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Old 04-12-2010, 12:56 PM   #221 (permalink)
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I still stand by my "who needs more than 1 HS with a nitro engine" statement.
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Old 04-12-2010, 02:44 PM   #222 (permalink)
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I still stand by my "who needs more than 1 HS with a nitro engine" statement.
I have two HSs defined and use one or the other based on how I perceive the heli is handling under the current weather conditions.
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Old 04-12-2010, 02:46 PM   #223 (permalink)
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From my poor understand of nitro you have a limited powerband of engine RPM. I would think you ALWAYS want to operate inside the power band, set the HS according to the engine RPM and gear ratio. This way you always get the most power out of the engine. If you want to tame the heli you do it with swashmix or expo.
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Old 04-12-2010, 02:55 PM   #224 (permalink)
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I run a gov in normal and my 2 idle up conditions.
Normal is a reduced head speed of about 1800. This is to bring the heli up into a hover and make sure everything is working properly. It also verifies the gov is working...
This is on a 50 sized nitro
Idle 1 is 2000
Idle 2 is 2100
Both these RPMs are in the power window. Idle 1 is used when I want to fly around slow and controlled and and dont want all that head speed. Idle 2 is for rippin it up (as best I can anyway).

I also do this on my electrics by the way and I have seen many of the top guys have 2 RPM even on electrics. Bobby Watts is an example I have seen.

Now I know many electric guys use soft start and just come out of hold right into full RPM. First you cant do that on a nitro as you HAVE to throttle up. Even if you have a gov set for normal in wont kick in until you get close to RPM head speed. Thus you have to controll throttle up. Then again I don;t like to lift off at freakin 2100 RPM with a 50 and especially not a 90! I think lifing off at a low headspeed is just safe to do. Thus because this is the way I do it on a nitro, that is why I also do it on an electric so I do not have different patterns of using the radio on different helis.

My 3 cents.

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Old 04-12-2010, 03:04 PM   #225 (permalink)
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RPM on electrics is VERY different from nitro tho.
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Old 04-12-2010, 03:17 PM   #226 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HFG View Post
RPM on electrics is VERY different from nitro tho.
Yes I understand... But again I don't like to change my pattern and I like to come up into the hover at a reduced head speed even on an electric. It just seems safer and allows you to check the heli. I have seen many times where someone just flips out of hold and comes up to 3200 on a 450 on the ground only to have it explode because something was not right or something stupid like the gyro did not init properly and they lift off at 3200 and piro out of control (saw that just this weekend). Again just a personal preference.

Later when electric guys start flying nitros and have to do the full slow throttle up by hand, they to may decide to do that in electric just so things are the same. Maybe not I dunno. FYI this is one of the reasons I don't use soft start... So I throttle up just like my nitro.

Imagine if I did had a brain fart on my nitro and had it in idle 2 and flipped out of hold... Guaranteed boom strike and explosion! And I have also seen someone do that... They were so use to an electric and flipping out of hold directly to idle up that they forgot it was a nitro... Pretty spectacular to say the least

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Old 04-12-2010, 03:21 PM   #227 (permalink)
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Well since i have the option of switch assign ability on my 10CG ( i still hate you for making me spend money ) which i love, i have the back left 2 position switch as my normal/idle up switch. And the 3 position switch in front of that i have 3 HS sets (1900,2050,2100), but i always leave it in the 3rd position.
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Old 04-12-2010, 03:31 PM   #228 (permalink)
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You know you love that 10CG

I dumped the back switch and now just use the 3 position. Because I use other radios again I dont want to have to think about it so I make all my radios the same. For instance on my 9303 I moved the hold switch to the top front right since that is the only place it can be on the 10CG. When I first started flying the 10CG I fumbled many times for the hold switch and hit the freakin trainer switch because I was use to the 9303 with it in the top back right position. Now they are all the same

Anyway Most the time I too only use idle up 2 for the most part. But its nice to have the lower HS when you want it.

But back to the point. The MGP supports the gov with no extra channel needed. If your OK with the same head speed in normal, and idle ups, then it will work for you. And as pointed out. It's a "nice to have" for multiple head speed not a must have!

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Old 05-20-2010, 04:03 AM   #229 (permalink)
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Bobe can we define an on ,off switch for MGP and is it posibbel to get 5 different speeds (normal,idel1,2,3,4) from MGP ? ,Thanks a lot for your replay.
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Old 05-20-2010, 07:42 AM   #230 (permalink)
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Bobe can we define an on ,off switch for MGP and is it posibbel to get 5 different speeds (normal,idel1,2,3,4) from MGP ? ,Thanks a lot for your replay.
The gov only supports three head speeds. You have to use one of those head speed slots to have an "off" setting, leaving you with a maximum of two governed head speeds.
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Old 05-20-2010, 04:56 PM   #231 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheBum View Post
The gov only supports three head speeds. You have to use one of those head speed slots to have an "off" setting, leaving you with a maximum of two governed head speeds.
Thanks Bum for your replay but i was searching for the way which i can have my 3 diffferents speeds and meanwhile i can turn on & off MGP ,but as far as i underestand we can't do this with MGP.
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Old 05-20-2010, 06:13 PM   #232 (permalink)
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If you need all 3 speeds the only way to turn off MGP is the hold switch. Remember the gov will disengage when throttle stick is below 30% Since hold takes a motor to idle (throttle is well below 30%) it will cause the MPG to basically turn off.

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Old 05-20-2010, 06:21 PM   #233 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Finless View Post
If you need all 3 speeds the only way to turn off MGP is the hold switch. Remember the gov will disengage when throttle stick is below 30% Since hold takes a motor to idle (throttle is well below 30%) it will cause the MPG to basically turn off.
Good point. I was assuming the question was regarding running full-up without governor.
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Old 05-22-2010, 01:52 AM   #234 (permalink)
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Thanks Bob & Bum .
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Old 05-24-2010, 04:59 PM   #235 (permalink)
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I am having the same problem as two other posters.
The max temp after hovering shows 130c. I have the temp set at the default 105c. The mixture servo is running full rich all the time after it measures a temp rise from startup. In hover the engine is running very rich. The backplate is cool after landing.
Do you think my CSM temp probe is reading way off?
I have the probe just behind the glow plug installed with thermal epoxy. OS 61WC engine. I am thinking of just increasing my set temp, but afraid if probe is reading correctly I will cook the engine.
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Old 05-24-2010, 07:00 PM   #236 (permalink)
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I believe Aerospire reccomends thier temp probe? But yes to me it sounds like your probe is not reading the true temp.

Also the probe should be mounted between the fin set where the actual top of the head starts and should be touching that head area not just the cooling fins.

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Old 05-24-2010, 10:28 PM   #237 (permalink)
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Thanks for the reply Bob.

I used the probe you used in the video. I thought that would be better than trying to solder one together.

I have the probe mounted against the top of the combustion chamber. The 61WC has a rectangle shaped head with the glow plug at the top edge.

Do you think I should remove it and move it to the back of the cylinder to get a cooler reading or just use a higher temp setting? I know it’s not easy to tell someone to set the temp higher than normal. I’m just stuck in limbo (running slobbering rich and showing 130c) and need some advice.

Thanks for making your videos, I've learned a lot.

Rod
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Old 05-24-2010, 11:05 PM   #238 (permalink)
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Well maybe the motor's head runs cooler than a hyper? I don;t think it is bad to increase temperature with the idea that you don't lean it out too much. You can tune an engine normally yes? If so I would tune for performance, get the temp, and set it. Just what I would do.

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Old 05-24-2010, 11:44 PM   #239 (permalink)
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I have messed with the MGP a LOT and have it close to where I want it. I do not think any of this information can be generalized in any way, so i will give you specifics. every motor/heli/environment is different.

Vibe 50 with YS56 with Hatori Bobby Watts broken in.
Climate: Temp : from low 70's to 100 F, 90%+ Humidity

1. Mixture Control - As of last week removed all together after 8 month's of messing with it on YS50 and YS56. My theory is it would be fine in a more consistent climate. It relies on the premise that then engine runs best at a given head temp regardless of ambient. Which I believe is a flawed assumption in South Texas. With the Mixture turned off engine runs perfect 100% of the time. With it on I could get it running right, but as soon as climate changed, unless I adjusted the target temp in MGP, ran poorly. Remember that YS's are very sensititive to needle movements. Yes played with mixture servo endpoints, temp settings, gain, yada yada...

The Governor had 3D mode turned off, it's all normal mode, feed forward is 10%, Gain is turned up to 85%. 3D mode overspeeds too much for my taste. Limiter is probably fine on a 90 where you have power to spare, but on a 50, I need all the help I can get.
Low Throttle % is 25%, Throttle Setup is as good as I can get, 100% Low EP, 100% High, 90 deg arms. Idle Mixture is a little rich so when engine unloads it does not go lean.
Key Points:
Low Throttle % = 25%
Feedforward = 10%
Gain =85%
2050 RPM is what is best for this setup.

I have detailed notes on the entire Vibe 50 setup. PM me and happy to send as a word doc, unreadable in a post as it's all Outline Formatted
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Old 05-31-2010, 10:35 PM   #240 (permalink)
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I've set up my aero- governer and it what I thaought was correct, when i started up my trex 600 it idles fine, but as i throtle up after about 1/4 movement the rpms jump up, and if I add more thotle it shuts down??
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