. Der Zweite Motor entfällt völlig , die Leistung bleibt gleich da durch den Gegenlauf doppelte Drehzahl anliegt , halbe Windungsanzahlt doppelte Drahtstärke und erheblich Leichter.
Und für den Kuni. Jeder Gegenläufer Antrieb hat immer einen höheren Wirkungsgrad da Sturz und Zug entfallen was allein schon den Wirkungsgrad erhöht.

Happy Amps Christian



Naja, Schleifringe sind ja auch höchst innovativ....
Und bei der doppelten Drehzahl auch besonders zuverlässig.

Bin schon gespannt auf den Flugbericht!
Ist abzusehen, ob das maiden noch in 2020 oder erst in den nächsten jahren oder (wie zumeist bei Deinen Projekten) gar nicht passieren wird?



VG
Ralph
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Old 04-16-2020, 04:33 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Hi,
na die Bürsten laufen nur mit der halben Drehzahl am Statorträger , seh schon , führt zu weit . Och laufen tut er , die Flugplätze sind noch zu.

Happy Amps Christian
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Old 04-16-2020, 05:20 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Das Projekt geht weiter.



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Old 04-16-2020, 05:34 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by powercroco View Post
Such Dir bitte mal ein besseres Übersetzungsprogramm!
Wie ich oben schon geschrieben habe; das Modell ist SEMISCALE!
Wenn das original einen Kontraprop hat, kiregt das Modell auch einen.

Und schneller werden wird es nur, weil da 40% mehr Leistung als bei Kuni im Spiel sind.

Aus welchen Motoren man den Antrieb baut oder lieber einen fertig kauft, das ist in diesem Zusammenhang völlig egal.

Jetzt klar genug?
Translation:
Its only faster than a system with half the power.



Is that special?





OKON
Newsflash!
The RC Groups post is in English so maybe u need to check your understandings of English. Mine is very clear and yours is hardly as good as you think it is. He says it isnt for speed why he does it. This is what the man has said about his own plane so u better talk to him about it. We can all understand the posting at rc groups very clearly sir



And of course it matters what motors you use for the best performance. Better is better no matter how many you strap together.


Hi Chris
Hope you and the family are well. Don't worry I plan to question every CONTRA-DICTION as we can all read what he said.


Thank

Hubert
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Old 04-16-2020, 05:45 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Default WE ARE HERE POWERCROCO

Fantastic post, Very easy to tell fact from fiction when you bring the correct information.


Thanks again for an antidote.



We need a constant supply here as you can see there's nothing new here. I wonder what is the new style of winding Chris, since the 4020 are deemed as the "old style YY" Or was that translation wrong.



It also looks like the bell of the front motor rubs something this as well. The nacelle possibly?




Su Hermano
Hubert.


BTW what the speed report from this empiracle genius that loves to argue with real engineers. Load the double drive it in your abacus and show us how special it is. Just make sure to select real props!!!


I don't get it if it was for speed because winding a single to handle 160 amperes at 6 s lipo and weigh less than 620 grams should be possible for such an advanced machinist and motor builder.
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Old 04-16-2020, 05:52 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by 1BOHO View Post


OKON...



Ah, ja.

Da sind sie ja wieder:
die üblichen Unhöflichkeiten und fortwährenden Änderungen!

ERST DENKEN, DANN SCHREIBEN!
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Old 04-16-2020, 06:21 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Whats more rude than trying to deeply analyze everyone's project with bogus cal reports etc but wont post single number of his own to support this idea of improvement.


I knew there would be no numbers offered thanks for proving my point . Its why I asked. This project is cute photos with no real information on it's efficiency, construction, or even the speed of this plane that now "flies faster"



Good luck with it. But we like numbers here on what you do too not just inaccurate reports from Germany on well made US products. No consistency in any of your measuring sticks just consistent cover ups.


You trying to convince the pilots here that NEUMOTORS arent quality will never work. They fly them and the do quite well. You have about as much a chance of this as convincing a German Scorpion is better than Lehner. Maybe you dont realize that even in your own country NEU is held with high regard. I have used hks where upon inspection the stator had shifted and rubs the magnets. Great stuff I see upon inspection quite a bit. How is it rude posting the questions based on your photos. Does it not appear to you that the bell was rubbing something or are you blind?
Constant changing is part of progress so when will you evolve?


Thanks


It would have been nice if agent orange had also banned posting from there for 30 days in the us motor forums like you all do daily. Its certainly a virus in its own right.
"The Strange American"
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Old 04-17-2020, 02:55 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Hi,
Counterrotating drive with gearless reduction . Propeller turn halve speed of the motor speed.

Happy Amps Christian
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Old 04-17-2020, 10:17 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Ich finde, das:

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1BOHO View Post
"This project is cute photos with no real information on it's efficiency, construction.....
Good luck with it. But we like numbers here on what you do too not just inaccurate reports from Germany."

passt auch bestens zum letzten Beitrag von CHX2!
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Old 04-17-2020, 02:21 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Hi,
yes, well thought, as we know that Ralph Okon is the biggest Copyshop man who feed the Chinese Manufactory . So better show not to much and tell only the fact everybody can calculate by owen math.
Next motor with the small Lehner waighs the halve of the big Scorpion 50 Series and handle the same power and no brushes need.

Happy Amps Christian
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Old 04-17-2020, 03:01 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Alte Feindschaften soll man gut pflegen!
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